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  1. #41
    Personally I think Blizz should take heroism in all its forms away from casters and give it strictly to the melee classes that lack real CC
    warrior/dk/pally

    The reason being is most people consider melee dps hybrids to be a hindrance to any group because they take more damage and lack CC

    Or Blizz could make it exclusive to Enhancement shaman, Fury warriors just because it fits dual wield melee specs so perfectly.

  2. #42
    Think it would be more fitting for a healer, as a healer can see if they can manage to keep everyone up. Also this will bring teamplay into awrong direction I think.

  3. #43
    As a hunter, I wish they had not given corehounds ancient hysteria. I hate being a PuG with no shaman/mage, and the tank says "Hunter, pop bloodlust." Last I checked, I was SV. Perhaps the tank noticed the explosions and shadow dots I have been putting on targets. Perhaps not. But being asked to switch to a spec I have never wanted to play just for a buff is insane. Leave it shaman. They are the bloodlusty ones.


    You can't shake the Devil's hand and say you're only kidding.

  4. #44
    Not sure why Hunters are even brought up :P

    BM hunters shouldn't exist.

  5. #45
    The Patient
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yankhor View Post
    the idea is to remove sham/mage/tards heroism and give it to tanks.

    since it's no more useable in arenas, it won't crash any gameplay
    THIS and nothing else. Due to the fact that certain speccs get unique abilities the implementation would be VERY, VERY simple.

    @Blizzard: Learn to think in that way. ^^

  6. #46
    Quote Originally Posted by gogozmeq View Post
    It might look like a suggestion for a change, however I'm pretty sure it is unlikely to ever happen so I'd just like to see your thoughts on this.

    Why to give it to tanks? - well its all-know fact thats with Cata Blizzard brought in the idea of bring the player not the class so they gave hero to Mages and Hunters, however it's not impossible one of the classes to be lacking from the set-up, but there will always be a tank and a healer, so If either tanks/healers had Heroism instead of the 3 dps classes that have it now it would be better imo. I might be biased playing a tank myself and that's why I propose tanks but not healers, however it also suits the idea behind the tank better, yea fearless reckless frontline warriors(or paladins, druids, DKs ;pp), that at point can fanaticize his party, to turn the tide of a battle!
    More retard to use it some random time YAY
    That is the worst idea i ever saw

  7. #47
    I don't really see much point in changing it tbh. I mean I can't remember the last time I was in a raid group that didn't have a mage, hunter, or shaman. Plus the fact that it has been a shaman ability since before WOW started it really makes no sense taking it away from them. If groups needing the buff and not having it is such an issue, I think a LW drums would be a better solution then giving it to the tanks as a base ability.

  8. #48
    Coming from a mage, i agree, time warp is pants (shares a cooldown with bloodlust so its not like we can stack it or get 60 seconds of 30% haste...which would be mighty OP but lots of fun :P) the 85 ability should have been something more magey, like combat teleporting or something.

  9. #49
    Bring the player not the class? Umm sorry cata raid mechanics favor some classes more than others. The idea is that you don't bring a class because of buffs or debuffs you bring them because 1. the player is good 2. because their class in some way helps with the challenges of the fight. You should no longer be forced to bring people because of their buffs, but it is still necessary to have different classes (try a raid with all druids because they can fill all roles). I understand what you meant though, just a slight correction.

    Secondly, tanks do not and will never have lust/hero because it offers no distinct benefit to them beyond a short raid buff. Sure tanks contribute to DPS, but if you're speccing/gemming/enchanting for purely offensive prot in PvE you're wrong. That means tanks do not have it because its not part of their role. Now if you were to argue that all tanks should have a raid wide damage reduction like Divine Guardian I definitely agree.

    ---------- Post added 2011-01-13 at 02:45 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by skrump View Post
    Personally I think Blizz should take heroism in all its forms away from casters and give it strictly to the melee classes that lack real CC
    warrior/dk/pally
    Warrior have fear, pummel, and hamstring among other things that can be useful in PvE (you can intercept a mob, pummel, intervene a healer to silence ranged adds if you're good).
    DK has an interupt, silence, immobilize (depending on spec), snare effect, and deathgrip all of which are helpful.
    Pally has stun, interupt (soon to come to all specs), and I believe repent is a real CC among other things.

    I personally like having adds slowed so I can kite them thus negating all damage.

    Quote Originally Posted by skrump View Post
    The reason being is most people consider melee dps hybrids to be a hindrance to any group because they take more damage and lack CC
    You don't know what you're talking about because they're not a hinderence, they take no more damange, they do have tools that can be utilized, and they do large amounts of DPS with the right people controlling them.

    Quote Originally Posted by skrump View Post
    Or Blizz could make it exclusive to Enhancement shaman, Fury warriors just because it fits dual wield melee specs so perfectly.
    Rogues and DKs also DW chief.
    Last edited by Slavko; 2011-01-13 at 07:48 PM.

  10. #50
    Quote Originally Posted by Yankhor View Post
    the idea is to remove sham/mage/tards heroism and give it to tanks.

    since it's no more useable in arenas, it won't crash any gameplay
    TROLOLOL

    Win.

  11. #51
    Quote Originally Posted by Slavko View Post
    Secondly, tanks do not and will never have lust/hero because it offers no distinct benefit to them beyond a short raid buff. Sure tanks contribute to DPS, but if you're speccing/gemming/enchanting for purely offensive prot in PvE you're wrong. That means tanks do not have it because its not part of their role. Now if you were to argue that all tanks should have a raid wide damage reduction like Divine Guardian I definitely agree.
    First, heroism is a buff intended for raids so it doesn't really matter who pops it it's all the same, I just say it would fit better to the tanking role(personal opinion), moreover giving it to tanks would broaden the teamplay since tanks dont get much out of the haste buff, but it will show that the tank actaully sees when his party/raid is struggling and can react to it.

