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  1. #1

    Dying Holy Priest failing, fail fail fail please help!

    I was just inside another Zul'Garub New CATA dungeon. I have completed both of these Heroic dungeons healing them as Holy Priest back on the 27th and 29th of April.

    Since then or more to the point my heals mean nothing in 5 man groups anymore?

    I am posting because I feel I need help!

    I have done just about everything I know how to do and I am at a loss.

    On this last run my Crit heals were hitting the tank for +30K and just vanishing into the void and the tank was dying. I had "Renew on him" I threw a Power word shield on him, and I have Group heals up and Lightwell not sure if he hit that or not.

    Anyhow he simply Vaporized on the firebird fight... I have healed groups through that many times now and the tanks gear was not the worst I have seen in the new CATA dungeons.

    Recount says the Melee are pulling good damage numbers overall?

    As a Priest I feel inadequate broken used up wasted useless and just sucking lint at this point......what has Blizzard done to this class? Or have they just nerfed me server side?

    Top healer in BWD for our guild and completed BOT to Cho'Gall the 4th boss.

    I don't know what else I can do and my gear is about as far as you can go without getting a lucky helm drop off Magmaw and its not dropped yet.

    If I was Spock on Star Trek I would turn to the Captain and say "It makes no sense Jim?"

    I added a screen shot of the Melee output and my Overall heals....I can't even hazard a guess at this point if thats high or low for heal throughput? Oh FYI I never run out of mana with the current gear and the Doll trinket and the other ways to replenish mana I was spamming heals onto tank and party no effect at all....






    I am very very SAD ;( and going to cry!
    Last edited by Oathanvil; 2011-05-05 at 10:32 AM.

  2. #2
    Hi there

    So well. I won't answer in numbers or so, I think your equip should be alright already.

    Maybe any information about the tank would be nice, since I think there's the problem. If there are many adds, the tank should usesome CD's, if he already did, he shouldn't be there, honestly.

    BUT: 30k crits seem little less, use Flash Heal less and mor Greater Heal (>45k crit).
    Also I don't see your single-target-Chakra-spell in your list (forgot how it's called in English...^^), you should use that on CD^^
    ALso use the Emergency-Angel

    If you do this, you should be fine, the rest is up to the tank =)

  3. #3
    You mention Zul'Gurub, but what firebird fight is in there? Do you mean Zul'Aman and the dragonhawk?

    Anyway, you're running recount, so you should be able to bring up the death log there and see what killed the tank. If he just went splat it's likely he was staning in fire or not correctly using his cooldowns. This is assuming _you_ were playing correctly in the first place but since you have cleared BWD I'm assuming you do have your act together.

  4. #4
    The Lightbringer Primernova's Avatar
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    Stay in Serenity Chakra in heroics and use Renew, the "new" Heal spell and HW: Serenity to keep the tank up, their is no need to ever use PW: Shield as holy except for the B&S speed buff. Gheal is only an optiion for a fast top up with a FhealX2 then Gheal, heroic and in some cases raid damage comes fast and you need to stay ahead of the curve in any way possible. Only heal DPS with renew or if the tank and yourself are both nearly full, they have no reason to be taking any damage a renew or CoH shouldn't cover and if you or the tank dies, that's a wipe usually.

    Alot of this may not be your fault either, some tanks are just not setup right or are new to the tanking game and will get flatened, you can't heal a one or two shot tank. They could be pulling too much, bad spec, PvP gear or just gear with wildly imbalanced numbers. Also if you have nevr tried Disc, it may suit you better. Holy is very frenetic and ebbs and flows with damage, Disc is more about damage prevention with more tank cooldowns (I consider penance a cooldown)

    Keep at it, healing is an art that takes time to master but it's well worth the growing pains. GL

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Graograman View Post
    Hi there

    So well. I won't answer in numbers or so, I think your equip should be alright already.

    Maybe any information about the tank would be nice, since I think there's the problem. If there are many adds, the tank should usesome CD's, if he already did, he shouldn't be there, honestly.

    BUT: 30k crits seem little less, use Flash Heal less and mor Greater Heal (>45k crit).
    Also I don't see your single-target-Chakra-spell in your list (forgot how it's called in English...^^), you should use that on CD^^
    ALso use the Emergency-Angel

    If you do this, you should be fine, the rest is up to the tank =)
    From what I could see he is a Palidan and he was using his ability's in the first 3 or 4 boss kills in that instance, that's just another part of this.... there is no consisitancy in the fights anymore, where a group can be so rock solid in one fight and just keep getting owned on another fight and from healing all through Cata as a Dungeon Raised Worgan once you figured out a dungeon and where proficient at healing the original heroic's you could in an emergency pop the O crap! buttons and save a bad pull.

