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  1. #1

    Resto Shaman PvP Discussion.

    So, I would rather players 2k+ Post here on their feelings, because anything lower is just not as coordinated and skilled. So I see people now talking about how shamans are a top 2 healer for pvp. I mean I think yes were viable, but I would like to know what puts us on the level of a druid or priest.

    What We have:
    -Tremor
    -Wind Shear
    -Grounding
    -Offensive Dispel (Not Like we use it now alot anyway)

    What We Lack:
    -Any Defensive Cooldown
    -No Spell Proetection.(We do not use hots, everything is cast, and unlike priests pallys, we have to just to cast)
    -No 100% movement/snare removal. (Druids have travel/Priests have Their Thing/Pallys have Freedom)

    I mean Along with what other healers bring, I dont see what makes us good compared to them.

  2. #2
    Stood in the Fire Funky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BFED123 View Post
    What We have:
    -Tremor - instantly removes fear/charm
    -Wind Shear - 6 second cd..
    -Grounding - 15 second cd...
    -Offensive Dispel (Not Like we use it now alot anyway) - If you don't you're bad.

    What We Lack:
    -Any Defensive Cooldown = Natures swiftness and mobile casting and when you get low you have Nature's Guardian.
    -No Spell Proetection = Grounding and Windshear? Earthshield gives you 100% pushback resistance...
    -No 100% movement/snare removal. Ghost wolf + Earthbind/Frost shock AND cleanse can remove most slow and heals you for the lowest mana cost of any other healer.
    I mean Along with what other healers bring, I dont see what makes us good compared to them.
    You need to play better.

    Lets not forget also that a good resto shaman has atleast 3300+ resilience which is 35% dmg reduce. (I have 4400/47% dmg reduce)
    Earthshield increases self healing by 15%, Spark of Life increases healing taken by another 6%.
    When you get below 35% hp you get Nature's Guardian and an 80% chance to proc Earthliving...
    You move 15% faster because of Ancestral Swiftness + Instant Gwolf.
    When you're casting you take 10% less damage, when you crit you get another 10% damage reduction AND Ancestral Awakening procs.

    Shamans are the best healers PvP wise atm. You need to do more work to become better. We are amazing atm.
    Last edited by Funky; 2011-03-11 at 10:19 PM.

  3. #3
    Cookie Monster Radux's Avatar
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    @Funky

    • NS is not a real defensive cooldown. Something like Pain Suppression is more in line of this sort of thing.
    • Mobile Casting? If you're referring to SWG, then it can be dispelled.
    • Spell protection meaning Riptide, ELW and Tidal Waves gets dispelled. ES used to be used for this. It can't be dispelled anymore.
    • Earthbind is bugged where Hit or SpellPen (capped) don't matter -- It misses/resists all the time.
    • Being able to snare the person who snared you + GW working around the argument. It only makes you move slightly faster than them (assuming they're melee) for a small amount of time. That time in which you can't cast. (Also GW can be dispelled).
    • There are many snares that cannot be dispelled.

  4. #4
    The only snare we can dispell is Earthbind and Slow if i'm not mistaken. Can't remove Chains of Ice, Hamstring, Crippling Poison... Well you can remove Crip once every 2min if you're a Dwarf but not like it won't be on you as soon as you Stoneskin, usually.

    I know they're envisioning Spirit Link totem be our 'omg' cooldown but I don't see how it'll be that hot in PVP.

  5. #5
    Stood in the Fire Funky's Avatar
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    So are you really going to tell me we have a problem competing with other healers in PvP?

  6. #6
    Cookie Monster Radux's Avatar
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    Not at all. I think Shaman are quite competitive in high ranked PvP. I was just pointing out that your comments were not consistent to how it really is.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Funky View Post
    You need to play better.