  12. #52
    Stood in the Fire Cypher0's Avatar
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    Wait...Hunters got a version of Heroism/Bloodlust too? What's it called?

    I seem to have missed it

  13. #53
    Quote Originally Posted by Cypher0 View Post
    Wait...Hunters got a version of Heroism/Bloodlust too? What's it called?

    I seem to have missed it
    One of their pets has an ability very similar to Heroism/Bloodlust.

    Let me just say...

    Bloodlust is a signature Warcraft 3 Shaman move.
    Should go play Warcraft 2, bro.

    Bloodlust. Ogre Magi
    Last edited by TTerminator999; 2011-01-13 at 09:45 PM.

  14. #54
    Just because you can do something absolutely ridiculous and asinine doesn't mean it should be done. Heroism is fine where it is. "Bring the player not the class" is a raving success, as 12 or whatever freaking druids on a world first kill clearly shows >.>, but there is no point in this nonsense. It's fine where it is and it doesn't need to be trivialized further.

  15. #55
    Quote Originally Posted by gogozmeq View Post
    First, heroism is a buff intended for raids so it doesn't really matter who pops it it's all the same, I just say it would fit better to the tanking role(personal opinion), moreover giving it to tanks would broaden the teamplay since tanks dont get much out of the haste buff, but it will show that the tank actaully sees when his party/raid is struggling and can react to it.
    Bloodlust/Heroism or Timewarp are intended as a cd to be used in an environment where haste will greatly enhance a player's abilities. That could be PvE or PvP (though it is now being removed from arenas). Because the game is more than 1 dimentional (There is PvP and PvE) it really does matter who has this ability.

    Moreover the tanking role is survivability. A tank's job is to hold threat, mitigate incoming damage, and to ensure that boss mechanics are followed so they and their raid remain alive. Haste does not help the tank's role at all. If anything the tank benefits the least from lust/hero. DPS can use their abilities more frequently, healers can cast more quickly, but tanks only get to increase their damage and perhaps threat generation. No where within the 30s of heroism does a tank increase their survivability except with out the help of another player.

    You're simply stating that tanks having lust/hero is more convenient and that's why they should have it, and you my friend are wrong.

    ---------- Post added 2011-01-13 at 04:54 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Alfador View Post
    "Bring the player not the class" is a raving success, as 12 or whatever freaking druids on a world first kill clearly shows
    I agree... but still sometimes a class has something essential to a raid. For example frost nova, ToTT/MD or a number of other spells that make things easier. Sure you can do it with just 1 class (though 12/25 isn't the entire raid), but its still easier with varied ones.
    Last edited by Slavko; 2011-01-13 at 09:56 PM.

  16. #56
    Quote Originally Posted by esmifra View Post
    AS a shaman I do not approve this.

    First mages and hunters now all tanks?!?! Best to remove bloodlust from the game altogether!
    haha..i dont wanna share QQ! just remove it from the game coz if it cant be mine and mine alone NO ONE should have it!
    really? that's the stance you're taking?

    and what's with saying remove it from mages and not replace it with anything. so we just don't get a lvl 85 skill? yeah, sounds really fair to me. by the way, all you shammys out there should be grateful that all we got was hero, originally it was heroism and sprint in one awsome megabuff that made you look kinda pointless.

  17. #57
    High Overlord Passive Apathy's Avatar
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    Truth be told there would be ZERO balance issues should it be given exclusivly to tanks... It is no longer a factor in any ranked PvP, meaning the only use for it would to benifit yourself and or others in an outside PvP area such as Tol Barad. Players in PvE content (Dungeons AND Raids) Cannot abuse the mechanics to give themselves an edge on the damage/healing meters just because it is a Party/Raid-wide buff and when one uses it, everyone gets the benifit. However, I do understand the lore issue behind removing it from shamans and as such, That might be one of the fiew reasons to not make this change. Once again... Should this change be made, it would be a HUGE step forward in the "Bring the player, Not the class" ideology Blizzard is pushing since you will ALWAYS have a tanking class if you're playing in a group setting.
    Last edited by Passive Apathy; 2011-01-13 at 10:06 PM.

  18. #58
    The Patient Eisaderfrau's Avatar
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    My first thought when I read this was "that's a dumb idea!"... upon further reflection however, I can see it.

    Implementation- Pretty simple actually... just include it as a L85 ability you get from choosing the tank spec of the 4 tanking trees (guess cats get it too, but w/e). That limits it to tanks mostly.

    Reasons-
    1. As stated, you have a tank. So you have hero regardless of class combo.
    2. Decent tanks know their threat. "Hero at the start of the pull" is more effective if the tank can hit it when they know they have a good enough threat lead to allow DPS the freedom to preform
    under heroism.

    Probably never happen, but not a dreadful idea.
    "And then, as though awoken from a blind stupor,the people of the internet realised that: no one gives a damn.
    And no damns were given." - Calon, MMO-Champion (source)

  19. #59
    First mages and hunters, now everyone else? Everyone wants a piece of our spell, a shaman spell. Oh btw Id love to wear plate and have charge, but Im a shaman so that wont happen, and neither will you getting bloodlust.

  20. #60
    Titan
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    No. It's of absolutely no use for us ever since it was changed from a pure damage increase. Not to mention Bloodlust really isn't something that should be thrown around mindlessly. Why not give it to every healing class instead, since you also always need healers as well, not to mention the cast speed reduction is good for them.
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