Okay, Cata in my eyes:

[Knough]

Very little PvP here, i suck at it (no "he sucks at PvP, his argument is therefore as redundant as DK PvP in vanilla" or some stuff long lost.. comments please)

Hey, something just occurred to me, wanted to see what you guys thought:
Blizzard is a great company, nearly all of us here play their games, but now with the 1-60 changes and new end-game, is this not how a new player finds it, if the have no RL friends to accompany them:

1-10 try out the game, good? hey, talents and Bg, cool
10-20 same as above, but with more new stuff
20-60 made a bit of a dedication, and this process is a lot less painful now, so the player heads off
60-79 BC and WotLK, new stuff, nice, maybe a raid in BC?
80- might try out some dungeon, raids, wow, this is nice and easy and FUN PuGing, people return here from cata for some reason?
80-84 WHOA?! this is crazy awesome, hard and cool, too awesome to give up on, i CANNOT wait to see how it is when i start getting geared and do more PuGs!
85- erm, okay, blizzard shot me straight into endgame, i had loads of fun here, i enjoyed trying out things like this, but this is crazy? yeh i know about CC and stuff, the tooltips showed me, but this is just... why? why do all the speed leveling, full of anticipation, for this "end-game"? this is not a game, this is a grind!


From a relatively decent players view (reads tooltips, explores talents and stuff), is this a bit corrupted? or will the new patch (tomorrow for me) make this less of a grind so i do Cata stuff, not the holiday dungeon, argent tournament dailies (aiming: crusader), and alts?

[Trispec]

If you think endgame is a grind this isn't the game for you.

[Zka]

After a couple of dozen heroics you are ready for raiding. Then you don't need to log in for anything but that (if you like the endgame). How is that a grind?

[Knough]

If you think endgame is a grind this isn't the game for you.

not a compete grind, but "HC, HC, HC, get some gear from somewhere else, HC, HC," seems fine, unless HC=Long time of inconsistently skilled players, with generally at least 1 player who is acting up, and the getting gear is just to improve 1/5 of the groups.
But hey, you're horde, apparently, so you dont matter :P

---------- Post added 2011-02-08 at 09:00 PM ----------

After a couple of dozen heroics you are ready for raiding. Then you don't need to log in for anything but that (if you like the endgame). How is that a grind?

because a couple of a dozen, assuming you are using them properly, =2 (couple) x12 (dozen) 24 HCs, and i PuG, as the guild i am with, and will stay with, isn't the type to wait for me, as i am generally on no coherent playing pattern, so 24 HCs is pretty hard, and btw, i am 1 ilvl off raid ilvl, and with buying anything serious (gear wise, not including gems or stuff), so i do that, but its just not as fun, and this isnt my perspective, as much as the one a friend of mine has, i recruited him (not RaF), and he has described it almost as it is there. Just my 2 Copper

[Zka]

Why do you need a playing pattern to clear heroics which take 30-120min depending on your gear and skill?
Also, how do you expect to be able to raid if you have no playing pattern?

[kel]

i agree with not liking 'end-game'

[Knough]

Why do you need a playing pattern to clear heroics which take 30-120min depending on your gear and skill?
Also, how do you expect to be able to raid if you have no playing pattern?

no, as in my guild, if they do schedule HC randoms, do it without me included in the time location, as i play different times, and i expected to be able to raid via pug-ing, no playing pattern doesnt matter if i can pick up group and go, but that seems a long way a way, PuG ing

[papajohn4]

If you think endgame is a grind this isn't the game for you.

this game is for everyone that pay it.There is not a trial to 85 level.Also whoever pay it have the right to tell what he likes and what not, and how he would like to see it.Only in Fascism people don't have rights to say their opinion and to criticize.

also since this game is not produced by you, you cannot say for whom it is or not.

P.S. I offend to the post and not to the person actually written it.i just read this same post again and again and again in every forum