Holy Paladin Assistance

[Nasriel]

Hey guys, sorry if this has been asked a million times.... I've been playing a H pally for a while and even though my gear and I have improved 10 fold my guild master who is also a healer is still whinging at me about my performance which after all this time with my guild depresses me. I helped them kill Cho'gall (2 healing it) and also was with them healing for their very first Nef kill, also healing for their first and second H Halfus and H Chim kills also. So to be told my performance still isn't good enough is a huge blow to me... I'm not sure if he's being being too judgmental, or if i"m doing something badly wrong... his main issue is my HPS output which is always lower than his and varies from fight to fight depending on what's going on...

I cannot post a link to my toon as i'm only a new member but if you want to see him you'll have to look up Nasriel on the US server Nagrand

As i said my HPS depends from fight to fight, if it's hardcore healing intensive or we're two healing a fight (such as Cho'gall) my HPS is 10k+ if it's not so intensive then I tend to be about 8k HPS or so, I don't believe in healing for the sake of healing so if someone has only taken a little damage I'd rather use Holy light or if it's off CD my Holy shock to get their HP up and not waste mana on a Divine light which would just lead to overhealing.... ideally looking at my gear what should I be aiming at hitting HPS wise? my guild master is a druid and no matter how hard I try I cannot out heal him and if I do put a concerted effort into it I just OOM so it seems pointless me trying...

To give you an idea of my "Rotation" I judge whenever it's off CD for mana regen, I use holy shock on every CD to build holy power, beacon is always on one of the tanks (usually the one i'm assigned to heal) and depending on what's going on I'll use either Divine light for big damage, holy light for smaller damage, if we're all stacked up and need AOE healing i'll use Light of dawn otherwise whoever needs the healing most gets word of glory... I don't often use Lay on hands as it's my OMG tank gonna die button! I do admit I need to use my Guardian of Ancient kings more however I always forget about him. bad habit I guess I need to use him more and I have a tendancy to in the heat of the moment forget to use my wings too which is also a terrible habit I should use them on CD or when things get really hairy. if AOE healing is required I will pop my wings, make sure I have full holy power stacks and use Holy Radiance, and light of dawn together which works nicely.

So yeah, is there something wrong with my healing method? any pointers anyone can provide? and ideally considering my gear level what should my HPS be? Thanks in advance guys

[Soisoisoi]

HPS means nothing.. Keeping people alive and not over-healing is what matters. If people aren't dying and the other healers aren't having to pick up on your slack, simply tell him to GTFO.

I'll let someone who plays a Holy Pally properly comment on everything else, though. :P

[Nasriel]

*laughs* I really wish I could say that to my Guild master but he seems to be the type who is obsessed with the meters, and dosn't care about anything else I would have thought after the our Nefarian attempt where I got killed and he tried as hard as he could to keep my tank alive and epic failed that he'd have had a little more respect for just how hard I was healing...

[thoukaia]

Armory here

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/nagrand/nasriel/

Alright i think your raid leader's just overreacting, from how you described your playstyle you're doing things mostly right, and your gemming/reforging/enchanting choices is mostly right aswell, but i did notice a slight monstrosity in your spec which could be enough to justify slight underperforming. To be more exact, you need to spec 1 point out of Imp. Judgements and 1 point out of Enlightened Judgements to get 2/2 Paragon of Virtue. PoV is really a mandatory talent. Also i would suggest you removed that point in Blessed Life and max'd Crusade instead but thats debatable (Edit: depending of your healing setup, you might also want to consider speccing out of Sacred Cleansing instead of BL).

[jdfrost]

yea your healing style is find sounds alot like mine, your uptime might be alot lower then his. he is probably spamming holy light when everyone is topped up to increase his HPS

Your toughest boss might be his ego lol

[Nasriel]

Your toughest boss might be his ego lol

Oh I should add the raid leader isn't a pally, never played a pally and has no idea how to heal as a H pally.... You are spot on 100% correct. The GM considers himself "best druid on server" we used to have a Disc priest in our guild who would pull 9k HPS (not incl her absorbs) and he said she was a garbage healer... I dunno what he was looking at but I thought she was pretty damn good.... would dispel when needed, use her "oh crap buttons" when needed, didn't stand in fire or anything bad not to mention bosses were dying and people were staying alive. He's so full of himself that he was laughing at the raid saying we were fools when we subbed him out yesterday for a couple of bosses completely expecting us to wipe without his "epic heals" I don't mind saying I was extremely pleased when we downed the bosses one shot without any deaths and we did it without his assistance

I honestly didn't think my healing was that bad but with someone constantly telling me i'm rubbish and underperforming I can't help but question my skills :/

[Rukus]

Time to change guilds bro...a douchebag your GM is.

edit: Your spec, gear and healing methods suggest to me that you are doing it correctly. I wouldnt be dismayed at what he says. Like others have said, meters mean nothing if bosses are cleared and people are kept alive.