    However in the 2 new cata dungeons its impossible to apply rational presumtions on when to pull a Holy crap button out and even if you do it wont save you and then you sit on Priest 8 minute cooldowns and the other 4 in party have already rezzed and run back to try again and all your crap is on 8 minute 6 minute and 4 minute coold downs.

    Healing in Cata on a Priest is just sucking right now..... and since changes made last week the original Heroic dungeons are kicking my @ss.... something is broken on Priest Holy spec really really badly badly broken.

    It's time for Blizzard to step up and admit it. On a class specific 5 Man Priest can no longer heal a dungeon start to finish! Druids and Palidans are getting walk through's...
    Last edited by Oathanvil; 2011-05-05 at 11:18 AM.

  6. #6
    The Lightbringer Primernova's Avatar
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    Priests are fine, especially Holy for heroics. We have every tool needed, if they are used the right way. Look at his heal breakdown, Renew was #1 then Gheal then Fheal then EoL. That's a slow, high mana cost breakdown. I havn't seen Renew top the chart since ICC and Gheal should never be anywhere near the top 3, it's just too slow and weak. I don't know how is mana was holding up but he also never casted the spamtastic "Heal", this spell sucks by itself but to keep renews rolling all over the place and especially on the tank it's awesome.

    Edit for:

    Just noticed he was using Inner Will instead of Inner Fire, Inner Will is for running back after a wipe only OP.
    Last edited by Primernova; 2011-05-05 at 11:29 AM.

  7. #7
    My Greater Heal is the 30K heal my Flash heal hits for a little less at just over 15K

    My current spec's are: Un-Buffed

    Health: 114817
    Mana: 94217
    Gear item lv = 357 and equiped it's 356 PvE gear, no PvP gear on at all and the 357 itlv is with a Purple PvE wand I dont like as it has no spirit on it so I dont use it.

    Stam: 5128
    Intel: 4804
    Spirit: 2270

    Spell Power: 6749
    Haste: 14.37 = 1414 +11.04%
    Out of combat mana regen: 3660
    In combat Mana regen: 3134
    Spell Crit chance: 11.54 =340 +1.90% I also forged as much Crit to Mastery as an option with no help at all and any remaining Crit is from equiped items.
    Mastery: 13.59 =1003 +5.59% With current gear and fordging this is as high as I can get Mastery for now.

    Full enchants and belt buckle as well as the BoT healer staff and heartsong enchant. All gems correctly gemmed and META operational in Helm.

    I cant keep them alive I don't understand it, it's not always been this bad just since the 29th or so last April it's turned to crap!
    Last edited by Oathanvil; 2011-05-05 at 11:33 AM.

  8. #8
    I would like to see not overall heal (12 million, hehe), but for that fight. Fights are not healing intensive, unless your group fails. You can heal a boss in these instances with 700k healing... and the same fight with 2.3 million healing too. You can imagine the difference between them.

  9. #9
    I agree and wish I had it reset before that fight but I was sorta busy getting my @ss handed to me.

    I just rem the tanks name is "Shytstorm" I can just make it out in the picture and going to go view him now.

    http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...ytstorm/simple

    I feel even worse now he is an experianced tank all through ICC to CATA with BWD boss kills and one BOT boss kill.

    See this just does not make any sense why I could not heal him What the Fudge is going ON?
    Last edited by Oathanvil; 2011-05-05 at 11:44 AM.

  10. #10
    The Lightbringer Primernova's Avatar
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    The last patch gave us the new ZA/ZG, they are much harder then the normal Cata heroics and players aren't used to doing them yet . Nothing was nerfed for priests this patch except taking friendly dispels away from Shadow and PW: Shield only lasting 15 secs. Trivial nerfs at best since Weakend Soul is also 15 secs and Shadow can still dispel friendlies with Mass Dispel.

    Big numbers are not what you are looking for when healing now. You want speed and for the spells to work together. Keep renews rolling with Heal spam (any direct heal will refresh it in Serenity Chakra including the instant) Only cast Gheal after 2 Fheals for the Serendipity proc and only if the tank is in desperate need. Never use PW: Shield, that's a Disc toy we just use it to make ppl zip around with stars trailing behind them lol. Always run with Inner Fire, the spellpower boost is far better then 15% less mana cost to Renew and CoH.

