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  1. #1

    Falsely Accused of Scamming

    Has anyone else had this happen to them? I searched on the net but couldn't find anything.

    Last night I had the unfortunate experience of being falsely accused of scamming another player. I made the mistake of responding to a persons request for enchanting in trade. My main has over 50k gold so I don't need to do this I was just being helpful. I enchant the guys first item for a tip then he spends several minutes gathering mats for a second item to be enchanted from the bank/AH. I wait for him. He gets pissed because I refuse to enchant this item without another tip. He then wants his original tip back and accuses me of a scam. I refuse and laugh it off. He then says he is going to report me and proceeds to say some nasty things about me in trade. I ignore it and do the mature thing of not responding. He was in one of those high levels in a leveling guild so no one cares what he has to say anyways. I log out shortly after and about an hour later I have 2 emails from blizzard that I have never received before. The first was informing me that my tip was being removed since it was acquired by scamming and the second is an email that I was being put on a warning period for "scamming" and told I should read the terms of service and fair play. I was shocked by this, I've been playing over a year and have never had something like this happen. I contact blizzard about this and they are refusing to return my minuscule tip and are continuing to call me a scammer and telling me to read the terms of service.

    This whole incident has completely shocked me. I felt like this kid just whined to blizzard and they just sided with the first story they heard and without even speaking to me. The whole manner in which blizzard handled this was very unprofessional and insulting to me. I guess the lesson is to never deal with anyone over trade channel again. Just keep it exclusive to the AH and if someone accuses you of scamming report them first. A lesson I have come to learn is that people who want basic enchants in trade only want something for free. Legit raiders have guild hookups to do there enchants.

    But back to my original question, has anyone else has a situation similar to this?
    Last edited by HateFail; 2011-01-31 at 10:53 AM. Reason: Maybe I wasn't clear. I gave the kid his mats back.

  2. #2
    He gets pissed because I refuse to enchant this item without another tip.
    That's why you got stuck with the scamming.
    From Blizzards end it looks like you were scamming someone for mats and money.

  3. #3
    If I have to wait around several minutes while the jackass gather mats I am going to demand another tip. There was no reason blizz should have stolen my first tip from me.

  4. #4
    Deleted
    Ticket a GM and when you have one tell them to look at there log's.

    they log a stupid amount of stuff im sure if they went through it they would see the whole story etc.

    But yer in general dont do anything for anyone in general just keep it in guild or AH. easier

  5. #5
    Then you should have given his mats back?
    That is if you kept them.
    If not then you should contact Blizzard and let them know what happened.
    Blizzard didn't steal anything anyways as you so eloquently put it.
    They were merely covering for something that could be going wrong.

  6. #6
    Instead of posting it here, just ticket your version of the story to a GM.
    GMs make mistakes too.

  7. #7
    You say you don't need the gold; but got uppity about the need for another tip.. seriously? a tip is a gratuity.

  8. #8
    So he gave you the mats and you kept them and didn't enchant his stuff because he wouldn't give you a tip? Sounds like scamming to me (if that is what happened).

  9. #9
    I gave the jerk his mats back. He demanded his tip for the first enchant back. The whole issue is in regards to the tip not mats. I spoke to a GM and I was told I had to do everything through email with account administration. The whole thing was handled very unprofessional by blizzard.

    At this point I am on my sixth email with them. I don't even care about the tip anymore I just want an apology for their conduct and a removal of the scammer label on my account now.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by HateFail View Post
    But back to my original question, has anyone else has a situation similar to this?
    No, because I don't scam.
    Stop scamming.

    Also, a tip is a tip. It's not required. Otherwise it's a service and a price.
    What if he intended to tip you 1s? Ever tried to not tip at a restaurant? Not tip the guy who carries your luggage?
    It's not nice, but they won't keep your luggage or kick you out of the restaurant.
    Last edited by lyom; 2011-01-31 at 10:46 AM.

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by HateFail View Post
    I gave the jerk his mats back. He demanded his tip for the first enchant back. The whole issue is in regards to the tip not mats. I spoke to a GM and I was told I had to do everything through email with account administration. The whole thing was handled very unprofessional by blizzard.

    At this point I am on my sixth email with them. I don't even care about the tip anymore I just want an apology for their conduct and a removal of the scammer label on my account now.
    Wouldn't call it a tip as it's clearly a fee as you describe it.
    If it was a tip, he'd have any right to call it back because he was unsatisfied by your attitude. The costumer is always right.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by awayfromlife View Post
    You say you don't need the gold; but got uppity about the need for another tip.. seriously? a tip is a gratuity.
    So when you go to restaurants you don't tip? A tip amount isn't a fixed price but society and even wow has made tipping something of an informal requirement.

    ---------- Post added 2011-01-31 at 06:50 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by lyom View Post
    No, because I don't scam.
    Stop scamming.
    How is asking for a tip a scam? A gave the middle schooler his mats back and blizzard confiscated his first tip. So in the end he got a free enchant.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by HateFail View Post
    He gets pissed because I refuse to enchant this item without another tip. He then wants his original tip back and accuses me of a scam.
    He was in one of those high levels in a leveling guild so no one cares what he has to say anyways
    .

    Ignoring the blatant annoyance I have with those 2 comments. >_>

    There's obviously more to this story than you're telling.

    However, IIRC, The fact you called it a "tip" means it is optional. Therefore, by threatening to not enchant without another tip, you were, by the rules of blizzard, just due to that one word, scamming. You were offering a free service, with tips appreciated, but forcing people to pay a fee, thus, it was not a tip, as you had stated it was. Again, just a bad choice of words.

