1. #1
    Epic! solvexx's Avatar
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    None of the stickies here have info for new priests!

    Im looking to take up shadow for leveling and disc for end game.
    Is there any VERY VERY simple guides on the basics of those two specs tha you guys could link for me?

    Thanks! I literally am looking for the very basic guides on what priority to use for both. thanks

  2. #2
    http://wow.joystiq.com/category/priest/ Should hold most of your leveling needs np.

    you MIGHT want to look at wowpro, and no I don't use their addon. but james has been doing some great guides since tbc. (at least that I remember)

    When you start really learning the class, aka 85 nowadays...
    http://shadowpriest.com
    hell i"ll give a shout out to matt. http://www.worldofmatticus.com/ he's worth the read. I like the guy.
    http://elitistjerks.com/f77/

    oh and the bubble chick, http://forthebubbles.wordpress.com/

    http://manaflask.com/
    and I"ll give it to our own lil pony, jhazrun, http://www.paragon.fi/forum/viewforum.php?f=35 if you have a real question.. and need a view point.. well. /salute to paragon for getting that done, and done well. =) pretty good overlooked forum for some stuff.
    /cheers.
    Last edited by discombobulate; 2011-05-29 at 07:44 AM.

  3. #3
    Bloodsail Admiral Thundertom's Avatar
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    I'm a bit hesitant to say this as well, but the priest forums to me (a new priest) are more discussion about stuff and theorycrafting about 0orb MBs then just sharing some basic info, without getting too daunting.

    If you take for example the Warrior forums; http://www.mmo-champion.com/forums/278-Warrior , You get some basic info stickies everyone understands, with some discussion attached to it, but the real discussion goes on in other topics.

    Sorry if this comes across rude. That's not my intention.

  4. #4
    Herald of the Titans Ynna's Avatar
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    It's not rude, but you have to keep in mind that someone has to actually write these guides. I started to write the Holy guide after there were too many threads going: "Waaaaaaaaaaah, I can't heal as holy, help plz." right after the launch of Cataclysm. If no-one is writing them, they can't be stickied. So, maybe you could try and make a basic guide of your experiences as a new Discipline/Shadow Priest.
    Retired Holy Priest
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  5. #5
    Bloodsail Admiral Thundertom's Avatar
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    That's the whole thing.

    As people start to heal, they look for tips and advice on these forums. They want to know what stats to focus on, and what healing styles are available. What spells and stats they should be using, and what the pro's do. IMO this information should be easy to find. If you're looking for more in depth stuff, you probably know how to forum search, because you're looking for something specific.

    They (me) don't really care about discussing 0orb mindblast versus getting .0023% more haste out of eating twinkies.

    Your guide, actually, was the most useful one (THANKS!), and I was kinda surprised it being hidden within a sticky, which basically is a sticky filled with threads that should be sticky, but aren't sticky.

  6. #6
    While I cannot attest to shadow, the problem with disc healing is the lack of the "best" answer for all cases. I could write a guide that's all like:

    "Yo. Stack X. Press PW:S on lowest HP members who will take damage within the next 15sec, Penance & ProM on CD, PoH when entire raid is low, GH when PoH can't hit 3 people w/o overheal, FH if critical. Binding heal if you and/or someone else are critical. Renew & Holy Nova are teh sux. Win."

    But this isn't really telling you anything you'll not learn by running a few 5mans. As such, it doesn't help the disc healer to grow, or present them with information that helps them to think beyond the guide.

    Disc tank healing is a whole different ball game than Disc raid healing. Within Disc raid and tank healing, there are different ball games. A definitive answer cannot be given because there are too many variables to look at [raid comp, raid size, item budget, latency, specific encounter, specific phase of a specific encounter].

    "Priority," as it is, then, is situational for the disc healer. There are cases even when Renew and Holy Nova [the two least used spells by disc] are a "priority" for a specific GCD. For instance, if damage isn't going to go out on the raid in the next 15sec, WS is on the tank, ProM is on CD, the raid is topped, and you are moving, then Renew on the tank is actually the "priority" for that GCD.

    My suggestion to any new disc healer who wants to learn the "basics" is to read the tooltips and go slosh through some 5mans. Once you have a handle on how the heals interact with your stats [is your PW:S feeling weak? Does your PoH feel slow? Are you not getting enough DA procs on GH?], then a guide can serve as foundation to better understand those relationships.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Thundertom View Post
    I was kinda surprised it being hidden within a sticky, which basically is a sticky filled with threads that should be sticky, but aren't sticky.
    Since those stickies were unstickied and hidden within stickies, the number of new "simple question, simple answer" type threads has greatly increased and you rarely ever see a new post in the guides or the "State of the Spec" threads anymore =/ I know the Rules sticky says Guides, also, but seems most people dont notice that. I vote Kelesti at least resticky the spec guides, if not the others!

  8. #8
    Bloodsail Admiral Thundertom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by spiralout View Post
    Since those stickies were unstickied and hidden within stickies, the number of new "simple question, simple answer" type threads has greatly increased and you rarely ever see a new post in the guides or the "State of the Spec" threads anymore =/ I know the Rules sticky says Guides, also, but seems most people dont notice that. I vote Kelesti at least resticky the spec guides, if not the others!
    I do agree that there shouldn't be 32921 stickies, but maybe as you suggested a sticky to a guide for each spec, and perhaps some basic priest info sticky should make this forum a lot more accessible to new priests.