  11. #11
    hum well I get along well with Gheal. It's my main-spam-spell in fact. For Heal is a wet fart and Flashheal consumes too many mana for +-20k Ifind it is a good choice.

    As there is statet that you shall go for Haste-Plateau then mastery, I ignore that in all glory. Currently I'm at 15 % haste with only 10.3x mastery and it really worksforme. Gheal isn't too slow anymore and PoH also.
    For some fights, I put up blue chakra for groupheal, mainly because of the stronger renew and PöH-CoH spam. I love that ^^

    For our cd's, I almost nexer use Divine Hymn in heroics, but I use it in raids. Emergency-angel is also often used^^

    This is mainly everything I can give you for advice. Hope that helps.

  12. #12
    I heal zg/za just fine as holy. I actually prefer holy over disc in 5 mans because i find it to be more efficient because of all the aoe dmg.

    Holy spec is not broken. It is at its best shape of its life actually.

    Following could be the problem:
    1. tank is pulling too much. no cc has been done.
    ------ important. healing through this instance without cc is like pretty much slap in the face.
    2. tank is under geared for the dungeon.
    ------- could be since your ilvl should be way higher than the recommended blizzard has set (tank wise anyway)
    3. Your 5 man holy healing skill is not that polished.
    ------- holy raid healing and holy 5 man healing are completely different from one another. You have to be way more aware in zg/za 5 man than healing BOT or BWD which is kind of dumb.

    always stick with single healing chakra and use the HW/PoM/CoH on CD. spam heal and when the tank starts taking spike dmgs which is every trash pull it seems like... do the flash healx2 then GH combo while still spamming those spells on CD. if you get lucky your surge of light will proc here and there which saves alot of mana.

    dont feel so bad when dps dies since they shouldnt be pulling aggro anyway. especially in these instances.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Primernova View Post
    The last patch gave us the new ZA/ZG, they are much harder then the normal Cata heroics and players aren't used to doing them yet . Nothing was nerfed for priests this patch except taking friendly dispels away from Shadow and PW: Shield only lasting 15 secs. Trivial nerfs at best since Weakend Soul is also 15 secs and Shadow can still dispel friendlies with Mass Dispel.

    Big numbers are not what you are looking for when healing now. You want speed and for the spells to work together. Keep renews rolling with Heal spam (any direct heal will refresh it in Serenity Chakra including the instant) Only cast Gheal after 2 Fheals for the Serendipity proc and only if the tank is in desperate need. Never use PW: Shield, that's a Disc toy we just use it to make ppl zip around with stars trailing behind them lol. Always run with Inner Fire, the spellpower boost is far better then 15% less mana cost to Renew and CoH.
    Yes I have been toggling between Inner Fire and Inner will depending ont eh fight lengths, also Power Word Sheild is a last resort that can improve healing onto a tank and tricks like using single target dispel on them also increasing healing to them for a short period.

    I fully agree with what you guys are saying and I have been doing all of it and still getting my @ss handed to me and my healing through-put from what you have said on Greater heal looks like mine is 15K to low>....... I get 30K you say you get 45K? Are you in T11 gear then? because I am ranked as slotted for every slot at lv 359 that cataclysmic title or whatever. No way on gods green earth can I pop a 45K Greater heal it's just NOT there for me on this Priest.

    Ready to rage quit WoW, as I have run out of options.
    Last edited by Oathanvil; 2011-05-05 at 11:56 AM.

  14. #14
    I suggest stacking mastery as it is great for tank healing, use Holy Word: Serenity with Renew and Heal. PoM is worth is for a quick heal. Flash heal only when you are desperate for a quick heal and Holy Word: Serenity is on CD, Inner fire is the better spell to have active!
    Victoria Concordia Crescit


  15. #15
    I leveled this toon from lv10 in dungeon finder to lv 85 in dungeons. he jsut hit 500 quests completed in TB doing the dailys. That's all this toon did was 5 mans, the raid healing is newer to the toon and its been to the end of BOT...... that's why I cant make sense of any of this Horse Hockey!