    Now, if you had said "My fee PER ENCHANT is ___" It'd be different. There's also the chance you are not telling the whole story, and he in fact gave you the enchanting mats for the 2nd enchant, and you refused to enchant it without a tip, then logged out with the mats. And of course, the chance that you are telling the truth. However, considering the removal of funds from an account requires a regular GM escalate the ticket to a more senior officer, I'd have to say that you are not telling the complete story.

    TLDR; Either you're lying, or you were simply caught with a poor choice of words. Tip = Voluntary. Fee = Required.

  14. #14
    I have said this twice already I gave the kid his mats back before it got heated.

  15. #15
    Did you inform him of the fee you were charging for your service before you enchanted anything for him? If not, you were doing a bait and switch. That's scamming, pure and simple.

    Tip is a voluntary extra payment, you cannot ever DEMAND to get one. If you do it's called a "fee" and you need to agree it beforehand.

  16. #16
    1. Never deal with people in trade unless THEY have something you want or are offering an unusually large payment for your services due to hurry/it being late/impatience.
    2. The AH is a goldmine for people who know how to use it, by offering your services through trade you open yourself up to people like him and worse, plus you LOWER the profit you could be making.
    3. If you ever do anything for anyone you don't know, make sure to clearly spell out the conditions of your trade. I know it may sound silly but it would prevent getting accused of scamming some cheap butthole. Never call it a tip, demand a fee. I know it may seem a little weird to demand a 2g fee for some lowbie enchant when you're sitting on a lot of gold but it's a matter of principle. You leveled the profession, you acquired the recipe, you are taking time out of your day to help someone, so it is completely unreasonable to expect you to do this for free. So even a small fee is a token of transaction because you aren't a charity.

    Get used to the fact that not everyone in this game is just trying to be nice and have fun, unfortunately. Some people are extremely self-absorbed and expect everything to be handed to them for free. When they don't get their way they whine and accuse you of every sin. Hopefully your interaction with them will be limited to this one time. Good luck!

    P.S. And all the people defending this kind of behavior from the whiner in trade, just remember: next time YOU need a gem cut or an item enchanted and noone answers you, it's because of people like him. So go ahead and give out the thank yous where they are due.
    Last edited by Nanotech; 2011-01-31 at 11:02 AM.

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Siton View Post
    Wouldn't call it a tip as it's clearly a fee as you describe it.
    If it was a tip, he'd have any right to call it back because he was unsatisfied by your attitude. The costumer is always right.
    Wtf?? Just wtf? I am surprised by peoples attitude here. Tip, fee, whatever, call it what you will. If you charge someone for doing something for you or they freely hand over a tip then you can't just come back later and expect it back. But do try that in real life though, go to a restaurant, eat there, tip them, then come back a few hours later, eat again and then demand your tip from your first visit back. See how well that works for you.

    If he did infact say nasty things about him in trade as well he should report that. I think this should be a very clear case if a GM actually spent time looking at it, but I doubt the GM that did the original work spent much time. Also the guy who reported it probably twisted the agreement in his favor to make it seem like it was a scam. The sad fact is that there are shitty GMs out there, I've noticed this before myself. You can bring the same case up to two different GMs and get completely different replies.

    You should keep pushing customer services though, I would also have filed an ingame ticket against the other guy for harassment or whatever. If he publically insulted you in trade then you should report him for that, make sure to include the time he did it at so the GMs can find it easily.

    And next time make sure you agree upon everything clearly with people you trade with. That way if they report you there will be chat logs to prove that you were in the right. Even though having the scammer label on your account will probably not work in your favor if you get into any further problems.

  18. #18
    Deleted
    He gets pissed because I refuse to enchant this item without another tip
    Tip = Optional.
    Fee = Not Optional.

    Unfortunately in this case, you were the one in the wrong. You offered a free service, and then when it comes to making the enchant you refused to provide this free service. which means (even though i find this a harsh choice of words) in that case it could easily have been considered a scam.

    I enchant the guys first item for a tip
    If you asked him to pay a fee then that would be fine, however you made him pay a tip. Whether it was just the choice of wording being bad and it was just a simple miss-understanding is a different matter. Blizzard in this case was well within the rights to take said tip away from you.

    All i can suggest is just suck it up to experience and make sure you start using the word fee instead of tip to prevent any miss-understandings in the future.

    Edit: I am not sticking up for the guy from trade, he does sounds like a bit of a prick. I am only saying that it was your choice of wording that let you down.
    Last edited by mmoc3ece278ef7; 2011-01-31 at 11:07 AM.

  19. #19
    Deleted
    If you're demanding a tip, it's not a tip, it's a fee. If you're charging a fee, you need to let your customers know what that fee will be per enchant.

    He probably assumed your first fee was for both enchants. The issue here is a failure to comunicate.

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Howlrunner View Post
    A tip is a gratituity yes, but its usualy given in return for a service provided as a gesture of thanks.
    Someone giving up their free time to provide a service for you when they don't need to is usually worthy of a tip in my opinion, its not demanded usually, but is at times expected.
    If you don't specify a fee or just say "tip", then you're offering the service for free. Starting to demand a fee in the middle of a transaction is then clearly scamming - bait-and-switch.

    Personally if I expect to be paid for my service I advertise that up front and agree it with the customer. Sometimes I don't bother because the fee would be so small that it makes no difference to me, and then I don't expect anything except maybe a little goodwill.
    Last edited by Brett Skullcrack; 2011-01-31 at 11:09 AM.

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