    Lets not forget also that a good resto shaman has atleast 3300+ resilience which is 35% dmg reduce. (I have 4400/47% dmg reduce)
    Earthshield increases self healing by 15%, Spark of Life increases healing taken by another 6%.
    When you get below 35% hp you get Nature's Guardian and an 80% chance to proc Earthliving...
    You move 15% faster because of Ancestral Swiftness + Instant Gwolf.
    When you're casting you take 10% less damage, when you crit you get another 10% damage reduction AND Ancestral Awakening procs.

    Shamans are the best healers PvP wise atm. You need to do more work to become better. We are amazing atm.
    Im 2400 I dont need to be told how to play. Listen Ghost wolf is the worst movement increase between all healers. It doesnt even count. That I know of, nobody gets that talent for 10% less damage while casting. Im at 4k Res. You act like no healers have resilience? So heres what I got from that. EarthShield for 15% more healing. You cant take talents like Spark of life lol...EVERY single healer has talents to increase their core heals. So... Really what I got out of that was Ancestral Awakening Procs.

    We are the easiest healer to control/sit on and keep locked out from healing. If you would like to add something to what Im saying, get your facts straight and make more sense.
    Last edited by BFED123; 2011-03-11 at 10:41 PM.

  8. #8
    Stood in the Fire Tauroon's Avatar
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    Shaman healers are to me, the best healers at the moment due to their ability to CC and their 60k greater healing waves.

  9. #9
    Cookie Monster Radux's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BFED123 View Post
    You cant take talents like Spark of life lol.
    Sorry what?

  10. #10
    Also I wasn't saying Shaman Healers are bad. But fighting against a Resto Druid makes me mash my face into my desk. They're always at full mana!

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Radux View Post
    Sorry what?
    I meant as in you cant use that as something to put over other healers. Yes its a good talent, but everyone else has similar ones. Thats not unique.

  12. #12
    Cookie Monster Radux's Avatar
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    Oh ok ok. Yeah I'll agree with that. It just came off like you didn't take the talent lol.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Radux View Post
    Oh ok ok. Yeah I'll agree with that. It just came off like you didn't take the talent lol.
    Hehe no id say that talent should be used for every shaman spec for pvp, But Like I said I know we can compete, but when I look at our viable comps...you put in a Disc/Resto Druid and its better. Idk

  14. #14
    Cookie Monster Radux's Avatar
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    I wouldn't go so far to say that Disc is better in every comp. Disc is very reliant on your teammates being able to peel for you (not saying they aren't great healers, though). I will agree, for the most part, about Resto Druids, though (unfortunately). Super high mobility + mostly instants + CC that doesn't share DR with anyone else.

    My big problem with Restoration Shaman right now is that matches depend SO MUCH depending on the comp I'm against. We can shut down most Spell Cleave teams pretty well unless it's a really open map. Cleansing Waters (even after the minor nerf) is incredibly powerful against casters. You're correct about having an escape, though. A warrior can sit on me all day and, without peels, it gets ugly (thus the need for a defensive cooldown).
    Last edited by Radux; 2011-03-11 at 11:05 PM.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Radux View Post
    I wouldn't go so far to say that Disc is better in every comp. Disc is very reliant on your teammates being able to peel for you (not saying they aren't great healers, though). I will agree, for the most part, about Resto Druids, though (unfortunately). Super high mobility + mostly instants + CC that doesn't share DR with anyone else.
    Yea and when I say RDruid/Priest I dont mean every single comp you can put BOTH healers in, I mean one or the other will just work better than us

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Tauroon View Post
    Shaman healers are to me, the best healers at the moment due to their ability to CC and their 60k greater healing waves.
    Are you serious? I have never hit anyone with a 60k GHW in arena, 40k at best with a crit and mastery kickin in. Heck, I hardly ever cast GHW since its a slow 2 second cast and easily interrupted.

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by BFED123 View Post
    So, I would rather players 2k+ Post here on their feelings, because anything lower is just not as coordinated and skilled. So I see people now talking about how shamans are a top 2 healer for pvp. I mean I think yes were viable, but I would like to know what puts us on the level of a druid or priest.

