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  1. #1
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    Streamlining Priest

    I've been a forum lurker for quite some time, finally chose to register in hope to share some pet peeves on the priest class. I've been playing priest since vanilla, and also leveled a druid and a mage to 80 (not yet removed them from deep freeze).

    I'm bothered with the different class mechanics currently involved with the priest gameplay, specifically the duct-taped feeling i get from Archangel/attonement (disc) and chakra (holy).
    These added mechanics, while certainly refreshing the priest gameplay, feels very "unblizzardy" : unnecessarily complex, too heavy on micromanaging...

    what's my point ?

    I'd like to see those priest mechanics evolve to some sort of cleaner stance-based approach that would encompass Archangel / Serenity / Sanctuary / Shadow in a neeto, easy as druid forms / warrior stances to figure out and switch. Of course each talents would empower the respective stance a bit more (again, druid or warrior as a reference)

    My two cents...



    (ps: usless posting on EU blizz class forums)

  2. #2
    Stood in the Fire Cerunnir's Avatar
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    Personally I love Chakra. It allow me to adjust my playstyle to certain situations. For example in fights where there is one phase of direct big damage to single targets I swap into heal chakra, and right before the AOE phase hits I kickstart AOE chakra. I was sceptical to chakra when it came out in 4.0, but once I learned to use it I slowly stareted to like it. Chakra is game defining for a priest. If your one of those that just stick to heal chakra all the time, then a priest is at best an average healer. But by using chakra properly priests become pretty awesome.

    They are streamlining chakra in the next patch, where they increase duration to 60 seconds while keeping the 30sec CD. This in addition to adding more spells to the activate chakra ability, so your not forced to use specific spells to start it up.
    Cerunnir - Frost/Blood Death Knight

  3. #3
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    I think the true strengh of the priest class is its ability to feel efficiently all healing duties and I love the flexibility chakra brings to our toolbox.

    I fully agree with you :The PTR changes, if they make it to live, are definitely a step in the right direction to reduce the micro-managing of the chakra state by allowing more spells to trigger/refresh it and to be "always on" througt duration/ cd adjustment.
    It's merely a step, but could'nt the flexibility wich we feel is the core strenght of the healing priest better be implemented througth going to a stance-based system ?


    Another (albeit on subject) consideration is that, from my point of view, anything that need to be macroed to be efficient is badly designed : I use a stopcasting/cancelaura/cast chakra macro to be able to switch quickly when needed.
    Last edited by mmocb64ab103c0; 2011-01-12 at 12:23 PM.

  4. #4
    Stood in the Fire Cerunnir's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by draxredd View Post
    I think the true strengh of the priest class is its ability to feel efficiently all healing duties and I love the flexibility chakra brings to our toolbox.

    I fully agree with you :The PTR changes, if they make it to live, are definitely a step in the right direction to reduce the micro-managing of the chakra state by allowing more spells to trigger/refresh it and to be "always on" througt duration/ cd adjustment.
    It's merely a step, but could'nt the flexibility wich we feel is the core strenght of the healing priest better be implemented througth going to a stance-based system ?


    Another (albeit on subject) consideration is that, from my point of view, anything that need to be macroed to be efficient is badly designed : I use a stopcasting/cancelaura/cast chakra macro to be able to switch quickly when needed.
    I guess I agree, they could just aswell make it into a stance with a 30 second CD. Personally I plan to save myself 2 talent points when 4.0.6 comes out. Taking 2 point from the chakra duration increasing talent, and putting it into something else.
    Cerunnir - Frost/Blood Death Knight

  5. #5
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    I've just picked up atonement/archangel and I've had to macro the hell out of it to get it usable. Too much hassle doing it all manually if you're swapping from smites to direct heals a lot otherwise.

  6. #6
    The Patient Marraphy's Avatar
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    I agree with you, ever since they added Chakra I felt it could have been better implemented as switchable stances.

