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  1. #1
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    HC Nef, Dominion, Affliction and DoTs

    Yesterday I decided to finally sack off Destruction for Affliction and went straight in at HC Nefarian (which we had tried before).

    I have a few questions related to Affliction and the Dominion Buff.
    So that I can use Soul Swap more effectively, I was starting with BoA so that I could SS onto Nefarian when he lands (and continuing to do so on CD) as I and the other warlocks were 100% focussed on Onyxia rather than changing over to Nefarian. On gaining the Dominion buff, however, I decided to change to BoD as I had done with Destruction and reapplying all DoTs.
    The questions I have are:

    How does the Dominion buff work exactly and in relation to DoTs? I looked at a few logs of other Affliction warlocks on this fight and some used BoD and some didn't. Does Dominion only give the buff for the duration that is it up ie, only ticks within the 18 seconds it is live, or throughout the whole life span of the DoT? If it does work throughout the whole life span, how does Soul Swap work with this buff?
    Should I be saving my Soul Swap until there is 14 seconds left on BoD and then Swapping it onto another target, or does the buff not continue on with the Soul Swap?

    I want to understand Soul Swap a little better in regards to the buffs I have when I inhale and when I exhale. Should I be inhaling when I have great buffs, or does it work off the buffs at the time of exhaling?

    I'm the only warlock in my guild that seems to be Soul Swapping and double dotting, so I've not got anyone to ask. Thanks.

  2. #2
    It goes through the full duration of the DoT, if it's not refreshed. BoD would be more beneficial when you're not supposed to attack Onyxia anymore. You should be using that if it's only one target to attack anyways.

  3. #3
    Deleted
    I'm attacking both Ony and Nefarian. Hence why the questions on Soul Swapping and if it relates to the buff at all.

  4. #4
    BoD can only be on one target at a time, when you soul swap it falls off the original target.

    Soul Swap applies each dot individually to the Exhale target. Their spell power, haste, etc is calculated at that time.

  5. #5
    Great question Estasi, I wanted to ask the same. My doubt also was: after I get dominion buff do I need to reapply corruption or Haunt will refresh it, fully buffed?

    Beside that, with my logic I would play like this after dominion: reapply UA, corruption, BoA on both targets, then overwrite all of them again before buff expires but switching BoA for BoD. In addition I would Soul Swap the target with buffed Ua, cor, BoD and spare that for the moment dots expire again.

    In this case soul swap checks the spell power modifier that the dots have, or players' actual spell power?

  6. #6
    Dots are as powerful as when applied. If you place a dot and then gain a buff the dot will not grow in power. Reapply the dots typically right as you get the buff and right before it dissipates for full use of buffed dots.

  7. #7
    The Patient
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    Unless I'm horrendously mistaken somewhere, DoT coefficients are updated on a per tick basis. Thus there should never be a need to prematurely refresh them. Confirm/deny?

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Aedail View Post
    Unless I'm horrendously mistaken somewhere, DoT coefficients are updated on a per tick basis. Thus there should never be a need to prematurely refresh them. Confirm/deny?
    I don't watch my damage too closely on Nefarian, but this is 100% true for the essence of the red buff gained on Sinestra. I assume it works the same with Nef

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Penguin FTW View Post
    I don't watch my damage too closely on Nefarian, but this is 100% true for the essence of the red buff gained on Sinestra. I assume it works the same with Nef
    So we shouldn't reapply at all, and just continue with what we had on the boss already? I would like some confirmation as I seem to have 250+k crits with BoD and they seem to continue to tick highly even at the end of it.

  10. #10
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    From EJ Affliction thread:

    "During Wrath of the Lich King, DoTs did not update on a per-tick basis with boss debuffs and it was much more beneficial to open a fight by applying these debuffs (Haunt, Shadow's Embrace etc) before applying DoTs, however in 4.0.1 this was changed so that DoTs damage would update on the fly with boss debuffs."

    This only mentions boss debuffs though, not buffs you as the player get... I swear I remember reading it somewhere in patch notes, I'll keep looking and confirm when I find it.

    EDIT: This is in another thread (http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...-Trinket-Procs). Buffs to you do NOT update DoT ticks (my mistake, I read something wrong somewhere), but it's only in rare circumstances that you'd actually want to refresh DoTs to see any real DPS increase (read: on your average fight, it's not worth it, unless there's some gimmick). Because of the "opportunity cost" of NOT casting something else, you'll rarely see much of an increase in general.

    If you're able to full stack a Dominion, I'd imagine it would be one of those cases that's worth it to refresh though.

    Also, when Corruption is auto-refreshed, or when you fire DoTs to another target through Soul Swap, it as if you are hard casting - thus, DoTs refreshed/applied this way will have the full benefit of whatever buffs are on you at the time.
    Last edited by Aedail; 2011-06-03 at 07:33 PM.

