[Megathread] Skyrim Discussion

[smackyslap]

They will just say go get cured we don't want to hurt you if you are a vampire after that unless you are doing the vampire side of the quests otherwise they will try to kill you,

[derpkitteh]

hmmm, yeah, guess so. i mean, just seducing and feeding on a random person, then leaving that person in their normal life, doesn't seem at all evil to me. but i guess keeping thralls that didn't volunteer and are aware of their situation is pretty evil.

though the thrallmaster says that some of them do volunteer. if they were all volunteers, i wouldn't see any evil being done really.

i dislike the lack of moderate responses to everything. if you're with dawnguard it's "you're abominations rawr foam rawr" if it's vampires, you're kinda evil. why is there never an option to be like "ok, i'm dawnguard, and i want to destroy evil vampires, but good vampires are cool with me."

it's the same way with the daedric princes... it's either "yes my lord, i serve you!" or "away foul demon!" never "ok, i'll do what you want, but i'm not worshipping you, i just want your power".

[Kaelwryn]

it's the same way with the daedric princes... it's either "yes my lord, i serve you!" or "away foul demon!" never "ok, i'll do what you want, but i'm not worshipping you, i just want your power".

Hmm, I don't really agree with that. None of them demand you worship them. Most of them use you for their own purposes, but none are like "oh, now you worship me." It is generally "If you do as I ask, I'll give shinies"

[derpkitteh]

Hmm, I don't really agree with that. None of them demand you worship them. Most of them use you for their own purposes, but none are like "oh, now you worship me." It is generally "If you do as I ask, I'll give shinies"

the dialogue options are always like "my lord" or "as you command" like you're a worshipper or something. like when you get the elf blood for septimus and mora stops you at the door way and the only way to walk away from that convo is either "i am your servent, my lord" or "i'll never join you, vile demon!"

[Kaelwryn]

They are princes, for one, and two some of them are vile demons who want death and destruction. "My lord" is simply a term of respect. Like calling an older man/woman "Sir/Ma'am." Doesn't make you a worshipper, just means you know you're dealing with an entity who happens to be a lot strong than you.

[derpkitteh]

eh, i think the dragonborn is a little too strong to grovel at the feet of the princes. at least, i certainly wouldn't with that kind of power. tell them plain and simple, you got a nice weapon and i'll take it for use in MY name, not yours.

actually, you can do that with meridia. but, meridia is one of the few princes that deserves some respect.

[Kelimbror]

Yeah I think it's too black and white with your responses as well, so I get it. I think you are given a lot of options to be disrespectful or tell them you care nothing for religion, but the ultimate decisions are yes or no essentially. Same with the guilds. You either go all in dark brotherhood or kill them on sight and start the other chain. There's no grey way around it. While it's not as fun as it could be, it's also nigh impossible to make a game filled with that stuff.

Would we want 5 major quest lines with black/grey/white choices or 100 quest lines with black and white? In this case because of the diversity of the quests I want more of them, not more options. Ideally being able to just go your own way would be cool, but you have to think of all the implications that brings in design.

[derpkitteh]

eh, i'd prefer the best of both. but oh well, maybe in the next elder scrolls. be cool if it was a dragon break and relied on your skyrim save to determine how things are going in a war with the dominion. side with the stormcloaks, they ally with hammerfell and begrudgingly accept the backup of the empire for the final confrontation. or if you allied with the empire, they convince hammerfell to stand with them for the final confrontation.

also, temba wide-arm for high queen. keep bears out of skyrim.

[mickybrighteyes]

eh, i think the dragonborn is a little too strong to grovel at the feet of the princes. .

Now I'm curious... what do you think the daedric princes are exactly?

I mean they're just powerful entities that can be likened to old gods that can shape existence from non-existence. Pray they never are allowed to act without restraint upon the face of the world.

Dragonborn is a glorified dragon slayer... and MAYBE gets a few extra tricks up their sleeve from other sources.

[WarpedAcorn]

So long as Daedric Princes can't use Console Commands, then the Dragonborn wins. ^_^


Seriously though, yeah the Daedric Princes vs. the Dragonborn is virtually no contest. They have reality shaping power. Unfortunately the Dragonborn, while possibly the most powerful mortal, is in a different weight class altogether.

[derpkitteh]

theoretically, shouldn't the dragonborn be able to use dragonrend on the princes, thus making them experience mortality and making them mortal for a time?

that's what it does to dragons, it forces the concepts of mortality and finite existence upon them and they're basically exactly the same(only weaker) as the daedric princes. alduin himself being stronger than the second or third strongest of the princes, mehrunes dagon.

[WarpedAcorn]

Daedric Princes are not Dragons. Why would the Dragonrend shout work on them?