    Evangelism/Archangel is a good DPS cd and passive damage for Shadow, but for Disc it doesn't have that much use. Perhaps if Archangel changed spells, like Tree of Life (maybe making Penance castable while moving, reducing the cast time of Smite and the cd of Holy Fire, perhaps even adding a movement speed increase), then it would be an awesome cd for Disc.
    85 Priest/72 Druid/85 Mage/24 Shaman/56 Paladin

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by draxredd View Post
    I'd like to see those priest mechanics evolve to some sort of cleaner stance-based approach that would encompass Archangel / Serenity / Sanctuary / Shadow in a neeto, easy as druid forms / warrior stances to figure out and switch. Of course each talents would empower the respective stance a bit more (again, druid or warrior as a reference)
    My two cents...
    The reason this was, and will not be implemented, is because the developers, esp Greg Street, hate persistent "forms" that they must balance around. Priests have been asking forever for a "holy form," citing both shadowform and treeform as precedent. The response to this what an unequivocal "NO," in which the developers stated that it is not their intention for a healer to be "in form" in order to be as good as another healer, which does not have a form. As such, treeform is now a CD and holyform was given cement shoes and dropped in the East River.

    While I like your idea, the developers have, in no uncertain terms, 100% shotdown the possibility of "stances" or "forms" for priests.

    ---------- Post added 2011-01-12 at 12:13 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Marraphy View Post
    Perhaps if Archangel changed spells, like Tree of Life (maybe making Penance castable while moving, reducing the cast time of Smite and the cd of Holy Fire, perhaps even adding a movement speed increase), then it would be an awesome cd for Disc.
    AA initially was designed to allow Penance to be castable while moving. It was on the tooltips during Alpha, however, the functionality was never implemented.

  8. #8
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    Pity, moving penance would really help the disc mobile healing problems.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ferin View Post
    I've just picked up atonement/archangel and I've had to macro the hell out of it to get it usable. Too much hassle doing it all manually if you're swapping from smites to direct heals a lot otherwise.
    Agreed. Same barely usable out of the box, had to macro create a cast target=targettarget smite macro to cast "through" the tank.


    While I can understand Blizzard's...stance about priest "forms" because they don't want to have all classes play the same, they nonetheless slowly drif toward this inevitable conclusion, which make lots of sens design-wise.

    This or give us a diablo3 monk spec through the discipline tree ^^

  10. #10
    eh...................................

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Ferin View Post
    Pity, moving penance would really help the disc mobile healing problems.
    i think they ran into a tech problem with this one. because penance snaps your camera

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by draxredd View Post
    I think the true strengh of the priest class is its ability to feel efficiently all healing duties and I love the flexibility chakra brings to our toolbox.

    I fully agree with you :The PTR changes, if they make it to live, are definitely a step in the right direction to reduce the micro-managing of the chakra state by allowing more spells to trigger/refresh it and to be "always on" througt duration/ cd adjustment.
    It's merely a step, but could'nt the flexibility wich we feel is the core strenght of the healing priest better be implemented througth going to a stance-based system ?


    Another (albeit on subject) consideration is that, from my point of view, anything that need to be macroed to be efficient is badly designed : I use a stopcasting/cancelaura/cast chakra macro to be able to switch quickly when needed.
    Why would you need to cancelaura Chakra? You can just move instantly into the next Chakra state from the other assuming the ability Chakra is off CD and you cast the appropriate spell to activate the new Chakra.

    Unless this is some uber-macro technique I do not understand, as my macros go as far as a shadowfiend+attack macro I copied from somewhere else :3
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  13. #13
    The only reason I can venture for why you would need a cancelaura macro is to be able to cast Chastise if you are currently in Serenity or Sanctuary.

  14. #14
    The Patient Marraphy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PlatedPriest View Post
    i think they ran into a tech problem with this one. because penance snaps your camera
    Nope. Do Halls of Origination, get on a camel, and cast Penance. It works fine, so I think the developers must of thought it would be OP or something.
    85 Priest/72 Druid/85 Mage/24 Shaman/56 Paladin

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Marraphy View Post
    Nope. Do Halls of Origination, get on a camel, and cast Penance. It works fine, so I think the developers must of thought it would be OP or something.
    Right, but player models function under different parameters than does a vehicle. For instance, if you are in a passanger seat on a siege engine, you can cast penance or mind flay or drain life or w/e channel you wish without it moving your camera.

