Massive Dumbing Down

[Tholl]

Could not help but to laugh when I saw the front page today with all of the test realm changes to dungeons etc.

Is it REALLY needed with the upcomming gear inflation? People are already blowing through heroics, and these new changes just make it silly.

Examples.

•Bleeding Wound damge from General Umbriss has been lowered by 20%.
•Malignant Trogg now moves more slowly.
•Encumbered damage bonus from Forgemaster Throngus has been reduced by 50%.
•Invoked Flaming Spirits should prefer non-tank targets to fixate on.
•The Twilight Flame Patch from the Twilight Drake has been removed.

This pretty much takes any thinking out of all of the Grim Batol encounters. (Not that there was much to begin with). But now, we can pretty much not have to worry about moving away from 'Bad stuff' and tanks on Throngus are pretty much going to have it on easy mode. (Having to move asap will no longer be an issue). And getting rid of the drake trash ground breath?? REALLY!?!?

•Ground Slam now has a pre-cast visual on the ground in front of Ozruk. In addition, Ground Slam's damage and radius have been reduced.
•High Priestess Azil's Seismic Shard now has a more obvious warning visual.

Nowhalf of this I can understand. Some tanks had a hard time figuring out where to move to as there is no real visual on Ozruk for GS. But to cut the dmg in half? Tanks will now be able to just pop a CD and soak it. So long using any skill on that encounter.

Also, if you could not dodge rocks on Azil by now, you have some serious problems...

•Gilgoblin Hunters' Poisoned Spear direct and periodic damage has been reduced.
•Gilgoblin Aquamages' Tsunami damage has been reduced.
•Visual effects during the Lady Naz'jar encounter have been improved for clarity.
•Blight Beasts summoned during the Ozumat encounter now deal less damage with Aura of Dread.

Only problem I ever saw from the gobs is people not burning them first before the 'Big guys'. Yes tanks will take some big dmg from them but then again, that is what tanking cd's are for. Not a needed fix.

Blight Beasts were fine. If the healer was having a hard time keeping people up then dps need to once again learn to not stand in the bad stuff and tanks need to stop the backpeddle.

•The Air Nova ability triggered when a Gust Soldier is killed has had its knockback effect reduced.
•Altairus now spawns closer to the center of his platform, away from the edge.
•Temple Adepts and Ministers of Air now wait 2 seconds before starting a spell cast when they are first engaged.

First part I can see how annoying it was. But seriously, change where you are standing and you wont get knocked off the edge to the beginning.

Adepts and ministers. Are people having a hard time waiting for tanks to gather them or something? Dps learn to not go balls deep the first 2 seconds and let your tanks move them into position via LOS or let them get CC'd.

•The rate at which Honor Points are earned has been doubled.

Nothing but good this.

•Arena matchmaking can now extend beyond a team's Battlegroup.

This is also good. Gives teams more comps to fight.

All in all I have to say most of these changes are not needed, and it seems we are almost completely back to Wrath days. When you take any and all strategy out of dungeon runs you take out the risk, and the fun for when you manage to complete said 'Risky' area or encounter. If there is no challenge it turns dungeons into vending machines with a half hour timer.

This game is getting dumbed down way too much now. Heroics will no longer be heroic in the future at this rate.

[Wonderboy]

At this rate epics will just appear in your mailbox at level 85. Thanks kids!

[Deleted]

"Oh noes, entry-level content is getting easier, I should definitely care if I'm already raiding."

[GrodinLB]

Maybe because they want people who have lagged behind to be able to gear up for the next tier of raiding? Especially since this the current tier has been one of the most demanding tiers (according to many top guilds) in terms of grinding content.

The game ceases to be fun when it becomes such an endless grind.

[Farrago]

omg i care so much about making my daily heroic easier! I really hate that all these other people might FINALLY be able to do a heroic!!

aaahhh my leetness is crumbling around me with all these bads downing entry level content!!!!


>_>

[aztr0]

After grinding these instances over and over again. I don't mind it being nerfed so I can finish it faster and do other things.

[Llamapwnzors]

Who gives a shit? Let the noobies who are having trouble with the heroics have some fun as well

[Kuni]

[Who gives a shit? Let the noobies who are having trouble with the heroics have some fun as well] x 2

[nyhcjedi]

Could not help but to laugh when I saw the front page today with all of the test realm changes to dungeons etc.

