Gross violation of the first amendment by delaware dept of transportation

[Faloestin]

And I totally agree that it should never have been edited, for all we know that woman was trying to be reasonable, but it was edited to points where she was no longer trying to cooperate because the guy refused to cooperate respectfully.

what I am certainly annoyed by however, is the fact that they city coucil did not, from what the guy told us, respond to his requests from him and his representitive prior to this confrontation. If in fact he did respond to the letter issued stating the pole was going to be removed, then he had a right to complain, he was not given a response to his petition, and was put in a situation that he could not argue against because the pole was going to be removed by the time his complaint was even recognized. That is why this video pisses me off, because the guy wasnt even given a fair chance or the time to even react to this mandate.

I don't think the statute requires the city to do anything. It's a state law requiring DOT to remove obstructions. DOT is apparently supposed to give the homeowner written notice and time to remove the obstruction, and if he doesn't, DOT has to remove it themselves. A certified letter from DOT that says "the pole's an obstruction, you have 30 days to remove it" would seem to satisfy the requirement. Note that the statue doesn't require DOT to engage in a dialog. The homeowner can write all the letters he wants, but they're not going to slow the process down. If he really wanted to keep his pole, he should have found counsel and convinced a judge that his rights were being trampled. Of course, if his rights weren't being abused, he won't be able to find a lawyer to take the case because the judge isn't going to agree, which may explain the pole-sitting in the video.

[Sorrior]

No, she told them to stop taunting and harassing the workers. That is not a protest, its harassment and its against he law.



Yeah, sure you would have, tough guy.

You'd be surprised what people can do when enraged enough. Ever hear of those mothers lifting cars to save kids when really scared/pissed/whatever there feelings at that moment i get like that. For some reason my mind perceives abuse of authority whether real or perceived as a mortal threat to existence and thus triggers an extremely powerful survival instinct in me. Resulting in a primal and very bestial desire to fight and destroy those creating the "threat". Just because i spend most of my time online doesn;t mean i'm weak i do it because i'm too scared of myself in public if certain criteria are met.

As for the "harssing the workers" bit i was reffering to climbing the Hoop so that they couldn;t take it down civil rights right there.

[Gothicshark]

She threatened them for trying to protest that IS a violation. It was not a mass protest and was the basic civil disobedience protest.

In most Cases Civil disobedience Protests are Illegal, and you can be Arrested.

[Coke]

For some reason my mind perceives abuse of authority whether real or perceived as a mortal threat to existence and thus triggers an extremely powerful survival instinct in me. Resulting in a primal and very bestial desire to fight and destroy those creating the "threat"

Oh, you're one of those. :|

[Faloestin]

You'd be surprised what people can do when enraged enough. Ever hear of those mothers lifting cars to save kids when really scared/pissed/whatever there feelings at that moment i get like that. For some reason my mind perceives abuse of authority whether real or perceived as a mortal threat to existence and thus triggers an extremely powerful survival instinct in me. Resulting in a primal and very bestial desire to fight and destroy those creating the "threat". Just because i spend most of my time online doesn;t mean i'm weak i do it because i'm too scared of myself in public if certain criteria are met.

As for the "harssing the workers" bit i was reffering to climbing the Hoop so that they couldn;t take it down civil rights right there.

I'm not sure "extremely powerful survival instinct" means what you think it means.

[Sorrior]

The fact of the matter was he built a permanent structure in the right of way of a road, which is required for sidewalk maintainance and maintainance of water and sewage lines. If he wanted to avoid the problem, then he should have gotten a mobile hoop that he could store on his own property.

It's like the time the US built a fort, only to find out that due to a drunk surveyer's errors, they actually built Canada a new fort. Expensive errors, embarassing errors, this guy should be glad it was just a basketball hoop, and not a garage.

Except that the CITY built it 60 years ago big difference right there. It was old had been there for 60 years and TBH should have been left in. Though i'd say my biggest issue was with the woman threatening them even when they were trying to do things civilly before shit hit the fan from what we can tell. He tried his congressman they tried civil protest and so on. While yes the man himself was being an ass that woman had NO RIGHT to threaten them so.