[MitsuAS]

Sounds like you need a new GM
Also spaming tranq is hard
*not to down on true epic drid healers* people that walk around withego's because the make big numbers on a meater

[Deleted]

If the boss is dead, and raid casualties were kept to a minimum, it's a success. Same in football, no matter how the ball crosses the line and goes in the net, a goal is a goal.

Healers that judge everything on a meter are complete retards. It's the same as dps thinking they're outperforming others because they're top of the meter. It's simply not the case.

Being a good raider is about teamwork and successfully killing bosses. The numbers simply don't matter once the loot is being rolled.

Tell your GM to f**k off to be honest

[Dawnseven]

Sounds like you're doing a great job Nas, in spite of your raid leader's criticism.

Here's a question for grins and giggles, maybe more a reflection of my play than yours, but I'll throw it out there anyway. I used to be bad myself at remembering to call my guardian or pop my wings in the heat of the moment but I think I'm getting better at it. How are you doing with Aura Mastery though? Are you using at the appropriate times? While it can be incredibly useful in limited situations if you're not using it it isn't providing any benefit at all. As a fellow forgetter I thought I'd ask. With mine it seems that I either forget (probably because I really didn't NEED to use it), or I can't take the time out from actively healing to hit it, or it doesn't cover the school of magic we're dealing with at the moment. I'm sure I'd use it more in PvP but I don't engage in that often. If you're able to make good use of it that's super, if you aren't then it's a talent point going to waste. Maybe the point from Blessed Life and the point from Aura Mastery to go 2/2 Paragon of Virtue? I agree with Thoukaia that PoV is a better investment.

[Malthanis]

It's a bit false to say that meters don't matter at all. You still need to perform up to a certain level to finish any given encounter. But meters are hardly the be-all end-all of anything.

If your raid can finish the encounter successfully, that's great. That means that you had the necessary numbers to throw at the boss. However, your actual performance should be rated in other manners. Did people stand in fire? Did boss abilities get interrupted properly? In the case of Chimearon, how fast were people brought above 10k?

Once you know you have the numbers, technique is all you need.

[Nasriel]

The only time I actually remember to use aura mastery is during the Ascendant Council but most of the time it sits there unused. I'm definitely going to take thoukaia's advice and change my spec. I think my Holy spec was a quick knock up ages ago and forgot to fix it when I should have

In the case of Chimearon, how fast were people brought above 10k?

well I'm a little slow on the uptake at times so it takes a second or so for me to get the target above 10k but that's more because of my reaction times more than anything. We don't do N Chim anymore, but that's really easy, We can do it with only one or two people dying in P2 which is unavoidable, in heroic mode we can normally get everyone above 10k before massacre. We do occasionally have a tank death on P1 but that's due to some bad RNG (for example I use lay on hands on the OT when it's his turn to take the boss during the system failure, and the tank was one shot even after I used lay on hands on him) or not dropping break stacks

[Kerstin]

Druids can do alot of AOE healing, your RL must be basing his "sensation" that healing is intense because he is the one who keeps the raid life from fluctuating a lot, also he must be looking into that considering he does a little off healing into the tanks as well (cause well that is his job he is a druid after all). Those 2 things together might be what are causing his sensation that he is the one making the diference. It is also noteworthy that while you do have some dubious talents as stated previously, and I couldn't see if you are on a 25 or 10 men raiding guild which would change your LoD usage considerably, the way you described seem to be an acurate description of our role in a raid, we heal *tanks* we can off heal somewhere else but our main role is tank healing, has been like that since BC and even with firelands change to holy radiance cd by 10 sec we will still be mainly tank healers, your rl must understand that while he off heals the tank you off heal the raid and that complimentary roles should feel like that when "in-tune" no great life fluctuation and everybody alive, regardless of healing metters. No healer should be feeling like they are healing alone if you guys are in-sinc.

[jce4ever]

aura mastery is a very usefull tool that I use on almost every boss. Example H-Chim P2 the whole raid takes shadow damage and can be used to lower that damage.

[Nasriel]

We're a 10man raiding guild. The only thing i've 25man healed in Cata and as a pally has been BH so far. I've also respecced to remove my dodgy talent choices lol however those like my gem/reforge/enchant on my new shoulders havn't updated yet as I'm yet to log out

[Deleted]

Hi Nas. I'm a 10 man Holy Paladin in a very nice guild and my situation is very similar to yours in the way that my healing is always beaten by our druid healer, Xrystal. Admittedly he's a VERY skilled player and I would happily have him solo heal a fight if it wasn't for the way healing and damage is these days. There can be more to HPS than you realise. For example, as you get better, your HPS will get lower. Paladins are also the worst to scale with gear healer-wise I think. Basically what I'm trying to say is, get on with your healing and tell your GM that if people aren't dying (often) then he's got other things to be moaning about.