    My guess is they did not want to have to make an exception on channeling rules just for disc priests, not because of balance, but from a coding perspective.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cerunnir View Post
    I guess I agree, they could just aswell make it into a stance with a 30 second CD. Personally I plan to save myself 2 talent points when 4.0.6 comes out. Taking 2 point from the chakra duration increasing talent, and putting it into something else.
    I would recommend against taking skill points out of the chakra lengthening talent.
    For me, I find that talent to be useful, as I can stay in one chakra state, yet have another ready to go and off CD. Since heal chakra is essentially free (as mana regens faster than the cost), I'll keep that up and be able to pop sanctuary in an emergency whenever I need to, rather than having to do so as soon as chakra state drops, risking being in one wrong state or the other for too long or too short.
    Furthermore, with the 4pc set bonus in T11 (chakra state grants static 540 spi), you always want to be in some state or another, with no downtime, even a second, in deciding what you need to do next. The 60 sec duration/30 sec cooldown, combined with lengthening talents, makes chakra a less clumsy mechanic, IMHO.

    Regarding OPs post, I think chakra and archangel DID streamline priests, giving them even more gameplay options while buuilding around a particular mechanic. I do not play disc, only holy as heals, though, so I cannot comment on atonement.

    Dark archangel, however, is badass. It boosts my DPS by leaps and bounds, and restores a ridiculous amount of mana (at 5 charges), especially considering we already have talented SW, shadowfiend, dispersion and hymn of hope to regain mana. Dark archangel is something you can build on and keep up, as well as your DoTs obviously, during a boss fight, making for a much more enriching gameplay experience. Not to mention the awesomeness of mind spike. How many times were u grinding low level quests or reps and just got sick of DoTting things up so mind flay would be worthwhile? Now we have a nuke for low HP targets in casual content and raiding (though it's expensive to use repeatedly).

    I say bravo to the priest changes.
    Although, perhaps "streamlining" is not the word I would use, thinking more deeply on the topic.
    I'll go with "enriching gameplay through more challenging mechanics."

    There are arguments, valid ones, in fact, to be made that the T11 4 pc set bonus favors holy, and that chakra state pigeonholes the way holy healers must heal, and that shadow DPS is still lacking, but, long term (short term nerdrage with nerfs to my toons' classes notwithstanding), I am yet to be disappointed with the changes Blizzard makes to keep WoW interesting.

    EDIT: Shadow Word - Death apparently must be typed due to the use of semicolon and capital "D" making a smiley face. WTF is this, AOL messenger?
    Last edited by Theotormon; 2011-01-12 at 08:33 PM.

  17. #17
    The Patient Marraphy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by [-Spiritus-] View Post
    Right, but player models function under different parameters than does a vehicle. For instance, if you are in a passanger seat on a siege engine, you can cast penance or mind flay or drain life or w/e channel you wish without it moving your camera.

    My guess is they did not want to have to make an exception on channeling rules just for disc priests, not because of balance, but from a coding perspective.
    They're just lazy then, we could really use that mobility... I wonder if anyone has formally asked them on the forums why they removed the talent
    85 Priest/72 Druid/85 Mage/24 Shaman/56 Paladin

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Marraphy View Post
    They're just lazy then, we could really use that mobility... I wonder if anyone has formally asked them on the forums why they removed the talent
    Prolly not, since the idea was scrubbed either during Alpha or during closed Beta, can't remember which.

  19. #19
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    They could just remove camera snap surely - like on most channelled AoEs. After all a shaman can cast channelled spells like earthquake while using spiritwalker's grace.

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Ferin View Post
    They could just remove camera snap surely - like on most channelled AoEs. After all a shaman can cast channelled spells like earthquake while using spiritwalker's grace.
    The omni-cast channel is coded differently than a directed-cast channel. Altering code like this is more difficult that it seems on the surface.

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