[Arganis]

You'd be surprised what people can do when enraged enough. Ever hear of those mothers lifting cars to save kids when really scared/pissed/whatever there feelings at that moment i get like that. For some reason my mind perceives abuse of authority whether real or perceived as a mortal threat to existence and thus triggers an extremely powerful survival instinct in me. Resulting in a primal and very bestial desire to fight and destroy those creating the "threat". Just because i spend most of my time online doesn;t mean i'm weak i do it because i'm too scared of myself in public if certain criteria are met.

As for the "harssing the workers" bit i was reffering to climbing the Hoop so that they couldn;t take it down civil rights right there.

Sorry but "You wouldn't like me when I'm angry" only works in Hulk. In real life it just lands you in jail.

[Sorrior]

I'm not sure "extremely powerful survival instinct" means what you think it means.

For me a hybrid of shock and a hyberbolic state merged into one. Esentially i get the increased physcial cpabilities of hyberbolic while also attaining the loss of self awareness/control of shock and the loss of pain of shock as well. Look them up and you'll see what i mean.

---------- Post added 2011-03-28 at 07:33 PM ----------

Sorry but "You wouldn't like me when I'm angry" only works in Hulk. In real life it just lands you in jail.

Or dead more likely dead for me. But hopefully i'd at least take one down.

[Gothicshark]

Except that the CITY built it 60 years ago big difference right there. It was old had been there for 60 years and TBH should have been left in. Though i'd say my biggest issue was with the woman threatening them even when they were trying to do things civilly before shit hit the fan from what we can tell. He tried his congressman they tried civil protest and so on. While yes the man himself was being an ass that woman had NO RIGHT to threaten them so.

once again I will point out the Law.

See this post: http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...1#post10892796

there is no Grey area, the State had every right to remove it.

[Wilderness]

You'd be surprised what people can do when enraged enough. Ever hear of those mothers lifting cars to save kids when really scared/pissed/whatever there feelings at that moment i get like that. For some reason my mind perceives abuse of authority whether real or perceived as a mortal threat to existence and thus triggers an extremely powerful survival instinct in me. Resulting in a primal and very bestial desire to fight and destroy those creating the "threat". Just because i spend most of my time online doesn;t mean i'm weak i do it because i'm too scared of myself in public if certain criteria are met.

As for the "harssing the workers" bit i was reffering to climbing the Hoop so that they couldn;t take it down civil rights right there.

I thought you were referring to the taunting and harassment afterwards, ok. But its not legal for the kind of protest you are describing. You chain yourself to a tree to stop the big bad bulldozers from building another parking lot and your ass gets arrested. Same thing here if she'd gone through with her threat to climb the pole again and refuse to come down.

As to the first paragraph of your post ... thanks, that was very entertaining.

[Faloestin]

For me a hybrid of shock and a hyberbolic state merged into one. Esentially i get the increased physcial cpabilities of hyberbolic while also attaining the loss of self awareness/control of shock and the loss of pain of shock as well. Look them up and you'll see what i mean.

Sounds tiring. I imagine you'd need some snacks after.

[Sorrior]

Oh, you're one of those. :|

I've had ALOT of issues with those in power in my life and it probably developed into this burning hatred of abuse of power. I can;t even watch those cop reality shows my dad likes without getting enraged. Though i HAVE met some nice police when i got pulled over for no headlight. They let me off no warning no nothing once they realized i was clean and a new driver.

---------- Post added 2011-03-28 at 07:37 PM ----------

Sounds tiring. I imagine you'd need some snacks after.

It is i generally am lethargic for several days after. Not to mention i actually don;t like hurting people so i cry for like a half hour or more if i remember hurting someone. In short i'm a pussy with an oddly strong survival instinct.

[DragonFireKai]

Except that the CITY built it 60 years ago big difference right there. It was old had been there for 60 years and TBH should have been left in. Though i'd say my biggest issue was with the woman threatening them even when they were trying to do things civilly before shit hit the fan from what we can tell. He tried his congressman they tried civil protest and so on. While yes the man himself was being an ass that woman had NO RIGHT to threaten them so.