[Deleted]

8-10k hps is low, sounds like he is carrying you tbh. Usually I'm at 11-15k as a holy paladin..

---------- Post added 2011-06-02 at 03:05 PM ----------

Hi Nas. I'm a 10 man Holy Paladin in a very nice guild and my situation is very similar to yours in the way that my healing is always beaten by our druid healer, Xrystal. Admittedly he's a VERY skilled player and I would happily have him solo heal a fight if it wasn't for the way healing and damage is these days. There can be more to HPS than you realise. For example, as you get better, your HPS will get lower. Paladins are also the worst to scale with gear healer-wise I think. Basically what I'm trying to say is, get on with your healing and tell your GM that if people aren't dying (often) then he's got other things to be moaning about.

Oh lord, one of those. No your hps won't be lower when you get better, your hp will get lower when _THE RAID_ gets better. And as I said his hps is very low. If his hps is around that the druid needs to keep 18k+++ to keep the raid alive which is neigh impossible over longer fights.

[Deleted]

8-10k hps is low, sounds like he is carrying you tbh. Usually I'm at 11-15k as a holy paladin..

---------- Post added 2011-06-02 at 03:05 PM ----------



Oh lord, one of those. No your hps won't be lower when you get better, your hp will get lower when _THE RAID_ gets better. And as I said his hps is very low. If his hps is around that the druid needs to keep 18k+++ to keep the raid alive which is neigh impossible over longer fights.

Sorry if I worded it wrong, that's what I meant. No need to get all Nazi.

[vizzle]

MMO-Champ posters and HPS hate is getting a bit silly. You guys are all riding the bandwagon now and it seems you're not really sure about what you're talking about.

HPS does matter. Firstly, HPS does not include overhealing, so overhealing and HPS aren't even connected.

In an average 10man encounter there will be 3 healers. These 3 healers have to keep the raid alive and must push out enough healing to go through the damage. If healer A is doing 2x the HPS of healer B and healer C, then yes, healer B and healer C are slacking and need to step it up. I don't care if everyone stayed alive, because it still shows that healer A is that much more vital than B and C, instead of it being somewhere even, which it should be. Mediocrity shouldn't be acceptable.

Especially if you're still doing progression and you don't have the content cleared yet, you need to be pushing for higher numbers WHILE giving out utility to make progression fights easier for the raid. People will fuck up on progression and people will make mistakes, and an important part of fast progression and faster boss kills is being able to aid these mistakes that will happen. You need healers that aren't "just doing enough", but are doing more than enough.

No, I'm not saying all healers should be pushing out 15k HPS each, because that would be impossible. The number doesn't matter, more so the percentage.

If the Resto Druid is consistently much higher than you and the Priest in your group, you guys need to both step it up. Reaction time is a big part of healing, no matter how well you know your spell priority, you need to have fast responses.

[Deleted]

MMO-Champ posters and HPS hate is getting a bit silly. You guys are all riding the bandwagon now and it seems you're not really sure about what you're talking about.

HPS does matter. Firstly, HPS does not include overhealing, so overhealing and HPS aren't even connected.

In an average 10man encounter there will be 3 healers. These 3 healers have to keep the raid alive and must push out enough healing to go through the damage. If healer A is doing 2x the HPS of healer B and healer C, then yes, healer B and healer C are slacking and need to step it up. I don't care if everyone stayed alive, because it still shows that healer A is that much more vital than B and C, instead of it being somewhere even, which it should be. Mediocrity shouldn't be acceptable.

Especially if you're still doing progression and you don't have the content cleared yet, you need to be pushing for higher numbers WHILE giving out utility to make progression fights easier for the raid. People will fuck up on progression and people will make mistakes, and an important part of fast progression and faster boss kills is being able to aid these mistakes that will happen. You need healers that aren't "just doing enough", but are doing more than enough.

No, I'm not saying all healers should be pushing out 15k HPS each, because that would be impossible. The number doesn't matter, more so the percentage.

If the Resto Druid is consistently much higher than you and the Priest in your group, you guys need to both step it up. Reaction time is a big part of healing, no matter how well you know your spell priority, you need to have fast responses.

I disagree with this post with the power of a thousand suns. Overal raid HPS is important, not individual HPS. If 1 healer decides to throw all his big heals and cooldowns right off the bat, the other 2 healers will be left in the dark because to them, it seems there isn't much to heal. 3 healers have to balance each other out. For example, regenerating mana on turns, popping cooldowns on turns, etc, etc. Good healing can only be achieved if the 3 healers are working together as a team.

Also, I have never ever, since the start of WotLK, seen a healer outheal a resto Druid on the meters (if the resto Druid in question is actually good, the HPS will always be higher than any other class because of the crapload of hots and aoe heals).