Demonology: Basics

[Deleted]

Hello. I recently decided to make demo as mine sec. raiding spec. But to be honest, I don'n know anything about being demo.
So can someone tell me basics. Proper rotation, check mine build/suggest better build (sugardemon is mine char name), what glyphs to use, what which armor to use, when to use metamorphosis and so on.

Thank you for your help.

[Emanuel095]

http://elitistjerks.com/f80/t110366-...4_0_6_updated/

[gherkin]

Demonology is entirely based around not being basic. No matter what I type, short of a full guide, I will miss something and you will suffer as a result.

Read the full guide, then come back if you have questions about specific parts of it.

[Thellamat]

I have a question about when you use your Meta on boss fights. I've been saving mine for an optimal time in a fight when my immolation Aura would be useful along with shadowflame. On the other hand it sometimes feels like I'm wasting possibly another Meta or 2 throughout the fight by not popping it as soon as it comes up at the risk of not having it up when adds spawn or when you can get close to a boss. Also i feel like since the patch my dps is struggling a bit. I was only pulling 13-14k dps in BWD 25 man last night.
my armory is Thellamat on Kel'thuzad. any help would be appreciated.

[gherkin]

You should time your initial Meta with your Demon Soul, but use it on cooldown after that (unless the encounter is Maloriak and your green phase is difficult). Waiting to use meta is a dps loss, but if you see Demon Soul coming off cooldown you might want to wait on Immolation Aura.

Never wait on meta.

[Thellamat]

So is it worth blowing your first Meta even if you can't get close to the boss for immolation aura? Also as far as Demon Soul is concerned Ive been using the succubus on most fights and her demon soul is kinda lackluster so ive been trying to use it during meta to get the dmg buffs to stack. I'm guessing reguardless of pet that's probably the best time to use it anyhow. I wish i could just use Felguard for everything

[gherkin]

Think of immolation aura as a dessert. Same with Shadowflame.
Meta itself is your meat and potatoes. Meta = MEAT

[Thellamat]

Thanks for all the info. The new guild i joined had asked if i could go Demo for the SP buff considering they already have a destro lock. I guess im just stingy with cooldowns. Ill have to start using it as soon as its up. Im guessing if you use a volcanic potion right before a pull and use Meta and Demon soul right away all 3 should be up again around the same time.

Also now that they decreased the ranged on hellfire is it still worth trying to hellfire the adds on Magmaw? I tried it last night and I was pretty close to them and still couldnt get the whole group of them to take the damage, any closer and id get infected. I hate to use RoF being demo but it might be easier and hit more of them.

[Jessicka]

Never wait on meta.

Unless you have Theralion's Mirror, then you get a timer to watch the ICD and judge for yourself whether it's worth waiting for the proc. Very often it will be, and omg is it awesome now.

Also, hold your Demon Soul until you've stacked your DoTs and stuff and onto spamming Shadow Bolts, otherwise it's time wasted (assuming you're using the Succy as well you should on all but about 3 fights).

[ultimar235]

You should time your initial Meta with your Demon Soul, but use it on cooldown after that (unless the encounter is Maloriak and your green phase is difficult). Waiting to use meta is a dps loss, but if you see Demon Soul coming off cooldown you might want to wait on Immolation Aura.

Never wait on meta.

I don't really agree here entirely.

I mean imagine the boss is at 35% and meta is ready is 10 seconds, you would pop that straight away? Decimation is when demo actually does good damage so surely it better to wait even if it's 30 seconds for 25% to maximize your decimation damage? At 35% there is slim chance that meta will be ready again before the boss is dead because a lot of classes have executes.

I think there are plenty of situations where you could delay meta to time it with phases or bloodlust, etc. The trick is to just not wait too long. If you wait too long then pop meta just because you waited too long then you'll lose dps. You just really need to know the mechanics of the fight and figure the best way to meta.

[daethINC]

With Meta being our "meat and potatos" wouldnt http://www.wowhead.com/item=58183 be a must have because of the mastery and the on use effect? Have another buff we could time with Meta...

[Meejum]

With Meta being our "meat and potatos" wouldnt http://www.wowhead.com/item=58183 be a must have because of the mastery and the on use effect? Have another buff we could time with Meta...

Its good, and sits at 7th on the list currently. The only non-heroic raid trinkets ahead of it are the DMC:V, JC trink and the Bell. Leaving raid trinkets out, its the 3rd best thing you can get without stepping into a raid. And yes, when I get this I will most likely macro it to meta.

The fact that mastery is awesome during meta phase, and just so-so outside of it, stops it from really being drool worthy.

[daethINC]

Its good, and sits at 7th on the list currently. The only non-heroic raid trinkets ahead of it are the DMC:V, JC trink and the Bell. Leaving raid trinkets out, its the 3rd best thing you can get without stepping into a raid. And yes, when I get this I will most likely macro it to meta.