[derpkitteh]

Daedric Princes are not Dragons. Why would the Dragonrend shout work on them?

because it works on dragons because they're immortals. daedric princes are immortals. the words of power are made to work against an immortal being.

[mickybrighteyes]

theoretically, shouldn't the dragonborn be able to use dragonrend on the princes, thus making them experience mortality and making them mortal for a time?

that's what it does to dragons, it forces the concepts of mortality and finite existence upon them and they're basically exactly the same(only weaker) as the daedric princes. alduin himself being stronger than the second or third strongest of the princes, mehrunes dagon.

dragons are not the same as daedric princes <.<

And where do you get a ranking on prince power level? let alone where alduin measures up on them?

- - - Updated - - -

because it works on dragons because they're immortals. daedric princes are immortals. the words of power are made to work against an immortal being.

no it works on dovah cause you're speaking to them in their tongue and their words work based on feeling or some such. Dragons know of no words for mortality until you speak to them the words for dragon rend. it's not, target is immortal... make mortal...

[Kelimbror]

Dragons know of no words for mortality until you speak to them the words for dragon rend. it's not, target is immortal... make mortal...

Yeah, but if you're going to try and make this a semantic argument you suffer the same flaws. Suddenly knowing that mortality is a thing makes you un-immortal? That's the same far fetched concept, just phrased differently. Note: I am not arguing dragon shouts would work on non dragons, but that trying to refute an argument in this nature doesn't really work.

And for all intents and purposes we don't really know what dragonborn and their words can do in the scope of things b/c magic is magic. By the same token, Nephalem in Diablo are demon/angel hybrids and they can stand up to the most powerful of all of them even though by most accounts they are just human. Essentially they are the D3 equivalent of dragonborn.

Considering the importance of being dragonborn as displayed in ESO and ruling the kingdoms and whatnot, I would think it's a little bit more than we're told. It's not like 'mortals' challenging gods is anything knew in lore or mythology, right?

[Verdugo]

because it works on dragons because they're immortals. daedric princes are immortals. the words of power are made to work against an immortal being.

Thats now how Dragonrend works. It confuses the dragon because he has no concept of mortality.

What I am trying to say is that it fills their mind with massive ammounts of "fuck", making them land in confussion.




Meanwhile, Sheogorath can either teleport you to outer stratosphere and/or turn you into a sweetroll without moving a finger.

[inboundpaper]

Considering the importance of being dragonborn as displayed in ESO and ruling the kingdoms and whatnot, I would think it's a little bit more than we're told. It's not like 'mortals' challenging gods is anything knew in lore or mythology, right?

Isn't ESO not mainline cannon or something? Either way, the power of the assorted dragonborn we hear about is kinda vague, but nothing on par with a Daedric Prince save Talos, and he had CHIM.

[mickybrighteyes]

Isn't ESO not mainline cannon or something? Either way, the power of the assorted dragonborn we hear about is kinda vague, but nothing on par with a Daedric Prince save Talos, and he had CHIM.

well, Talos prior to becoming talos did a whole lot of shit...

and the ESO main story is basically during a time where there are no good records.


also, as to dragon rend. looking it up again, it seems to only state "forcing a dragon to experience mortality" and not really explain further. besides, being bested by the dragonborn would tend to end their tenure of immortality regardless.... so dragonrend is basically a mortal person shouting nonsense at dragons that maeks them mentally facepalm? Like Napa in DBZ abridged >.>

[derpkitteh]

well, Talos prior to becoming talos did a whole lot of shit...

and the ESO main story is basically during a time where there are no good records.


also, as to dragon rend. looking it up again, it seems to only state "forcing a dragon to experience mortality" and not really explain further. besides, being bested by the dragonborn would tend to end their tenure of immortality regardless.... so dragonrend is basically a mortal person shouting nonsense at dragons that maeks them mentally facepalm? Like Napa in DBZ abridged >.>

a dragon NEVER dies. it's soul is stored within the dragonborn once being absorbed, but it doesn't go away. with dragonrend, it does what it says and that fucks up a being that has no concept or idea of what it is to be mortal and cannot normally do it. dragonrend forces that into the dragon's brain until it expires, then it is forced back out through some godlike means. esbern during the main quest theorizes that the shout the tongues are using on alduin on alduin's wall is specific to dragons or alduin himself. i think it's specific to immortality itself, and that's how the dragonborn could get the upper hand.

[mickybrighteyes]

a dragon NEVER dies.

Yes dragons do. But their deaths aren't permanent unless the dragonborn did it. When tkaing their soul, teh dragonborn is taking their experience and knowledge and.. well... it seems a lot like Highlander actually.

edit:

I'm saying they experience some sort of defeat which will be dubbed a sort of 'death' based on seeing the many dragon mounds where buried dragons are effectively brought back to life.

They are eternal and immortal... not invincible.