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  1. #21
    I am Murloc!
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    I am both amused and annoyed by "But Blizzard does it all the time, why are you suprised?!".
    Actually, they don't. Yes, of course there are nerfs every major content patch - and numerous hotfixes, too. But let's look at the scale of it. Pretty much everything has been nerfed by 20% - that's almost Sunwell scale right there. In addition to that, numerous skills have been further tweaked, in some cases damage/effects got halved, meaning total comes out to more than 20%. It's pretty much Sunwell patch, except done "mid" expansion. Changing entire tier into Naxx - which they even confirm is their intention, with "introductory raid". The question is, how easy things must be to consider them "introductory" - and what comes later, once "introductory" raid has been completed?

    But that's fine, it's old content, and being 13/13 it doesn't affect me. I just don't accept the "nerfing bosses by 1/3 is normal practice that was hapenning since always! I am so wise and great for pointing it out, even though it isn't true". So far it has only happened with Sunwell, and this is the second time. Even ICC buff didn't happen instantly - plus it didn't change any mechanics, just allowed to power through them with more hp/dps, which is happening anyway.

  2. #22
    My main will be in Firelands. I'll finally be able to pug on a more convenient schedule on my alts. I see no issues here. It's been happening forever, it's nothing new at all.

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Siggma View Post
    if your in Firelands raids, why would you care what they do to previous raids ?

    The "Nerf" as people call it benifits everyone, I have several alts that will enjoy the content in its easier form, and my main will be happily going through firelands.
    I agree with this post. Same applies for me. Gives the casual players or people with less time something to achieve on the times when they are free or get a raid together.

  4. #24
    Sorry, but why you even care?
    You will not even step in tier11 raids any more. Firelands waiting.
    Your message is something like "Omg, they are nerfing naxxramas! Now green-geared pugs can kill Kel'Thuzad without even knowing tactics! I spent 4 month wiping in naxx to get my ilvl213 gear!"

    Leave poor pugs alone. 20% nerf is just nothing. They still will not be able to kill most bosses even on normal difficulty. Most pugs will see Sinestra in next expansion.

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by llcjay1 View Post
    As someone who cannot raid on a schedule because of real life time constraints, this will make it easier for me to pug these raids in 4.2. I have not even been able to step into the Cata raids (other than BH) because of the lack of pugs available (at least on my realm). Making the game more accessible is not a bad thing. Especially considering that only normal modes are being nerfed.
    this game is not meant to be pugged. it is a Massivevly Multiplayer Online Role Playing Game. it is not Solo call of duty. this is a social game, and if you can't invest enough time to play it with some friends, then don't expect to get anywhere in raids. EVER. it is NOT anyone else than your problem that you don't have time to play the game. why should it go out over the people who HAVE time to play the game, that you can't?
    Jeez! selfishness at it's worst! > and blizzard is people with mindest like you?! f*ck this game is screwed then...

  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Flashshield View Post
    this game is not meant to be pugged. it is a Massivevly Multiplayer Online Role Playing Game. it is not Solo call of duty. this is a social game, and if you can't invest enough time to play it with some friends, then don't expect to get anywhere in raids. EVER. it is NOT anyone else than your problem that you don't have time to play the game. why should it go out over the people who HAVE time to play the game, that you can't?
    Jeez! selfishness at it's worst! > and blizzard is people with mindest like you?! f*ck this game is screwed then...
    Hey genius, it requires utilizing the social element of this game to assemble a proper pug
    I am Dave ! Yognaught, and I have the balls!

  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Sanctioned View Post
    Can people find a way to not bitch about every single thing in this game. Look at the damn nerf this way. Say a guild gets a new recruit or somebody rerolls to help the guild out and the guild already has everybody that they want to have the legendary. Oh well shit guys the new guy needs the normal versions of t11 so they can start getting the legendary, oh nvm it's been nerfed so it'll be a quick fun trip down memory lane. You douchebags being so l33t like you are if you're complaing remember that the heroic modes aren't touched so go do them while you stroke your epeen, you shouldn't even be doing normal modes.
    so i am not allowed to care about normal mode? HAVE YOU READ ANYTHING THAT I WROTE AT ALL?!
    this game is NOT only meant to be played at HC level.

