Holy Paladin Assistance

[zerideth]

I had this problem too when I first started out raiding (25 mans here). We also had a really good resto druid who would top the hps in every encounter with a holy priest, resto shaman and everyone else below with me at the bottom. I had the problem of not using my cds properly or not all because it seemed like I wouldn't need to; probably because of the resto druid and holy priest topping everyone off.

@OP: I would really suggest practice using your cds. Aura Mastery is clutch. Pop it during Cho's shadow order AoE thing and use it during p2. It's only 6 seconds, but it's really powerful. HoS is handy too and sometimes I forget using it as well. You didn't mention using Holy Radiance. I guess you still use it? With Divine Favor, I usually use it in conjunction with Ancient Kings for fast, powerful heals for the raid. Just keep practicing using your cds and you'll find them easier to manage with every encounter.

[vizzle]

I disagree with this post with the power of a thousand suns. Overal raid HPS is important, not individual HPS. If 1 healer decides to throw all his big heals and cooldowns right off the bat, the other 2 healers will be left in the dark because to them, it seems there isn't much to heal. 3 healers have to balance each other out. For example, regenerating mana on turns, popping cooldowns on turns, etc, etc. Good healing can only be achieved if the 3 healers are working together as a team.

Also, I have never ever, since the start of WotLK, seen a healer outheal a resto Druid on the meters (if the resto Druid in question is actually good, the HPS will always be higher than any other class because of the crapload of hots and aoe heals).

If 1 healer uses all his big heals and CDs off the bat (which doesn't even make sense because on every single encounter besides Halfus that would be a HORRIBLE thing to do) then he won't have enough mana and he won't have his CDs to last for the rest of the fight, wherein the other healers will pick it up and balance the healing. Boss fights don't have just one bang, one opportunity to push out healing... healing happens all throughout the fight, and extra healing happens usually every 30 sec - 1min intervals, so no, your example doesn't really work.

That's what I'm saying... they have to work together as a team. If one healer is carrying the other two, then they obviously aren't working as a team. All healers are designed to heal, all healers have extra CDs that aren't related to healing, no healer is designed "not" to heal. All Shields and absorbs are calculated as healing on WoL as well. You need 3 healers that can work together and can balance each other out. A 40% 30% 30% balance is alright, but if it's something like 50%, 30%, 20%? No.

And if you've never seen anyone outheal a Resto Druid on a meter, then you don't have that much experience. That's a ridiculous claim.

[Jeffari]

Few things with gear and spec.

Get 50 haste on gloves, 50 haste on boots, try to pick up a second int trinket, cho'gal one is nice. Get the Ramkahen exalted belt (spirit/haste with 2 red gem slots)

You just need to get your haste up a bit.

Take the 1 point out of blessed life and put it into crusade. You say you use holy shock on CD and even glyphed for it but yet you lose 10% healing on it by having 2/3 points in crusade. Blessed life return rate is so low in regards to holy power its not worth it.

Replace the holy shock glyph with divine favor, 10 more seconds of 20% haste? yes please.

You should use wings and divine favor before a holy radiance to get the extra few ticks out of it and for added healing of course. If you can tie in Guardian of the ancients king as well that is preferred.

Good luck

[vizzle]

Few things with gear and spec.

Get 50 haste on gloves, 50 haste on boots, try to pick up a second int trinket, cho'gal one is nice. Get the Ramkahen exalted belt (spirit/haste with 2 red gem slots)

You just need to get your haste up a bit.

Take the 1 point out of blessed life and put it into crusade. You say you use holy shock on CD and even glyphed for it but yet you lose 10% healing on it by having 2/3 points in crusade. Blessed life return rate is so low in regards to holy power its not worth it.

Replace the holy shock glyph with divine favor, 10 more seconds of 20% haste? yes please.

You should use wings and divine favor before a holy radiance to get the extra few ticks out of it and for added healing of course. If you can tie in Guardian of the ancients king as well that is preferred.

Good luck

I wouldn't exactly agree with some of these points.