    What We have:
    -Tremor
    -Wind Shear
    -Grounding
    -Offensive Dispel (Not Like we use it now alot anyway)

    What We Lack:
    -Any Defensive Cooldown
    -No Spell Proetection.(We do not use hots, everything is cast, and unlike priests pallys, we have to just to cast)
    -No 100% movement/snare removal. (Druids have travel/Priests have Their Thing/Pallys have Freedom)

    I mean Along with what other healers bring, I dont see what makes us good compared to them.
    I think you highly underrate NS. An instant hex is soo good when the mage is ready to Silence you the sec you cast it.

  18. #18
    Druids and Priests are ahead of us at the moment I would say. We're sort of forced to play with teams that can peel (rogue/x, mostly), due to the lack of a cooldown.

    That's not to say we're in a bad spot at the moment. All healers are in a pretty good spot I'd say. All are viable for gladiator teams.
    Bog n Goo.. Blanket too!!

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Shamygandof View Post
    Are you serious? I have never hit anyone with a 60k GHW in arena, 40k at best with a crit and mastery kickin in. Heck, I hardly ever cast GHW since its a slow 2 second cast and easily interrupted.
    You are forgetting to add ancestral awakening to the crit heal
    (This signature was removed for violation of the Avatar & Signature Guidelines)

  20. #20
    I wouldn't go so far to say that Disc is better in every comp. Disc is very reliant on your teammates being able to peel for you (not saying they aren't great healers, though). I will agree, for the most part, about Resto Druids, though (unfortunately). Super high mobility + mostly instants + CC that doesn't share DR with anyone else.
    Resto Druids are far easier to swap to than Resto Shamans, due to how long it takes to put on a full row off HoTs, whereas the shaman mostly just has to Earth Shield himself.

    My big problem with Restoration Shaman right now is that matches depend SO MUCH depending on the comp I'm against. We can shut down most Spell Cleave teams pretty well unless it's a really open map. Cleansing Waters (even after the minor nerf) is incredibly powerful against casters. You're correct about having an escape, though. A warrior can sit on me all day and, without peels, it gets ugly (thus the need for a defensive cooldown).
    You're right about spell cleaves. That's probably one of the largest reasons you'd take a shaman over every other healer, because even (or perhaps especially) Melee/Caster/Healer comps, you can wreck a lot of their pressure. Unfortunately, I'm confused as to why you said "without peels" because almost any melee can solo a healer without peels, warriors ESPECIALLY. That's why you get peels. I'd agree that you need a cooldown, but honestly I don't think it has to be a major one like Pain Suppression is (even just on self) due to the fact that even in the current game a Resto Shaman can drag the game out forever.

    On topic though, a huge reason Resto is a top healer is because of their incredible mana longevity and throughput. Most of the buffs recently were purely PvE reasons though, which is what makes it even more evident that they're strong (they can't seem to buff PvE without somehow overbuffing it, I don't understand it that much).

    Im 2400 I dont need to be told how to play. Listen Ghost wolf is the worst movement increase between all healers. It doesnt even count. That I know of, nobody gets that talent for 10% less damage while casting. Im at 4k Res. You act like no healers have resilience? So heres what I got from that. EarthShield for 15% more healing. You cant take talents like Spark of life lol...EVERY single healer has talents to increase their core heals. So... Really what I got out of that was Ancestral Awakening Procs.
    Ghost Wolf is not the worst movement increase between healers. It's behind druid's mobility sure, but a Paladin's movement speed increase costs him like 12k mana, doesn't last more than a few seconds, and is on a cooldown. And priests don't even have one. You might be able to count Inner Will stacking with boot enchant, but if melee is training you it's probably better to swap to Inner Fire anyway.

    Also, you can count Spark of Life. Their heals are balanced on the 6% to ALL spells increased, however they are not balanced around the 15% increase to yourself. That's just a nice bonus.
    Last edited by Tarin; 2011-03-12 at 08:22 PM.

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