Major Earthquake In Japan

[Lao_tzu]

you know the expresion an outside view cant hurt? ^^



they have a lot to handle over there , so help is allways good imo

Very true - I just ment it as Japan is the worlds leading country in Nuclear tech they should be more knowledgable - but yes another view can't hurt

Just a shame it seems to late now after the Evac its going to be more difficult to deal with.

---------- Post added 2011-03-15 at 10:21 PM ----------

2216: The BBC's Matt Frei in Tokyo says spent fuel rods in reactors five and six are also now believed to be heating up.

Probably fear mongering from the BBC?

[Sonç]

Actually its not that silly, while water is used as the coolant, I'm pretty sure what they are speaking of America sending is Boron.

Boron absorbs neutrons, since stray neutrons are what keeps a reaction going by splitting more uranium atoms and releasing more energy as well as more neutrons, absorbing as many as possible will help to slow a reaction that for all intensive purposes is self sustaining, at least until the nuclear fuel is depleted. Slowing the reaction to the stopping point would in effect cool the reactors since the nuclear reactions are what causes the extreme heat. therefore Boron could be looked at as a coolant.

Glad to see someone who understands this more than most. Looking forward to more from you.

[Nygio]

Due to high levels of radiation at the No. 4 reactor, the area is inaccessible (to fight the fire)

[TehStig]

you know the expresion an outside view cant hurt? ^^



they have a lot to handle over there , so help is allways good imo

Or the saying "A fresh set of eyes" I worked at a lumber mill we used that all the time for safety :P
Hopefully they can handle it. It sounds like it just keeps getting worse.

[Vanyali]

Let's hope there won't be yet another one.
Besides, shouldn't the 4th reactor be supposedly filled with inactive or soon-to-be inactive fuel rods?

iirc, they've got spent fuel rods which are still hot and were heating up last i read. whether or not they caused the fire by heating up can only be speculated, but probably not

[Nycgangsta]

I don't believe the Boric Acid is really acting as a coolant, its only slowing down the exchange of neutrons between the fuel rods.

Turning off a nuclear power plant isn't like turning off a light, it doesn't happen automatically. The flow of neutrons could take weeks to halt. Adding boron to the mixture absorbs some of the neutrons that are being exchanged to make the process stop even sooner. I guess you could stretch that into calling it a coolant, but the damage is done already, and Boric Acid isn't doing anything to fix that.

[Lao_tzu]

Weren't Boron Rods used to stop the reaction anyway - or is this an older reactor design.
I thought the old reactors and the SCRAMS - Axe men, the guys who dropped the rods - thus removing any further reaction happening?

I guess Boric Acid would be an additional double solution - coolant and reaction preventor.

[Ademptio]

Our news says they gave up hope on reactor 4. Since Radiation level is even to high now for ppl with even special suites its deadly.

[Scye]

I don't believe the Boric Acid is really acting as a coolant, its only slowing down the exchange of neutrons between the fuel rods.

Turning off a nuclear power plant isn't like turning off a light, it doesn't happen automatically. The flow of neutrons could take weeks to halt. Adding boron to the mixture absorbs some of the neutrons that are being exchanged to make the process stop even sooner. I guess you could stretch that into calling it a coolant, but the damage is done already, and Boric Acid isn't doing anything to fix that.

Did you just counterpoint your own post?

Boron does slow down the flow of neutrons, boric acid only slows it down faster, by absorbing the neutrons, rather than slowing them down.
It -is- a coolant because it can effectively be used as one, and is prepared to do so.

[Moonfalora]

Our news says they gave up hope on reactor 4. Since Radiation level is even to high now for ppl with even special suites its deadly.

If this is true, then I am saddened to read this. As if it wasn't bad enough already! Hopefully things get settled soon.

[Jackmoves]

Sigh at Reuters..
"Slideshow: As Japan faces the most serious nuclear accident since Chernobyl, here's a look at the area around Chernobyl's exclusion zone:"
http://www.reuters.com/news/pictures...USRTR2JXB3#a=1

That is one way to make people feel at ease...