  8. #28
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    Can we put all these in one huge giant 4.2 qq nerf thread please. Same thoughts as the last 10 times they did this, it doesn't affect me. It's old content. It's been out since December. If I'm going back to T-11 tier I'm either going for achievements to get a mount (if they dont remove it), helping/carrying some friends, or in need of some easy maelstorm crystals which I could get from ZG/ZA.

  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Bigsilly View Post
    Hey genius, it requires utilizing the social element of this game to assemble a proper pug
    there is no such thing as a proper pug. if you think a pug is proper, then you know the guys. and if you know the guys you are rading with, and you do it on regular basis, then you are not a pug, but a guild. seeing what gear the people have, do NOT say ANYTHING about their abilty to play the game AT ALL

    ---------- Post added 2011-05-25 at 04:34 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Naidia View Post
    Can we put all these in one huge giant 4.2 qq nerf thread please. Same thoughts as the last 10 times they did this, it doesn't affect me. It's old content. It's been out since December. If I'm going back to T-11 tier I'm either going for achievements to get a mount (if they dont remove it), helping/carrying some friends, or in need of some easy maelstorm crystals which I could get from ZG/ZA.
    the only thing you said there, was that YOU did not want it. so you are completely careless about what playerbase the game gets? if there is no challenges, then people won't become any good. and then when some people from your raid team quit, then you will only be able to replace him/her with a scrub. and that will hurt your abilty to raid. ALOT, gear or not

  10. #30
    Stood in the Fire
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    Do threads like this actually produce anything significant? Having individuals trudge through regular modes with no reduction/nerf is genuinely a waste of time. How does a non-nerfed fight make you better? "Oh hey this thing hits me really hard!" +1 Player Skill, "Fire is burning my feet!" +1 Player skill, so on and so forth. Reduction isnt going to kill competition it simply allows more to enjoy more of the game they choose to play.

  11. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by traen View Post
    Sorry, but why you even care?
    You will not even step in tier11 raids any more. Firelands waiting.
    Your message is something like "Omg, they are nerfing naxxramas! Now green-geared pugs can kill Kel'Thuzad without even knowing tactics! I spent 4 month wiping in naxx to get my ilvl213 gear!"

    Leave poor pugs alone. 20% nerf is just nothing. They still will not be able to kill most bosses even on normal difficulty. Most pugs will see Sinestra in next expansion.


    omfg is there NO ONE who actually READ what i write?!

    A. i care because i still have yet to complete the content, and i want the games i play to actually give something that looks like a challenge.
    B. no, i did NEVER say ANYTHING like "Omg, they are nerfing naxxramas! Now green-geared pugs can kill Kel'Thuzad without even knowing tactics! I spent 4 month wiping in naxx to get my ilvl213 gear!" what i did in fact say, was that the game should NOT be nerfed, because people are still having trouble with it. NEWSFLASH! IT IS A GOOD THING THAT PEOPLE HAVE A CHALLENGE! IT IS BAD WHEN THEY CAN FACEROLL IT, AND STILL GET REWARDED!

  12. #32
    Stood in the Fire
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    Why is the most simple concept lost in translation these days? A person chooses to play/be better not the obstacle he/she is presented with. The content wont make you better...you make yourself better.

  13. #33
    I completely agree with making the content easier as new tiers are released, and making gear easier to obtain.

    There are plenty of good players out there that do not raid. I never raided in Vanilla, but early in TBC I by chance was part of a 5-man where they were impressed with my performance and recommended I join their guild for raiding.

    Had that 5-man occurred a few months later they would never dream of recruiting me because I cannot effectively contribute. Would a guild in Black Temple recruit a heroic-dungeon-geared player? No. I know they wouldn't because my guild didn't. The time and effort needed to get them to effectively contribute to the raid took longer than waiting to find a better applicant.

    Nerfing content and making valor point items accessible is a good thing for the raiding community. It gives guilds looking for recruits a much, much larger sampling of players to be able to instantly contribute in more meaningful ways to their raids. It also gives those who do not have the time to raid a way of improving their character and not quitting the game due to the boredom of running content that they already have BiS.