-Extra runspeed on boots is amazing, don't lose those. You will regret losing extra run speed for just a bit more haste.

-Blessed Life is great for extra HPs for no effort, if anything, lose the point out of Improved Judgment and put it in Crusade. You don't need Improved Judgment, just position yourself better.

-Holy Shock vs. DF glyph has always been a bit of a debate. In my experience, I've liked having the HS glyph more because it gives you more IoL procs. Also, if I ever do pop DF, it's just whenever the raid is taking quite a bit of damage, and the problem has usually been mended by the time DF wears off, an additional 10 seconds would just be wasted usually.

[Deleted]

You NEED to replace Mandala of Stirring Patterns (trinket) with Darkmoon Card: Tsunami.

I also noticed you got mining, could also replace that with alchemy and you wont even have to get DMC: Tsunami, that would also increase the low amount of haste you've got, all holy paladins should ATLEAST have 1860 haste (this will get you one more tick from holy radiance).

As for your talents, either you spec out of LoD or you go get the LoD glyph, glyph of cleansing is a waste of glyph, you should always have 3 points in crusade and last improved judgement is always better than enlightened judgements.

[vizzle]

You NEED to replace Mandala of Stirring Patterns (trinket) with Darkmoon Card: Tsunami.

I also noticed you got mining, could also replace that with alchemy and you wont even have to get DMC: Tsunami, that would also increase the low amount of haste you've got, all holy paladins should ATLEAST have 1860 haste (this will get you one more tick from holy radiance).

As for your talents, either you spec out of LoD or you go get the LoD glyph, glyph of cleansing is a waste of glyph, you should always have 3 points in crusade and last improved judgement is always better than enlightened judgements.

Except if you don't have Enlightened Judgments your Judges will miss from time to time, which will annoy you. Better to have the 8% hit that Enlightened Judgments gives you.

[Xs]

Your spec needs a tweak, your haste is pretty low, your mana is strangely low and you have some pretty stupid choices

Stop using the BoE belt and go get the Ramkahen belt, why you would use that one is beyond me.
Stop slacking on the glove enchant, 50 haste is cheap as shit and amazing.
Stop slacking on the bracers and get Int.
Stop getting every socket bonus, remove every single blue gem you have any replace it with Int, none of them are worth it or needed.
You're slacking on the chest enchant, sort that, you should be rolling in crystals by now.
Replace that crappy spirit trinket, either the Arch one or Tsunami are replacements you can get outside of raids, otherwise get the Cho'gall one. If you don't feel like swapping to Alch

Also if hes judging you on farm content hes a retard, any time theres a resto druid or disc priest then every other healer will have lower HPS than normal, because they can just blanket everything

[Andyo]

Armory here

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/nagrand/nasriel/

If this armoury link is the original poster:

You use Glyph of Cleansing which is pointless since there is nothing to dispel in the game, use Glyph of Light of Dawn instead. Swap the Glyph of Lay on Hands for the Divine Plea one, since most fights have windows with nothing happening you can use it.

Move that 1 point in Blessed Life to Improved Judgement.

Stop using that awful spirit trinket & get Tsunami or get Tear of Blood from the last boss in Stonecore heroic if you're waiting for the one from Cho'gal to drop.

[Deleted]

Except if you don't have Enlightened Judgments your Judges will miss from time to time, which will annoy you. Better to have the 8% hit that Enlightened Judgments gives you.

True, was a bit too fast there

As a holy paladin you should always have 2 points in Imp Judgement and 1 in Enlightened Judgments

[vizzle]

True, was a bit too fast there

As a holy paladin you should always have 2 points in Imp Judgement and 1 in Enlightened Judgments

No reason to. There is no boss fight in this tier that requires you to be so far away from the boss that you need Improved Judgments to reach him. Position yourself better, use the talent points in talents that actually increase your healing/HP generation.