  16. #16
    Herald of the Titans Ynna's Avatar
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    Priest were not nerfed, and I healed Zul'Aman the other day in a PuG with no significant healing problems (apart from a DK who liked fire too much). Your healing breakdown seems wrong. Too much Renew, not enough Heal and Holy Word: Serenity. There is nothing going on, the only thing that changed since the patch have been convenience fixes like infinite duration Inner Will/Fire and Chakra. Your eagerness to blame the class and not your group or yourself is alarming. If you really consider yourself a good priest, you should be able to adapt to weird or ever-changing healing needs. Holy Priest have a tool for every situation.

    @Primernova: I wouldn't say Greater Heal should be only cast with stacks of Serendipity up. In the Zul'Aman I healed I was replacing a lot of my Heals with Greater Heals. If the tank is not at a critical level, but low enough that you need more than one Heal, Greater Heal is an excellent tool.
    Retired Holy Priest
    As a rule, I try to act on the internet as I would in real life. If I have offended you, feel free to point it out. Unless I meant to offend you, I will probably apologize.

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Oathanvil View Post
    I leveled this toon from lv10 in dungeon finder to lv 85 in dungeons. he jsut hit 500 quests completed in TB doing the dailys. That's all this toon did was 5 mans, the raid healing is newer to the toon and its been to the end of BOT...... that's why I cant make sense of any of this Horse Hockey!
    I did the same thing^^ Haven't even hit 500 quests by now


    But in some way, I feel like I'm doing something wrong here :/
    You all reforge in another way, use adifferent spell etc, I don't get it if it is wrong, becaus I think I do my job quite good...^^

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Oathanvil View Post
    Ready to rage quit WoW, as I have run out of options.
    You have to realize when you can't do anything to not let die people in your group. If they are standing in the fire, they will die. It's not your fault. That damn bird even turns to that groupmember for like 2 sec that he is about to spit with fire. Fire bubbles are big, and they have plenty time to escape. Tanks are not just punching bags for bosses anymore, they have to move too.
    Like I said, these bosses can be healed with 700k healing. And with 2.3 milion. Average is 1-1.2 million.
    And, to be honest, if you done eagle boss in ZA without problem, I think you have done the hardest boss in ZA. That boss can be a pain, especially with 3 melee that you had (tank, rogue, warri)
    Last edited by Lei; 2011-05-05 at 12:07 PM.

  19. #19
    The Lightbringer Primernova's Avatar
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    Everything you need to know is in this thread, you just need to break out of a bad style of healing and relearn the cycle. Gear made very little difference for me doing heroics and raids this whole Xpac, from greens/blues to full epics it still works about the same. Just have to get that quick response down and make the heals buff eachother.

    ---------- Post added 2011-05-05 at 12:15 PM ----------

    @Primernova: I wouldn't say Greater Heal should be only cast with stacks of Serendipity up. In the Zul'Aman I healed I was replacing a lot of my Heals with Greater Heals. If the tank is not at a critical level, but low enough that you need more than one Heal, Greater Heal is an excellent tool.

    I can't say I have never used Gheal all by itself but by and large, Fhealx2 and then Gheal is the burst heal for holy and far more effective at pulling the tank out of the death zone. Heal spam is effective 99% of the time and I just hate the "pucker factor" of such an expensive (potentially weak with no crit) and slow heal on any target. I've lost alot of tanks and even DPS using big slow heals over the years to ever entertain using them normally.

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Graograman View Post
    hum well I get along well with Gheal. It's my main-spam-spell in fact. For Heal is a wet fart and Flashheal consumes too many mana for +-20k Ifind it is a good choice.

    As there is statet that you shall go for Haste-Plateau then mastery, I ignore that in all glory. Currently I'm at 15 % haste with only 10.3x mastery and it really worksforme. Gheal isn't too slow anymore and PoH also.
    For some fights, I put up blue chakra for groupheal, mainly because of the stronger renew and PöH-CoH spam. I love that ^^

    For our cd's, I almost nexer use Divine Hymn in heroics, but I use it in raids. Emergency-angel is also often used^^

    This is mainly everything I can give you for advice. Hope that helps.
    Aye I use all that the angel the whole nine yards, are we all aware that Holy spec has up to 45 different total ability's including both chakra states, and abilitys to replace mana. I use every trick there is in the book it's not working anymore.

    Current Spec for 5 man Healing! I use the same spec for RAID heals accept I have Lightwell slotted as a Prime Glyph instead of Flash Heal.





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    Last edited by Oathanvil; 2011-05-05 at 12:31 PM.

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