Pug tanks, oh great, i hat...... Wait what?

[LaplaceNoMa]

I'm lucky with rets listing themselves as tanks. Being a fire mage, I suffer a lot from tanks who don't know about aoe threat and tend to keep aggro on 1 target only, and even a simple LB explosion (not even mentioning any impacts/blastwaves/flamestrikes) instantly gives me aggro from all mobs except the one he's 'tanking'.

[Skutch]

I haven't really noticed any difference since I tank most of the time. A few have been lol who needs cc or we don't need to pull that trash, then wipe the group and cuss someome else out. Eventually they will either ragequit or research their class / tactics and get better.

[wolffish]

My only issue with random LFD tanks is when you queue up, get something like ToT or BRC on heroic and hear the tank say "What should I do, I've never been here, even on normal." Sorry, but if you can't put in the time to at least come check the place out on normal and have somewhat of a half ass idea what the bosses do, you need to gtfo. I will immediately vote kick said tank and have yet to see one not pass.

ALL dungeons should have to be completed on normal before you can queue for heroic...just sayin.

Not really going to help the DPS queue time now is it. Do you think he's going to check tactics, or requeue with an even lower opinion of pugs? Would it have killed you to spend a minute or so for each boss?

Even doing it on normal won't help, some of the mechanics you can kinda ignore on normal, and some aren't even present.

[Mammoth]

My only issue with random LFD tanks is when you queue up, get something like ToT or BRC on heroic and hear the tank say "What should I do, I've never been here, even on normal." Sorry, but if you can't put in the time to at least come check the place out on normal and have somewhat of a half ass idea what the bosses do, you need to gtfo. I will immediately vote kick said tank and have yet to see one not pass.

ALL dungeons should have to be completed on normal before you can queue for heroic...just sayin.

Or all the tanks and healers can queue as DPS until they know the tactics perfectly, because when a DPS fails there are two others to replace him.

[LaplaceNoMa]

Or all the tanks and healers can queue as DPS until they know the tactics perfectly, because when a DPS fails there are two others to replace him.

People like you are the ones claiming that 25 man is the 'real raiding' while 10 man is EZ mode. Amirite? Sorry for the offtopic, it's quite a hot topic atm anyway.

[Arsan]

Seeing as how I am the tank in my groups and how I always try to talk to the people and explain what to do any whatnot I guess I am an exception to the rules :P

[Sy]

Seeing as how I am the tank in my groups and how I always try to talk to the people and explain what to do any whatnot I guess I am an exception to the rules :P

same here!

i can't even understand how some tanks might want to not talk and play decently (if they can, that is.. but it's often just about motivation). it's just so much more fun if you have a group to chat and joke with, and to challenge yourself by playing as skilled as you can (which, especially as a tank, also means to help the others as much as possible), even if it's not necessary to get through the dungeon.

[Creature]

I'm still here, running 2 or 3 heroics a day. I've had BiS pre-raid gear for weeks now, and JP capped as well. And yes, this sounds like a back patting, but:

Every group I am in, I always make sure the first things I say is "Hullo!" (Kender are funny)
Before a heroic boss pull I ask if people know it yet, and if not I explain in detail and ask if there's any questions left.
If people want an achieve I'll explain how to get it, and if we skip it I will explain that as well.
Markings are setup by me, with an explanation ("These guys shoot their arrows and target random members with Aimed Shot. Since I can't silence them, I'd prefer them to be hexed. The hex target will be {triangle}.")

You know, it doesn't hurt that much to type. And sure, sometimes I take a full 5 minutes to explain a boss. But I have so far only given up on TWO heroic dungeons (as far as I recall) because they were just horribad.

[Deleted]

just a thought.
The long queues have made ppl reroll their hybrid char into a tank, instant queueing is pwn!
Me for example i've aöways been healing on my druid, but when they frikin destroyed the whole idea of druid "hots-movement-hots ie funny healing" to something "panicy WTF WTF, my hots dont give any substancial healing". I changed into a MOFO tank. Tanking isnt that hard if you cap the IQ of a 14 year old and dont just look at you dps, cooldowns or whatever some ppl are looking at while playing.
Took me about 3 dungeons on the way up to grasp the concept of looking on everyones position, type of mob etc etc.
So with these parameters above, it's not hard do be a decent to good tank..

AND im friendly too..

[Freshouttajail]

where have all the egotistical horribly skilled tanks gone?

They ninja'd enough dps gear to queue as DPS or BG in pve gear now.

[Mammoth]

My only issue with random LFD tanks is when you queue up, get something like ToT or BRC on heroic and hear the tank say "What should I do, I've never been here, even on normal." Sorry, but if you can't put in the time to at least come check the place out on normal and have somewhat of a half ass idea what the bosses do, you need to gtfo. I will immediately vote kick said tank and have yet to see one not pass.

ALL dungeons should have to be completed on normal before you can queue for heroic...just sayin.

Or all the tanks and healers can queue as DPS until they know the tactics perfectly, because when a DPS fails there are two others to replace him.

People like you are the ones claiming that 25 man is the 'real raiding' while 10 man is EZ mode. Amirite? Sorry for the offtopic, it's quite a hot topic atm anyway.

I think you were missing my sarcasm. It doesn't take long to explain tactics to a tank or anyone else. Its just a hell of a lot more noticeable when the tank doesn't know what the tacts are. Even if you do normal, it doesn't explain the HC tactics to you.

I don't see what 10 and 25 man raiding has to do with it to be honest. At the moment I see 25man is easier, as I expected it was going to be, because you have more versitality. Previously 10man was meant to be easier and thus a stepping stone into 25mans. This easy version of the raid no longer exists. I hope that clears up my opinion of 10 and 25man raids for you Laplace.