[Kerstin]

Really, really Healing is based on synergy between the healers, and between the healers and the tankers.
I got to 5/13 heroic I know I am not the *best* paladin holy out there but I like to consider myself a very good one and I tell you there is nothing better for me than to find 2 healers that play with me for a long time that we cover for each others, which is how a core of healing should feel.
Basically:
Dps - compete for the top
Tanks - dance around dmg mitigation and aggro generation depending on the fights.
Healers - Co-op with each others

If you are in a healer core and the healers don't talk about stuff like cd usage and you have one such healer that thinks he pwns everybody else you are gonna have problems, I myself find something that usually undermines my healing to be the lack of confidence in your partners, when you feel like you have to move out of the way and push your class to every single limit and nobody is doing anything wrong in the raid (I.E. getting 50% stack of corruption in cho'gall before the last phase, going 90% sound bar on atramedes, standing in black puddles on maloriak, staying to near Feludius during his AOE), that is when usually something is wrong. If your RL is more worried about putting you down other then talking to you and revising you guys cd usage to optimize your mana, and he constantly brags about his "High healing" then he is not much of a raid leader I tell you.

[carrierz]

just start to snipe heals from him, his main sources for his healing will be rejuv and wg which are easy to snipe. enjoy 15k+ hps and that'll make him shut up.

always use your healing cds, and in every fight were you know the raid will take most damage (and you're stacked up) you pop everything including goak and just DL the whole raid, can spike up to 60-70k hps for a small duration

starting to snipe heals will help you train your reaction, also if you aren't using it already use clique/mouse over

really, the bigger your hps (or dps), the bigger your penis is. with a large enough penis, your gm will shut up

[Aqua]

I'll say this now, Druid. Their HPS will generally be higher in 10mans vs you. Also your GM needs to focus on the big picture. Just sayin.
There are times where your HPS must spike but otherwise there should be no concerns and they should be obvious.

On that note you seem to be doing fine, nothing a little more discipline with cooldowns doesn't seem to fix. I work at a steady 12k and I feel I've managed to learn everything I can about healing as a holy paladins. (We all screw up from time to time however) But my fellow healers are teh awesome also.

Chimerion is a special case, I'm the tank healer so I'm churning out nearly 17k on a fight like that but it really depends. I think I have good luck and timing with cooldowns on that fight.

You use Glyph of Cleansing which is pointless since there is nothing to dispel in the game.

Heroic Valiona and Theralion would like a word. But yeah, it's a very low priority glyph, I think even glyph of Beacon would benefit you more if you're a sharp tank healer. ...Or wheres the other glyph of Lay on hands? Free mana. Always good.

[Angarin]

I used to be 4k hps and you know why? Half of my guild dps's were so freakin retarded and would stand in shit so we had to bring 8-9 healers. 3 hpallys, 1-2 holy priests, 1 disc priest (3 on halfus), 1 resto shaman 1-2 resto druids.

The highest hps was the holy priest(s) who had about 9k hps. I know holy pallys who strike up 11k hps if not more in 10m or 25m. But thats because they are taking 5-6 healers.

The more there is to heal theres more room for HPS.

You sound like your raiding 10m so I cant speak for much there but I did run 10m guild before I joined the 25m one and I was topping healing done and hps just by using holy radiance, light of dawn correctly and predicting big damage. I was a competitive healer because I had to compete with 2 very good healers (resto druid & disc priest).

OH YEAH use holy radiance bro. Its your most hps heal

Your doing nothing wrong, your GM is just stretching his EPEEN to far and if you really want to be whipped & have to put up with this "ego" then stay in the guild and "improve". Your just competeting with "better" healers and raid healers usually always have better hps unless they're healing with an EXTREMELY GODLY holy paladin. I only know a handful of holy pallies who can outheal a holy priest or resto druid.


My thoughts? Leave the guild and find one willing to accept your 8k hps on heroic fights. Just basically tell them you do your job. because as a healer thats what you are doing. If your healing and people arent dying unless they need/have to then as a healing team your doing fine.