The fact that mastery is awesome during meta phase, and just so-so outside of it, stops it from really being drool worthy.

what makes Bell better then this i dont get it......with crit being so far down the list

[Thellamat]

Right now I'm using DMC:Volcano and stump of time. Id only replace stump once i get a few more pieces with hit on it, Im at cap now and have nothing else to reforge into hit. I did Council in BoT tonight and i started using Meta right at the start along with a int pre-pot and my dmg did jump up a little, esp the initial burst dmg while in demon form. Also i do save my demon soul while in meta til after i cast everything else. Only wasted demon soul time would be when renewing dots and shadowflame. I still fell like my dmg is low but maybe im just too used to playing destro. I just see that im getting blown away by other classes now. Kinda sucks a little.
Also is the Bell really that great for Demo with all that crit on it? I think i'd rather have the Mirrior or Soul Casket instead along with the DMC.

[vo1os]

Think of immolation aura as a dessert. Same with Shadowflame.
Meta itself is your meat and potatoes. Meta = MEAT

In addition you can time it with trinkets. Meta + demon soul + trinket procs = WIN

For example, your meta and DS are ready, but the trinket timer is showing 30. Wait about 15 seconds then use meta, after 15 second you will gain the prock then use DS, but not later than 20 second of meta left.
Same with Immolation - use it on proc, but not later then 16 second of meta left.

For procs timing TellMeWhen is a great addon.

[Jenerena]

Decimation is when demo actually does good damage so surely it better to wait even if it's 30 seconds for 25% to maximize your decimation damage?

Decimation doesn't do much more damage than before 25%. I've looked at logs before and my DPS under 25% hardly changes from what it was before 25%. However by saving meta we're stacking multipliers, so I would say it's worth it.

---------- Post added 2011-02-11 at 08:58 AM ----------

I think there are plenty of situations where you could delay meta to time it with phases or bloodlust, etc. The trick is to just not wait too long. If you wait too long then pop meta just because you waited too long then you'll lose dps. You just really need to know the mechanics of the fight and figure the best way to meta.

This is why you should try not to delay it. Personally I try to time meta with volcanic destruction and power torrent, because they share the same ICD and I get around 2 procs per meta cooldown. I often only have to wait 10 seconds or less for them to proc when meta comes off cooldown. If I use meta say, 4 times in a fight, I'd only be wasting 40 seconds or so which isn't enough to squeeze another meta in. With demon soul I don't tend to wait, I usually time that with a trinket proc or whatever because it rarely lines up with meta to make it worth the wait. There's usually about 30 seconds or so in between them which added up is about the same as a meta cooldown. I'd rather time my meta with other things.

In reality though because most fights have certain phases or movement that are impractical for meta, you should really just pop meta when you have a chance to stand still, procs or no procs.

[kosuko]

In addition you can time it with trinkets. Meta + demon soul + trinket procs = WIN

For example, your meta and DS are ready, but the trinket timer is showing 30. Wait about 15 seconds then use meta, after 15 second you will gain the prock then use DS, but not later than 20 second of meta left.
Same with Immolation - use it on proc, but not later then 16 second of meta left.

For procs timing TellMeWhen is a great addon.

Delaying meta for 15 seconds sounds like a big dps loss to me.. Don't forget that with meta not on cooldown you're also not benefitting from impening doom.

The reason that the bell is so good for demo is the same reason stump of time is good ( shouldn't they actually be exactly equal?) a 1900 spellpower proc, the crit is just reforged away.

As for soulcasket.. i believe the uptime from on use trinkets is lower than procs ( or did they change this?) resulting in a lower dps.
Mirror has the problem if being quite bad if you don't time meta exactly on the procs.

So for pure convenience i'd personally suggest bell, stump, casket or even heart of whatshisname
Yes i know.. the simcraft numbers disagree with me, but don't forget that every fights has mechanics: different times where you want that extra damage (this being a big bonus for soulcasket or heart).

[gherkin]

It depends on how long is left in the fight, not in the bosses hp. I can get two meta's off in 35% of a bosses HP due to Impending Doom, but it depends on the boss.

If you can only get one meta off in the time remaining, then I might consider delaying to stack cooldowns, but to make things simpler you don't have to. Just add ~300 dps to your final total and thats where you would have been.

[Jessicka]

Mirror has the problem if being quite bad if you don't time meta exactly on the procs.

No, you just have to pop it at any time the proc is up and you will receive the full benefit of the proc for the entire duration of Metamorphosis. I've found the ICD actually lines up reasonably well, with seldom more than a 20s wait, at which point I can stack DS as well.

[gherkin]

Mirror has a 90s ICD. Are you saying you can get a meta every 70 seconds? Or every 160?