  9. #9
    Field Marshal Grizzlehorn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by [-Spiritus-] View Post
    My suggestion to any new disc healer who wants to learn the "basics" is to read the tooltips and go slosh through some 5mans. Once you have a handle on how the heals interact with your stats [is your PW:S feeling weak? Does your PoH feel slow? Are you not getting enough DA procs on GH?], then a guide can serve as foundation to better understand those relationships.
    This.

    I have a lot of people ask me for tips on my server, and of course I'm glad to help. At the same time, the most obvious answer to "How do I heal as a Priest?" is almost always "Use the right spell for the job". It is very difficult to explain via tells how to do something, or even with a short guide. Ynna wrote a nice guide for beginner Holy Priests, and half of it is explaining what abilities do. That's because using the right spell for the job is 90% of the battle, and making these decision on the fly is what makes you a good healer.

    My personal tip for any new healer is to do what I did with all of these forums, read everything. You'll see a lot of arguing and there is rarely a 'right' answer for most issues. However, you will learn about different issues from both sides of the argument.

    Oh, and it should be mentioned that there is a sticky guide for each spec and a leveling guide. See the guides section. They are 'hidden' but from what I understand Kel didn't have a choice on that one (we apparently had too many stickies or something). They aren't going to answer every question, but they are a great starting point for any new Priest.
    Last edited by Grizzlehorn; 2011-05-31 at 03:40 PM.

  10. #10
    Cookie Monster Radux's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by spiralout View Post
    Since those stickies were unstickied and hidden within stickies, the number of new "simple question, simple answer" type threads has greatly increased and you rarely ever see a new post in the guides or the "State of the Spec" threads anymore =/ I know the Rules sticky says Guides, also, but seems most people dont notice that. I vote Kelesti at least resticky the spec guides, if not the others!
    Look at it from our end, though. Priest forum had like 7 stickies at the top of the page. It got cluttered compared to many other class forums. Those Guides are still available for everyone to use. Hell, the top sticky specifically says "Guides". If they can't be bothered to click on that to find their answer, then why have anything sticked at all? (plus if things get too cluttered, it's beyond our control -- we do as we're told)

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Radux View Post
    Look at it from our end, though. Priest forum had like 7 stickies at the top of the page. It got cluttered compared to many other class forums.
    While I normally don't step into stuff like this, and I 100% understand the "do as told" argument, the reason why the priest forum had so many guides stickied is because it has many active, quality, and original writers contributing to the community on MMO in comparison to other class forums. Also, I believe only New's guide was created around the time of the contest. Most others had no motivation other than to provide a resource.

    None of the stickied materials up previously were fluff. They were placed there because they gave answers to common questions. Before they went up, for example, the forum was inundated with questions like does "X trinket or Y trinket give me more regen?" Then, when Danner compiled the regen trinket list and was stickied, those questions subsided. When we "cleaned" the sticky list, they picked back up.

    What is more cluttered? 15 threads per week on X v. Y, or one stickied thread that covers an oft breached subject?

    As a forum admin myself, I can attest to the fact that people do not read the "super admin everything you need to know about posting on this forum" sticky, especially when you slap [READ BEFORE POSTING]. C'man, seriously? You know every poster looks at that and goes "Yeah, yeah, I know whats in that thread: blah blah blah, don't be a douche, w/e." I believe the admins here realize that as well.

    Did the priest forums get "cluttered," or did the priest forums just have more and better content to be showcased? Don't know for certain, but the company line first given was that all the community forums went through a "cleaning" for, paraphrasing, uniformity's sake. While I don't understand why all the class forums need to be uniform, I can at least have solace in knowing that it was an across the board action...

    ...oh wait, Warlock Forums.

  12. #12
    Cookie Monster Radux's Avatar
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    Oh no I agree with you Spiritus. It's like I don't look outside of my own forum or anything (it's rare, but I'll browse other class forums sometimes). I won't disagree that Priest stickies in the past were very active and helpful.

    It really does go back to what you (and I guess I) said about doing what we're told. Without going into too much detail about it or anything, some mods are a little more active than others. The ones not super active are more than a little difficult to reach to have them do a ton of work.

    Basically Boubouille wanted all class forums to be like the Rogue forum when they only had 1 sticky (a compendium full of random shit). They've changed it up some since then. And I guess there are just more important things to do at the moment. I dunno -- I don't attempt to guess what he does behind the scenes.

    My original point was that those old stickies are still around via links inside a Guide compendium. If people can't be asked to see that and open it to go to said guide, then they don't really want to help their own character very much or just want to be spoon fed. If it's actually difficult to find something like that, then fine -- new thread + answers.

  13. #13
    Yeah, I don't want to start a thing over this, but it would be nice to have an answer as to why the Warlock Forum moderators clearly didn't get the memo, while the Priest Forum community consistently has said the forum topics and discussions were better when the active guides were directly stickied as opposed to nestled in a stickied thread that screams "don't read me, nothing new here."

