1. #1

    Demonology Pets - What should you be using, when, and why?

    So a topic came up the other night with a friend - It looks like my felguard dps isn't really that impressive on a lot of fights, and I was wondering why that was. I mean, Felguard is supposed to be the big, beefy pet that hits for a ton that's unique to demonology warlocks and kind of defines the spec, right? Well, we did a lot of tests - Here was what we found out.

    First - The gear & me - I just literally started raiding and playing again - http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...rasgoth/simple

    Stats might slightly differ with fully geared raiding locks, in fact I hope they do, and I hope people post their numbers and tests here.

    Involving 5 tests of each permutation - 5 minutes long each by stopwatch, done in the exact same method, using the same rotation in the same way, using the exact same abilities. Felstorm, Whiplash, Shadowbite and whatnot always used on cooldown. Single target dps.

    Felguard with glyph of Felguard- 3000-3300 sustained dps.
    Imp with glyph of Imp - 3000-3300 sustained dps.
    Succubus with glyph of lash of pain - 4500-4900 sustained dps.
    Felhunter - 2400-2800 sustained dps.

    Now, obviously, numbers might differ on fights where there are massive quantities of aoe (Though strangely, a succubus actually did VERY well on magmaw with the reduced cooldown on whiplash compared to felstorm as well as doubling for a boomkin for knockback / higher dps on the head), but on a single target fight, even lowly imp is better than the felguard. It can switch damage to adds faster, hit mobs in the air during air phases and is generally far better than felguard in most respects, you never have to manage felstorm cooldowns.

    Since then, I've been using succubus for pretty much anything since the increase in dps is just that massive. It shows in raids too, and the succy has pushed 5.5k in a few situations.

    Anyone else do any testing to see how their pets perform? I'm curious how different folks try it out.
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  2. #2
    Right now, no matter how much we may not want to admit it, the Succubus will slap a Felguard silly with embarrassment when it comes to single target dps (with her glyph). Even the lastest PTR patch doesn't have anything that improves the Felguard dps; only tries to improve our own when we use the Felguard. It's a shame, but that's the reality.

    Single target: Glyphed Succubus.
    Multi target and posing in Stormwind / Orgrimmar: Glyped Felguard.

  3. #3
    The succubus absolutely murders the Felguard, I'm more concerned about how the *imp* absolutely murders the felguard. Honestly, when the felhunter is patched, even *it* might murder the felguard, which makes our 'big' class pet nothing more than an AOE spell.

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by TobiasX View Post
    Right now, no matter how much we may not want to admit it, the Succubus will slap a Felguard silly with embarrassment when it comes to single target dps (with her glyph). Even the lastest PTR patch doesn't have anything that improves the Felguard dps; only tries to improve our own when we use the Felguard. It's a shame, but that's the reality.

    Single target: Glyphed Succubus.
    Multi target and posing in Stormwind / Orgrimmar: Glyped Felguard.
    The Mana Feed change is more to bring the Felhunter/Felguard gains in line with the Succubus/Imp in that the Succubus/Imp can proc Mana Feed with every attack while Felhunter/Felguard can only do it with every few seconds. It's to make them all even in regards to Mana Feed, not bring Felguard above Succubus.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Basmothel View Post
    The Mana Feed change is more to bring the Felhunter/Felguard gains in line with the Succubus/Imp in that the Succubus/Imp can proc Mana Feed with every attack while Felhunter/Felguard can only do it with every few seconds. It's to make them all even in regards to Mana Feed, not bring Felguard above Succubus.
    With the new changes to the Felhunter (Double damage to Shadow Bite) and mana feed, it is just going to be closer to Scuccbus, but not that close... I mean use Succubus doesn't use that much of mana and the single target DPS is great. Felhunter will be more used for the shadow bite.

    I personally think the demon skill changes are so minor and it won't effecting the current situation. Felguard should be demon lock's best guardian, but right now, it is just there not doing much. I am still hoping for some damage rise for Felguard.

    Right now, I think the 4.1 changes for lock are bound for nerf afterward. Instead of 30% and 50% it probably go down in number...

  6. #6
    It seems that after some doubtful start and 3 months of expansion, demonology is a broken spec - again.

  7. #7
    I guess the biggest issue is - The felguard is functionally and totally worthless. The only time you would ever have him out is during trash and as soon as you get to a boss, you swap him out for something that doesn't suck.

    Demo isn't a broken spec, the felguard is just a broken minion. Honestly, you could just soulburn summon him in fights when you need AOE (It's not like you're using soulburn for a damn thing other than that anyways, don't even mention soulfire) and you'd be fine. :P

  8. #8
    Moderator Nicola's Avatar
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    I only use felguard on fights with adds that r close enough to each other for cleave and lolstorm, on trash and for demonsoul.
    For all other stuff, i use succy.

  9. #9
    Legendary! gherkin's Avatar
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    Succubus - Single target fight with no long-range air phase (She can hit Atramedes P2)
    Imp - Long Range
    Felguard - Multitarget fight where 50% of your felstorms hit more than one target.

    R.I.P. YARG

  10. #10
    The current patch notes have the Felguard returning four times as much mana from Mana Feed, do you think it will be more efficient to use the Felguard over the Succubus with only these changes or do you think more changes are needed for that to happen?
    Last edited by jHero; 2011-03-02 at 08:58 PM.

  11. #11
    Moderator Nicola's Avatar
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    The current patch notes have the Felguard returning four times as much mana from Mana Feed, do you think it will be more efficient to use the Felguard over the Succubus with only these changes or do you think more changes are needed for that to happen?
    The change to manafeed is so that the felguard gets an equal manareturn as succubus and imp.
    Imp and succy still do more dps as felguard so he could use a few dmg buffs. Not only bcs he's not the top dps pet anymore, but I also wanna afk in dungeons and let me pet do the job.

  12. #12
    I find it a little sad that the signature ability for demonology is essentially useless out of the box.

  13. #13
    Legendary! gherkin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jHero View Post
    The current patch notes have the Felguard returning four times as much mana from Mana Feed, do you think it will be more efficient to use the Felguard over the Succubus with only these changes or do you think more changes are needed for that to happen?
    No because he's still a wet paper bag compared to Succubus.

    Actual math: 4x current amount, Felguard hits every 6s. 6 / 4 = 1.5, just like the Succubus.
    This means he's getting mana from basic melee instead of legion strike.

    R.I.P. YARG

  14. #14
    I see.

    Here's hoping they'll make Felguard the demon of choice for Demonology, as many (myself included) seem to feel it should be.

    How about when using Demon Soul, you don't suppose it would be beneficial to swap pets as Affliction does?

  15. #15
    Legendary! gherkin's Avatar
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    It's beneficial, but you'd have to be fast and accurate in order to make it a dps gain. I just don't see the point in gaming the system like that.

    R.I.P. YARG

  16. #16
    The Lightbringer Alceus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gherkin View Post
    Succubus - Single target fight with no long-range air phase (She can hit Atramedes P2)
    Imp - Long Range
    Felguard - Multitarget fight where 50% of your felstorms hit more than one target.
    pretty much this in my experience.
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  17. #17
    Succubus every time, unless you are in pvp

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