[sinofasin]

i've been getting tanks who are over 170k for the past 2 weeks, yes, every single week, kinda cool thou no im not saying high hp = pro but they are generally skilled and knows what they are doing. that's just me thou.

[Desminn]

they are still there...but the numbers of bads are thining, or at least being noticed less. due to both the difficulty weeding them out and the dungeons being known by most people now. also people have more gear now so things go a lil more smoothly. but every once in a while youll find a bad.

just the other night i had a paladin tank in my Hc GB. i inspect him (like i do most tanks in heroics) he has some nice gear...the only problem is all this nice gear is BoE epics/blues that is ungemmed and unenchanted. the rest of his gear.....pvp/ret stuff (about half n half blue/green) -_-

i asked him if he just went to the AH and bought some gear then made his OS prot for fast ques? he just laughed and proceded to get his face pummeled /vote to kick.

[Deleted]

Well I agree it seems there are more skilled tanks (compared to the 1st weeks/WotLk).
But today when none of my guildies were online I had to pug and this epic tank was blaming me (Resto Shammy) for not healing thru the shatter on the 3rd boss in Stonecore.. So yea, they're still there

[chocho]

'm lucky with rets listing themselves as tanks. Being a fire mage, I suffer a lot from tanks who don't know about aoe threat and tend to keep aggro on 1 target only, and even a simple LB explosion (not even mentioning any impacts/blastwaves/flamestrikes) instantly gives me aggro from all mobs except the one he's 'tanking'.

Quick reply to this message

perhaps you need to try tanking , and get to know what we know as rage starvation, other than dks and paladins , warriors and bears need a few secs. now this is from a bear perspective , bear tankage is no longer swipe and u have 100 % of threat in all mobs, swipe is doing crappy damage, have a cooldown, trash aswell , so if u go and blow it up then yes this is what happens. And dont lie to me , i promise you , you dont even wait 10 secs till tank has damaged all the mobs, you put LB right off the bat :P

[Deleted]

Yeah I had a tank who queued for HoO HC and litrally just ran in... he said "Oh, thought it was normal" and left

guess I jinxed my chances by making this thread

[chocho]

I don't see what 10 and 25 man raiding has to do with it to be honest. At the moment I see 25man is easier, as I expected it was going to be, because you have more versitality. Previously 10man was meant to be easier and thus a stepping stone into 25mans. This easy version of the raid no longer exists. I hope that clears up my opinion of 10 and 25man raids for you Laplace.

that cake is a lie . while wiping at 9 % on cho gall 25 man , our guildies made a 10 man and basically spent 2 wipes on it, then face rolled it.
now we have to wait till we unlock heroics, but well everything is working as intended, obviously 10 mans will be a bit more strict but if10 man guilds find it too hard they can always go 25 man heroics.

---------- Post added 2011-01-18 at 04:08 PM ----------

Yeah I had a tank who queued for HoO HC and litrally just ran in... he said "Oh, thought it was normal" and left

guess I jinxed my chances by making this thread

that is totally not an issue , he prolly made a mistake like all of us and its even better than he left. would u like to be wiping instead of that? :P

[Darsithis]

I think it is because we're starting to learn that the world doesn't revolve around us any more! Speaking as a tank, it doesn't matter how uber awesome I am (and I consider myself to be pretty damn skilled, though not the top tank ever) - if everyone isn't pulling their weight, the group fails. Simple. Everyone has to do their job, and it means that the DPS are just as important in the group as I am. In fact: I rely on them to CC and watch it in case it breaks. I rely on them to kite adds or move out of fire, or watch their threat. I expect they know the mechanics and do all they can to keep things running smoothly.

So when you meet a tank in a PuG or a heroic, recognize that you're helping them do their job by doing yours well

[Borakh]

I think the OP’s perception stems from the way Dungeon Finder composes groups, based on average item level. If you are not skilled and/or well prepared and try to pug heroic instances as tank, you will fail. Meaning: You will not down any bosses, ever. At this point in the game it’s already the case that even if you are willing to learn, people are not patient, will refuse to explain a boss properly, and will quit the group after 2 or 3 wipes. Therefore, you will not be able to get ilvl 346 gear. Therefore, a bad tank will either start queuing as DPS, or stagnate around ilvl 333 (maybe a bit more with reputation rewards).

I suspect the OP is currently raiding and will be mostly in purples. Dungeon Finder will group him with equally well-geared people. People at that level of gear who queue as tank will be good tanks. You will meet the bad tanks back when you start gearing your next alt.

[Pascal]

I think the OP’s perception stems from the way Dungeon Finder composes groups, based on average item level. If you are not skilled and/or well prepared and try to pug heroic instances as tank, you will fail. Meaning: You will not down any bosses, ever. At this point in the game it’s already the case that even if you are willing to learn, people are not patient, will refuse to explain a boss properly, and will quit the group after 2 or 3 wipes. Therefore, you will not be able to get ilvl 346 gear. Therefore, a bad tank will either start queuing as DPS, or stagnate around ilvl 333 (maybe a bit more with reputation rewards).

I suspect the OP is currently raiding and will be mostly in purples. Dungeon Finder will group him with equally well-geared people. People at that level of gear who queue as tank will be good tanks. You will meet the bad tanks back when you start gearing your next alt.

Actually, the dungeon finder tries to mix and match players. It tries to put some badly geared people with better geared people to give the ones on the lower end a chance. If it constantly grouped badly geared players with badly geared players, they'd pretty much be fucked 9/10 times.

It's been that way since WotLK unless they changed it. You could really tell in WotLK because you'd get people with greens and one epic and some quest blues doing 2000 dps when you were H ICC geared.