Saw a pretty awesome documentary about Chernobyl a couple of months back. Since the whole area around the plant has been untouched pretty much since the accident, the ecosystem amazingly balanced. It's like a national park now. Wild life lives in perfect harmony, wolfs, deers etc.

[Nycgangsta]

Its not fixing the problem though, its just preventing it from going further, thats hardly a coolant.

There really is no magical compound thats going to fix this. The damage is done and we just have to hope when it melts that it doesn't melt through the sides or top and that it melts from the bottom, sending all the radiation to the ground, which ya is a bad situation, but its better than the other possibilites

[Lao_tzu]

2235: Tepco spokesman Hajimi Motujuku says the fire at reactor four is in the outer housing of the containment vessel. Its cause is not yet known, AP reports.

[Vanyali]

2235: Tepco spokesman Hajimi Motujuku says the fire at reactor four is in the outer housing of the containment vessel. Its cause is not yet known, AP reports.

That's good. Kinda. Except the part where it can't be fought :\

[Lao_tzu]

Its not fixing the problem though, its just preventing it from going further, thats hardly a coolant.

There really is no magical compound thats going to fix this. The damage is done and we just have to hope when it melts that it doesn't melt through the sides or top and that it melts from the bottom, sending all the radiation to the ground, which ya is a bad situation, but its better than the other possibilites

Not sure if serious? - on a side note my information about this sort of stuff was severely limited before this thread.

But what I have learned is that a melt down that goes out of the bottom of the reactor - Chernobyl (OK I understand that this reactor didn't ahve proper containment)
Is a bad thing - and that once the nuclear lump of melted fuel hits the water table then you have serious problems as it vapourises and makes everything airbourne.

Please forgive my non-techinical knowledge and laymans terms I need for my own understanding.

[Scye]

Ok, I give up, Nycgangsta.
If an aqueous mixture designed to stop the flow of neutrons released during atomic fission isn't a coolant, then I don't know what is.

OT: I still don't believe they would, or even, could simply give up on the 4th reactor.

[Vanyali]

Not sure if serious? - on a side note my information about this sort of stuff was severely limited before this thread.

But what I have learned is that a melt down that goes out of the bottom of the reactor - Chernobyl (OK I understand that this reactor didn't ahve proper containment)
Is a bad thing - and that once the nuclear lump of melted fuel hits the water table then you have serious problems as it vapourises and makes everything airbourne.

Please forgive my non-techinical knowledge and laymans terms I need for my own understanding.

if i'm remembering right, there's a "pool" at the bottom of the plant specifically designed to prevent the melted fuel from contaminating the ground water. chernobyl didn't have anything preventing it from sinking until it hit ground water, which is one of the reasons it became a problem - the reaction with the water caused a bit of an explosion.

[Sileh]

Ok, I give up, Nycgangsta.
If an aqueous mixture designed to stop the flow of neutrons released during atomic fission isn't a coolant, then I don't know what is.

OT: I still don't believe they would, or even, could simply give up on the 4th reactor.

I have no knowledge about any of this but what I think he is trying to say is that Boric Acid will only lessen the damage, not revert or prevent it. So calling it a coolant isn't really justified.

[TehStig]

Saw a pretty awesome documentary about Chernobyl a couple of months back. Since the whole area around the plant has been untouched pretty much since the accident, the ecosystem amazingly balanced. It's like a national park now. Wild life lives in perfect harmony, wolfs, deers etc.

It is rather amazing how quickly mother nature retook that area. Humans may never re develop there but nature found a way.
(sorry for going Off topic)
On Topic: At least in between the scarefest CNN is pulling with the Fukushima reactors they are showing pretty aweseom stories of survivors, kind of makes you keep hope

[Shakul]

Official death toll now at 3,300 something.

Fire still burning.

---------- Post added 2011-03-15 at 11:51 PM ----------

Back to sleep for me, still exhausted. =/