If the city built it, then it's not even the man's property, it's the government's, and if the government decides to remove it, then it's their right to do so, without warning to people who happen to live nearby.

Also, since they had already attempted to remove the pole once, and couldn't due to the woman climbing the pole, the DoT representative was well within her rights to inform the people performing ilegal acts that if they persisted that the state trooper, who had to be called over to deal with these ignorant people, would arrest them.

[Sorrior]

once again I will point out the Law.

See this post: http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...1#post10892796

there is no Grey area, the State had every right to remove it.

But not a right to be assholes. If that was anyone other than the government doing that that women would have been fired faster than a quantum particle can travel and that is faster than the speed of light.

[Ner zhul]

Why do people always scream about how our liberties are being torn away. Why do people not realize that we live in a national community that abides by laws so that we can all live together as peacefully as possible. We give up things everyday, to make a compromise, you either realize that or live in a world without laws where people go and take stuff wherever they want. But apparently everyone just wants to get their way, and never wants to be offended, TOO BAD. You have 350 million people when was the last time anyone did anything ever in the entire existence of the universe that didn't piss off several hundred people.

wow....

many laws are completely wrong. there was a story awhile back about a kid's lemonade stand being shut down because she didn't have a business permit.

when laws/government reach the point where having a lemonade stand is illegal u have a problem. and there are so many laws that restrict kids being kids

[Wells]

Zoning violations?! Aaaughhh hulk smash zoning violation

viva le revolution!

[Endus]

Except that the CITY built it 60 years ago big difference right there.

If the city installed the hoop on city property, why does this guy have ANY say if the pole being removed?

I was under the impression that this guy owned the hoop in question. If the city installed it 60 years ago, he has absolutely no legitimate grounds for protest that they're removing it. Express dismay, sure, but not this ridiculous behaviour.

But not a right to be assholes. If that was anyone other than the government doing that that women would have been fired faster than a quantum particle can travel and that is faster than the speed of light.

I disagree entirely. She didn't cave to their demands, but if she HAD, she should've been fired. She didn't raise her voice, she did her best to keep her cool and keep the situation from escalating.

This wasn't the first visit, remember. This was the second visit, with police backup, to do their job without illegal interference by this couple, which had disrupted the earlier attempt. She COULD have just waited for them to do whatever they liked, and the moment they climbed the pole or harassed the workers had them arrested for it, and the charges likely would have stuck with that many witnesses around. That would have been legitimate. Instead, she tried to warn them of the consequences their actions would hold, to avoid having to take it that far.

It wasn't a threat. It was a desperate plea to not escalate the situation to the point that the officers would have to arrest anyone.

[blitzkrieg3002]

friggen bs

[Sorrior]

If the city built it, then it's not even the man's property, it's the government's, and if the government decides to remove it, then it's their right to do so, without warning to people who happen to live nearby.

Also, since they had already attempted to remove the pole once, and couldn't due to the woman climbing the pole, the DoT representative was well within her rights to inform the people performing ilegal acts that if they persisted that the state trooper, who had to be called over to deal with these ignorant people, would arrest them.

Which shouldn't matter. The fact is the pole was there for 60 years that's a long time almost enough if not enough to become a neighborhood if not city icon. The problem with people who only read the word of law or even make laws like this is that they tend to see the black and white picture more than anything. To me the poles should have been left where they were. I mean even if a kid did get run over someday i'd blame the driver and kid more than the poles.

Oh and oddly enough while typing this one of those "play 60 minutes a day" messages from the government just came on.

[Tigercat]

Basketball poles facing out onto a street are a menace not just for anyone driving through, but for anyone playing with it. If I had my way that guy would have gotten more than a stiff talking to as punishment.

I see poles like this around my neighborhood rather often, though they're not the type anchored into the ground. Someone will move it out to the street, and when their game is done they'll take them back in. Even that shouldn't be allowed.

Saying "well even if a kid does get run over it's the kid and driver's fault" is like saying we may as well not use any red lights, if there's an accident it's the driver's fault.