    I understand the want to have a uniform forum structure. It makes it easy to navigate. Except, there clearly isn't any uniformity, and the Priest Forum community generally prefers its stickies to be in plain sight.

  14. #14
    Keyboard Turner PhoenixUnderFire's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by enthus View Post
    Im looking to take up shadow for leveling and disc for end game.
    Is there any VERY VERY simple guides on the basics of those two specs tha you guys could link for me?

    Thanks! I literally am looking for the very basic guides on what priority to use for both. thanks
    Hey bro, are you planning on going full Heirloom for leveling? If so make sure you double up on the Intel Trinks, and then spam your nukes... Mind Spike and Mind Blast. You'll have the cooldown pretty quick through tallent trees... and if you double or triple stack MS then MB is Instant Cast. Keep SWeath next to them on your hot bar, and literally everything is easy mode until Northrend, when you may actually be required to use your DoTs and Mind Flay.

    Up until then, I'd say you'd only need the DoTs and Mind Flay on boss fights in dungeons.

    Disc however, is a very low mana efficient healing spec... Stack Mastery for better Shields, always Shield (you get mana when the shield breaks), Penance should always be on CD. Prayer of Healing if your group has all taken damage. Prayer of Mending if two people are taking damage. Binding Heal when that two people are you and another person. NEVER Flash heal unless you MUST! Through a few reg "Heals" out when everything is on CD. Pain Suppress if your shield breaks too early. And when you can... spec into the 2 point Shadowfiend CD reducer in the shadow tree after level 69.

    Oh, and every piece of gear you have for Disc should have spirit on it. Mastery>>>>>>>>>Crit/Haste.

    Shadow, use whatever Spirit and Haste gear you come across for the Spirit=Hit usage, once you hit 17% hit and a good 32+% (with the 5% Shadow Priest buff) start stacking Crit/Haste gear, like the epic tailor legs. So essentially for shadow. INT. Spirit = Hit (8% Heroic 5 mans, 17% Raids) HASTE!!!!!>>>>>>>Crit/Mastery.

    Any questions? Feel free the PM me...

    Good luck with your new toon... have fun with it.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by PhoenixUnderFire View Post
    snip
    I appreciate your willingness to help out with some info, even if its not precisely what the OP and conversation are asking for. That being said, Mind Spike is a level 81 ability and so is mostly unhelpful for learning priests likely beginning at level 1.

    OT: My best advice? Go try things. Spend mana. Die. Then learn and repeat. Nothing is better for learning than doing.

  16. #16
    Herald of the Titans Ynna's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dharmabhum View Post
    OT: My best advice? Go try things. Spend mana. Die. Then learn and repeat. Nothing is better for learning than doing.
    This is true. It's how I learned almost everything I know. But I've also learned a good deal by reading forums and fan sites and it's always nice to have something to guide you, especially when the enjoyment of other people depends on it, which is often the case with people who leveled to 85 as Shadow and then want to try out healing. I could've learned how to drive a car by trial an error, but I'm glad I had people to teach me.
    Retired Holy Priest
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  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Dharmabhum View Post
    OT: My best advice? Go try things. Spend mana. Die. Then learn and repeat. Nothing is better for learning than doing.
    If you're starting out from very low level, this is really it. The strength of any of your spells is going to vary greatly with each level and only really even out when you get to 70ish plus. We can give you a ton of tips to maximize DPS on a raid boss, but if you're questing in STV, you're not going to be using a raid DPS spell priority system.

    What I can definitely say is that Disc is awesomely OP with heirlooms at low levels and you can probably run around doing that for questing until you can dual spec at 30. I'd suggest practicing healing in low-level dungeons if that's what you want to do at 85; it gives you some good experience and starts building an instinct for how to play Disc, even if the gnitty gritty numbers and fine-tuning aren't there yet.

    Shadow while levelling will vary by level. I remember almost never fully dotting a target (unless it was one of the bosses in a dungeon) because I'd go oom all the time and it was better DPS to MB or MF without the DoTs. You'll also find yourself switching between what DoTs to use; for example, SW:P may be your best DoT at level 30ish, but DP may do better at 70ish (hypothetically), so you may cast one and not the other at different levels. A good addon to manage this is Dr. Damage (just shows a breakdown of DPS, DPE, total damage, etc when you mouseover your action bar) so you can learn how to maximize your DPS at each level. If you just want the shadowspec to quest quickly, then don't worry too much about it; heirlooms will make you OP anyway. If you really want to learn shadow to raid for it, then you have to learn it as you go, because our raiding advice really doesn't apply well to levelling.

  18. #18
    There were several awesome stickies on this forum, until some admins decided we couldn't have them anymore. Our priest moderaters didn't get why, and i'm sure most of our active readers/posters didn't either.

    Since then this part of the forum has been polluted a lot more with the same questions over and over again, and most of the real ' in depth ' discussions went away. Sure we have the stickes with links in them, but that simply doesn't have the same impact in keeping a thread active.


    So Kel, where do we fill the petition to get our stickies back up?

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