Is it REALLY needed with the upcomming gear inflation? People are already blowing through heroics, and these new changes just make it silly.

Examples.

•Bleeding Wound damge from General Umbriss has been lowered by 20%.
•Malignant Trogg now moves more slowly.
•Encumbered damage bonus from Forgemaster Throngus has been reduced by 50%.
•Invoked Flaming Spirits should prefer non-tank targets to fixate on.
•The Twilight Flame Patch from the Twilight Drake has been removed.

This pretty much takes any thinking out of all of the Grim Batol encounters. (Not that there was much to begin with). But now, we can pretty much not have to worry about moving away from 'Bad stuff' and tanks on Throngus are pretty much going to have it on easy mode. (Having to move asap will no longer be an issue). And getting rid of the drake trash ground breath?? REALLY!?!?

•Ground Slam now has a pre-cast visual on the ground in front of Ozruk. In addition, Ground Slam's damage and radius have been reduced.
•High Priestess Azil's Seismic Shard now has a more obvious warning visual.

Nowhalf of this I can understand. Some tanks had a hard time figuring out where to move to as there is no real visual on Ozruk for GS. But to cut the dmg in half? Tanks will now be able to just pop a CD and soak it. So long using any skill on that encounter.

Also, if you could not dodge rocks on Azil by now, you have some serious problems...

•Gilgoblin Hunters' Poisoned Spear direct and periodic damage has been reduced.
•Gilgoblin Aquamages' Tsunami damage has been reduced.
•Visual effects during the Lady Naz'jar encounter have been improved for clarity.
•Blight Beasts summoned during the Ozumat encounter now deal less damage with Aura of Dread.

Only problem I ever saw from the gobs is people not burning them first before the 'Big guys'. Yes tanks will take some big dmg from them but then again, that is what tanking cd's are for. Not a needed fix.

Blight Beasts were fine. If the healer was having a hard time keeping people up then dps need to once again learn to not stand in the bad stuff and tanks need to stop the backpeddle.

•The Air Nova ability triggered when a Gust Soldier is killed has had its knockback effect reduced.
•Altairus now spawns closer to the center of his platform, away from the edge.
•Temple Adepts and Ministers of Air now wait 2 seconds before starting a spell cast when they are first engaged.

First part I can see how annoying it was. But seriously, change where you are standing and you wont get knocked off the edge to the beginning.

Adepts and ministers. Are people having a hard time waiting for tanks to gather them or something? Dps learn to not go balls deep the first 2 seconds and let your tanks move them into position via LOS or let them get CC'd.

•The rate at which Honor Points are earned has been doubled.

Nothing but good this.

•Arena matchmaking can now extend beyond a team's Battlegroup.

This is also good. Gives teams more comps to fight.

All in all I have to say most of these changes are not needed, and it seems we are almost completely back to Wrath days. When you take any and all strategy out of dungeon runs you take out the risk, and the fun for when you manage to complete said 'Risky' area or encounter. If there is no challenge it turns dungeons into vending machines with a half hour timer.

This game is getting dumbed down way too much now. Heroics will no longer be heroic in the future at this rate.

I play super casual style. I have almost full epic pvp gear and full ilvl 346 pve gear. I barely run heroics. I had full honor pvp gear months ago, now I'm almost fully epiced pvp wise. Why bitch about people who haven't been able to get to the point where most of us were 2 months ago? So what blizzard throws them a bone. Who gives a fuck if thousands of new players will be fully geared in honor and heroic gear? You should be in 359 or raiding gear if you are so l33t now anyway.

[Reucht]

My alts are grateful. And seriously, pugs still fail in heroics.

[Focault]

I don't get the complaining, really I don't.

I would assume that everyone that is complaining about the dumbing down of dungeon content has run the heroics ad nauseum already.

[Scuravolpe]

It's the usual dungeon nerf mix-bag. Some of it is obvious shit that should've been there from release, like visuals for Ground Slam. The rest of it is to just make it easier, like reducing damage from main abilities. It's all to make it even easier. That's the point. As time goes on, the entry-level stuff gets easier. The top progression people are all already in the heroic raids - they've had their spotlight and did these heroics when they were harder. Now the bar is being lowered so more people can go through them. Will these changes let the most casual players stand next to heroic raiders? Of course not - you'd have to be fucking retarded to think that. But it certainly makes it easier for them to gear up for raiding. And if they aren't raiding...then they can get full dungeon heroic gear and feel good about themselves. If they grind their valor points week after week they can get...a handful of T11 point gear.