[openair]

That's what I'm saying... they have to work together as a team. If one healer is carrying the other two, then they obviously aren't working as a team. All healers are designed to heal, all healers have extra CDs that aren't related to healing, no healer is designed "not" to heal. All Shields and absorbs are calculated as healing on WoL as well. You need 3 healers that can work together and can balance each other out. A 40% 30% 30% balance is alright, but if it's something like 50%, 30%, 20%? No.

If the healing meter looks like 50/30/20 after a wipe, then yes theres a problem. But if the meter is 50/30/20 after a kill with zero deaths (as the OP describes) there is no issue. Its called heal sniping. Theres only so much dmg to heal. If your healing meter consistantly looks like 50/30/20 after successful kills your raid probably outgears/skills the content and you should try swapping to 2 healers and see how the other healer performs then. Or take it easy on the heal sniping one fight (maybe even only emergency heal) and see how the other healers do.

[Rahrah]

I saw you say something about using HL as a filler for minor damage. I have to ask, why? Maybe it's just me but it seems like a waste of mana for how low it heals. If nobody needs any of the real heals, though I don't see that kind of scenario happening this tier, then why cast? Personally, I'd enjoy the mana regen and not worry. Shit, people say Nef is hard on healers, but at the end of my very first Nef kill I had something like 40% mana and nobody died the entire time, with all 3 healers 12-14k HPS, running with me as a HPally then a RShaman and an RDruid.

[openair]

Because HL's heal per mana is very similar to DL's, and the smaller heal means it can be cast without as much wasted mana (overheal) or waiting for ppl to take considerable dmg first. Also other then DivP and the extremely low cost of HL there is no extra mana regen provided by not casting (since 4.0 mana regen is the same casting as not).

[Emaias]

*laughs* I really wish I could say that to my Guild master but he seems to be the type who is obsessed with the meters, and dosn't care about anything else I would have thought after the our Nefarian attempt where I got killed and he tried as hard as he could to keep my tank alive and epic failed that he'd have had a little more respect for just how hard I was healing...

Tell him to do WoL and look at more important meters then recount then.

[Deleted]

one word on your raidleader:

5 Deaths to elevator boss (Blackwing Descent)

on another note regarding your healing (speaking 9/13 10man hpally here, got some serverfirsts while progressionraiding, if that matters to anyone):

your raidleader might be a dick, but i can partly understand where he's coming from. as mentioned above, if 2 healers are healing 13-14k and one other 8k, something is out of tune. you should try to even that out, heal faster, so your other healers know they can rely on you. thats a big point: the healing team has to have the confidence in each other to rely on their tasks, and not have the feeling that they constantly have to assist / snipe you because the feel like your not pulling your weight.
furthermore, i'm little sceptic regarding the "if the boss is down, everything is fine" - mentality. thats like the tank saying "why should i use my 50% CD, you can heal me anyway lolz" or the DPS playing on lazymode because the boss will die anyway. if you are playing new encounters / hardmodes, you should try to get away from the "the boss is down, so whats your problem"- mentality and think of the extra stress you might put on your healerteam.

anyway, druids to great HPS and there are many fights where you'll have no chance of beating his hps, thats just the nature of blanket-hotting the raid + tranq + Tree of Life. but you should try to get closer.

he still seems to be a dick though.
cheers

/edit: i strongly recommend using world of logs. analyze the encounters, who healed who with which spells, what Cooldowns, pots etc.

[Nasriel]

Thanks for all the advice guys I've taken it on board FYI I'm not last in meters I'm second behind the Druid, the one coming last is the resto shaman... yes the Druid always has more % than me in the meters too but his overhealing is awful. The fights I really shine in is 2 healing cho and definitely on Nef when the Druid cannot heal my tank at all...

Fights where my hps is low tends to be omni but my guild badly outgears that fight so not much damage is going on and 3 healing is overkill but when I'm stressed and healing my ass off (Nef for example) my % is still second but I only heal myself, ony tank and ony DPS in P1 and 2 and my hps is 10 or 11k hps and if we wipe in P2 my pillar is always last to die..