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Aedail View Post
    From EJ Affliction thread:
    Also, when Corruption is auto-refreshed, or when you fire DoTs to another target through Soul Swap, it as if you are hard casting - thus, DoTs refreshed/applied this way will have the full benefit of whatever buffs are on you at the time.
    So if I got 1 sec dominion left, I soul swap the main target and exhale to the other after 10 seconds when the buff already expired do the ss dots have the dominion buff or not? Can't understand this :<

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elvy View Post
    So if I got 1 sec dominion left, I soul swap the main target and exhale to the other after 10 seconds when the buff already expired do the ss dots have the dominion buff or not? Can't understand this :<
    I don't believe so, no. The coefficient will be calculated when you EXHALE your DoTs to the additional target, not when you INHALE.

    I use a focus macro for my Soul Swap though, so my inhale/exhale is pretty instant (as in, I'll inhale/exhale and you'll see the spell animation and DoTs start ticking on the new target before the spell animation for the inhale actually gets to me... kind of weird looking).

    Heroic progression raider. Incapable of using Saran Wrap.

  13. #13
    So, for dummies: I get dominion -> 1) I reapply cor, ua, boa 2) Soul swap asap 3) reapply again all and soul swap them before dominion fades plus I put up BoD on one target (or later ticks of bod will be again "unbuffed")?

  14. #14
    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/t...?s=3961&e=4501

    Logs from last week (I volunteered to sit this week) on Nef, I was working under the assumption that I don't need to refresh dots and that my dots will continue ticking with the buff after it actually expires, assuming I don't mess with them (so mostly BoD)

    Idk, it worked out OK

  15. #15
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    Essentially yes... though realistically if you're getting the appropriate slows from other players in your raid so you're able to full stack Dominion (like a hunter frost trap, or a fellow lock who's glyphed for SFlame), by the time you get out you'll likely need to refresh everything but BoD anyway.

    Later ticks of Doom should keep the buff as long as it is cast while you have Stolen Power. If you recast after Stolen Power drops off, you won't see the additional benefit.

    Heroic progression raider. Incapable of using Saran Wrap.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Aedail View Post
    though realistically if you're getting the appropriate slows from other players in your raid so you're able to full stack Dominion (like a hunter frost trap, or a fellow lock who's glyphed for SFlame), by the time you get out you'll likely need to refresh everything but BoD anyway.
    A good point

  17. #17
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    Use agony for phase 1 dominion if you're Soul Swaping. Like others are saying, BUFFS are updated on a tick by tick basis, just DEBUFFS on the boss will update your DoTs on a tick by tick basis. Its a terrible system but that's how it is. After you get Power you should recast Haunt to reset corrup, then UA, and agony on your primary target. Then, by that time it should be safe to use Soul Swap because Corruption should of been reset by now. Use Doom in Phase 3 only. Reset Doom mid timer if you have higher Power stacks, but always waiting until you get your last Doom tick out to safely recast Doom.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Palmz View Post
    Use agony for phase 1 dominion if you're Soul Swaping. Like others are saying, BUFFS are updated on a tick by tick basis, just DEBUFFS on the boss will update your DoTs on a tick by tick basis. Its a terrible system but that's how it is. After you get Power you should recast Haunt to reset corrup, then UA, and agony on your primary target. Then, by that time it should be safe to use Soul Swap because Corruption should of been reset by now. Use Doom in Phase 3 only. Reset Doom mid timer if you have higher Power stacks, but always waiting until you get your last Doom tick out to safely recast Doom.
    From what I've been reading above BUFFS aren't updated tick by tick, but DEBUFFS are.

    Someone confirm which. I'm utterly confused.

    Plus, I've been using BoD in first phase only when I gain Dominion otherwise I keep BoA and continue Soul Swapping. When I put BoD up, I continue putting DoTs on my other target, I have been using BoD in case the DoT was affected through the entire minute.. which BoA wouldn't be. My guild hasn't made it past phase 2 successfully (a few times, but never enough for us to get off the platform and start add kiting etc).

  19. #19
    The Patient
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    Quote Originally Posted by Estasi View Post
    From what I've been reading above BUFFS aren't updated tick by tick, but DEBUFFS are.
    You're correct here.

    BUFFS (which you as the player get, trinket procs, talent procs, etc) do NOT update per tick - BUFF = Refresh
    DEBUFFS (which are placed on your target, CoE, Haunt, etc) DO update coefficients per tick - DEBUFF = NO Refresh

    Heroic progression raider. Incapable of using Saran Wrap.

  20. #20
    That buff/debuff isn't true for everything, but as a general rule it works

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