The point of this game is personal enjoyment. The top raiders got their enjoyment from being first and doing all the content at an increased difficulty. The most casual people get to finish heroics easier and maybe gear up for raiding if they want to try that. Everyone wins. The game shifts as time goes on to favor different people with each tier. If you're a heroic raider, the 5-man heroics mean nothing to you, and you shouldn't care about what they do to them. You already did them. As long as everyone is enjoying the game from their own perspective, then the devs are successful.

[Kadas]

Blizzard has implicitly stated that they intend to ease the difficulty of all encounters as the game progresses. No matter how bad you are, it's not a matter of IF you can do the encounter but WHEN. This is a sound business decision on their part as it ensures that all of their customers will get to experience the content that they've created for us.

People who currently have no problem with these encounters are probably working on more difficult achievements anyway so there is no real impact, except perhaps to make pugging randoms easier. Most raiders I know who would consider this a slight to their own achievements aren't even running 5 mans any longer anyways.

Edit: err... what Scuravolpe said

[commanderbeatdown]

As tiers progress, Blizzard wants as many people as possible to struggle with the latest content; not the first-tier just-dinged-85 content.

There's no reason to pull a "vanilla" where 1% of the population ever saw 40-man Naxx, just so the fattest or smelliest of our populace can feel superior.


The majority who whined about easy heroics in WotLK did not ( and could not) down Arthas on Heroic, despite the game being too "easy".

Furthermore, I'm willing to bet that the same whiners are posting in this thread for the same reason, yet have not downed, or have lied about downing Sinestra.

This game is not too easy. There is always a challenge.

[Téuntjûh]

Really don't understand Blizz.

[ProBubble]

[Who gives a shit? Let the noobies who are having trouble with the heroics have some fun as well] x 2

and when they arent having fun because they haventlearned enough during the heroics to be ready for raiding... nerf the raids too. In fact just make raid bosses manic depressive who will kill themselves if you fail more than 5 times on them.

[Ineras]

The only issue I see with this (if it actually is to allow people who just dinged 85 to catch up for the next raid tier) is that they will be surprised at raid difficulty by essentially going from normal dungeons to raids. I thought it was like stepping stones: normal dungeon > heroic dungeon > raid. It seems like it would be more like normal dungeon > heroic dungeon >>>>> raid with the change. Overall though, seems like a good move for gearing alts, but not so good for new players.

[Nynax]

Im sure everyone here has heard the term "wrath baby" right? Cause thats what this is about. I don't think a raider personally cares that content they out gear anyway is easier. The issue is that if you make mechanics too easy people don't learn because there is no reason to if you can power through it. And when people dont learn the overall skill of the player base drops, and when the over all skill drops people scream to make "hard" stuff easier. and it's a never ending negative spiral until someone (blizz) stops and and says "learn to play the game! if its too hard, GET BETTER"

[helic]

The heroic group I tanked for last night (all pug) had a Ret paly (5k dps) Mage (5.5k dps) and a death knight (11.5k dps) and if it wasent for that dk I would have not gotten that heroic done last night but he is a hero among lfg trash and I hope he knows it. Also dont tell me to just run with a guild/firends group because then they might as well take out the lfg dungeon tool, instead tell blizzard that the tool needs to be re worked a bit because it is not good enough yet. That is all.

[Tholl]

omg i care so much about making my daily heroic easier! I really hate that all these other people might FINALLY be able to do a heroic!!

aaahhh my leetness is crumbling around me with all these bads downing entry level content!!!!


>_>

This has nothing to do with being '733T'. Blizzard has stated that the game plan for Cata was to have people make choices in dungeons and in game that would effect said dungeon runs. By taking out any sort of thinking and decision making in a dungeon they are pretty much running counter to what they told the community Cata was going to be. (An expansion that is vastly different from the Wrath model).

Dumbed down dungeons = Wrath 2.0

Btw I am a casual, and if you cant finish a heroic by now there is something seriously wrong with you.