  14. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by Fedexkilla View Post
    Do threads like this actually produce anything significant? Having individuals trudge through regular modes with no reduction/nerf is genuinely a waste of time. How does a non-nerfed fight make you better? "Oh hey this thing hits me really hard!" +1 Player Skill, "Fire is burning my feet!" +1 Player skill, so on and so forth. Reduction isnt going to kill competition it simply allows more to enjoy more of the game they choose to play.
    i really, REALLY hope that you are trolling, otherwise you are the most navie person on this planet.
    A. "how does a non-nerfed fight make you better?" that is like asking "how are Ensidia better than puggers, just because they are playing at a harder difficulty?"
    B. i did never once mention a word about competetion, not in my post, or in any of my replies.
    C. no matter what you think, playing something on super easymode is NOT enjoyable. that is like enabeling "god mode" in any game, and think that it will be fun

  15. #35
    So your main moan is that there will be no challenge left for you? I'm sorry to sound rude, if that is the case your argument really is invalid.

    There is t11 Heroic, t12, and t12 heroic.

    It would be the same as moaning about them releasing new expansions, because it makes older content easier. Or allowing users to level up, which makes those deers too easy.

    I know this isn't really what you are trying to get across, so don't get pissy and throw your poorly written sentences back at me please.

  16. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Siggma View Post
    if your in Firelands raids, why would you care what they do to previous raids ?

    The "Nerf" as people call it benifits everyone, I have several alts that will enjoy the content in its easier form, and my main will be happily going through firelands.
    My thoughts exactly.

  17. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by Flashshield View Post
    omfg is there NO ONE who actually READ what i write?!

    A. i care because i still have yet to complete the content, and i want the games i play to actually give something that looks like a challenge.
    B. no, i did NEVER say ANYTHING like "Omg, they are nerfing naxxramas! Now green-geared pugs can kill Kel'Thuzad without even knowing tactics! I spent 4 month wiping in naxx to get my ilvl213 gear!" what i did in fact say, was that the game should NOT be nerfed, because people are still having trouble with it. NEWSFLASH! IT IS A GOOD THING THAT PEOPLE HAVE A CHALLENGE! IT IS BAD WHEN THEY CAN FACEROLL IT, AND STILL GET REWARDED!
    4 months wiping in Naxx is nothing when you consider that by the time Firelands is released you're looking at 7 months.

    If you can't clear normal by the time the next tier is released, then you probably need the nerf. If you don't like that, then figure out how you can improve so it doesn't happen again. The raiding community has never had so much accessible content to help you better yourself as a player and as a guild.

  18. #38
    Stood in the Fire PromiscuousPenguin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Siggma View Post
    if your in Firelands raids, why would you care what they do to previous raids ?

    The "Nerf" as people call it benifits everyone, I have several alts that will enjoy the content in its easier form, and my main will be happily going through firelands.
    Agree. Thank you saving me the trouble of reading through more of this thread.

  19. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by Flashshield View Post
    omfg is there NO ONE who actually READ what i write?!

    A. i care because i still have yet to complete the content, and i want the games i play to actually give something that looks like a challenge.
    B. no, i did NEVER say ANYTHING like "Omg, they are nerfing naxxramas! Now green-geared pugs can kill Kel'Thuzad without even knowing tactics! I spent 4 month wiping in naxx to get my ilvl213 gear!" what i did in fact say, was that the game should NOT be nerfed, because people are still having trouble with it. NEWSFLASH! IT IS A GOOD THING THAT PEOPLE HAVE A CHALLENGE! IT IS BAD WHEN THEY CAN FACEROLL IT, AND STILL GET REWARDED!
    No one read what you wrote because your post looks like it belongs in the diary under you mattress. Get to the point so people don't lose interest in what you have to say.

    A. Welcome back, good luck catching up.
    B.The game SHOULD be nerfed because people are still having trouble with it. This tier has been around long enough that the vast majority have either completed it and won't care about the nerf (as you can see in this thread) or are really struggling and need the content to be nerfed in order to complete it.

    It's a shame that you aren't ready to move on to the next tier, but you are in the minority and should be able to see why this nerf is warranted.

  20. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by Flashshield View Post
    the only thing you said there, was that YOU did not want it. so you are completely careless about what playerbase the game gets? if there is no challenges, then people won't become any good. and then when some people from your raid team quit, then you will only be able to replace him/her with a scrub. and that will hurt your abilty to raid. ALOT, gear or not
    Firelands and current hard modes will be the challenges. It'll be easier to get the gear to have a chance against those challenges. Your game model is flawed and essentially keeps content too gated. As a player you have either A) beaten the raids on normal mode or B) have not beaten the raids on normal mode. If it's A then move on to firelands and quit stressing out over old content. If it's B then you seriously need the nerf. So get the gear and move on to the new challenges which, by your theory, will make players better for the next challenge out there.

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