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  1. #1
    The Patient Madam's Avatar
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    [Priest] Discipline Healing Guide for New Raiders

    Discipline Healing Guide for New Raiders

    Disclaimer: This guide was originally written for the sole use of my fellow guild members. I have decided to share the guide here on MMO-C since we are currently without a guide for Discipline. If you are a seasoned player please add more insight to this thread. Spiritus, I wish you the best in your new endeavors, just don't forget about your fellow priests, we need you!


    Discipline Healing is unlike any other healer in game, we have many unique talents and absorbs. Learning to use the proper spell at the appropriate time is key to our style of healing. Disc priests may not always top the charts, but we have the best tools when it comes to saving lives.

    I will briefly cover some basics on spec, glyphs, spell choice, use of cooldowns, stats, mana management and a few helpful macro's.

    Before deciding on spec, you will need to understand your role in raid. Discipline Priests can perform well both as a tank healer and raid healer, we can also help out other healers, but the spec you build will be for your primary role.

    Tank Healing Spec: http://www.wowhead.com/talent#bfhzrosbfRMochMZb:qmVzq

    Strength of Soul: When you heal a target with your Heal, Greater Heal or Flash Heal spell, the duration of the weakened soul debuff on the target is reduced by 4 sec. In addition, when you cast Inner Focus you become immune to Silence, Interrupt and Dispel effects for 5 sec. (Must have talent for tank healing.)

    Train of Thought: You have a 100% chance when you heal with Greater Heal to reduce the cooldown of your Inner Focus by 5 sec. You have a 100% chance when you Smite to reduce the cooldown of your Penance by 0.5 sec.

    Inspiration: Reduces your target's physical damage taken by 10% for 15 sec after getting a critical effect from your Flash Heal, Heal, Greater Heal, Binding Heal, Penance, Prayer of Mending, Prayer of Healing. (Must have talent for tank healing.)

    Grace: Your Flash Heal, Greater Heal, Heal and Penance spells bless the target with Grace, increasing all healing received from the Priest by 8%. This effect will stack up to 3 times. Effect lasts 15 sec. Try and keep Grace stacked on tank at all times.

    Borrowed Time: Grants 14% spell haste for your next spell after casting Power Word: Shield. Lasts for 6 sec. Remember that Penance, Renew and Prayer of Mending will not consume the Borrowed Time buff.

    And 2/3 points in Darkness for added haste. This spec can also function well for raid healing.
    Note: The last two points spent on Darkness are debatable, you may find 2/2 Veiled Shadows more useful.


    Raid Healing Spec: http://wowtal.com/#k=veyE-2RL.ala.priest.qQW9_K

    As a raid healer you can give up some of the tank healing talents for Smite Healing. (Only five talent points moved.)

    Evangelism: When you cast Smite, Holy Fire or Mind Flay you gain Evangelism. Stacks up to 5 times.

    Archangel: Consumes your Evangelism effects, instantly restores 5% of your total mana and increases your healing done by 15% for each stack. Lasts for 18 sec. 30 sec cooldown.

    Atonement: When you deal damage with Smite or Holy Fire, you instantly heal a nearby low health friendly target within 15 yards from the enemy target equal to 100% of the damage dealt. If the Priest is healed through Atonement, the effect is reduced in half.

    Glyph of Divine Accuracy: Is a must have glyph for this spec, increasing your chance to hit with Smite and Holy Fire spells by 18%. Inspiration is still taken for part time tank healing. Inspiration can be dropped if raiding with another Priest with Inspiration or a Shaman with Ancestral Healing for Veiled Shadows or Darkness.

    Glyph of Smite: Your Smite spell inflicts an additional 20% damage against targets afflicted by Holy Fire.


    Note: The specs linked above will give you the tools needed to start raiding, feel free to tweak your spec for your style of play once more comfortable in your raiding role. Must have talents in 10 man raid include: Twin Disciplines, Mental Agility, Rapture, Borrowed Time, Divine Aegis, Pain Suppression, Inspiration, Grace, Empowered Healing and Divine Fury, take all points in these talents. If running strictly 25 man (as a raid healer) you may consider dropping points from: Empowered Healing (if mostly using PW:S and Prayer of Healing) and Inspiration (if raiding with Resto Shaman with Ancestral Healing).


    Now that you have selected you spec, what is your focus?
    Discipline priests have two strong functions, mitigate predicable damage and saving lives with absorbs, instant heals and cooldowns.



    Spell Selection:


    Power Word: Shield: Our bread and butter spell. Used for both predicable damage, and when glyphed Glyph of Power Word: Shield instant heals. PW:S buys time for other heals to land before death and softens large incoming damage. Do not over use as you will quickly run out of mana. PW:S also procs Rapture, will go into that in mana management. Each time you cast PW:S you will gain Borrowed Time, giving you a haste buff for the next spell cast.

    Divine Aegis: Critical heals and all heals from Prayer of Healing create a protective shield on the target, absorbing 30% of the amount healed. Lasts 15 sec. Divine Aegis plays a large role for Discipline Priests, with the exception to Prayer of Healing, we don't "cast" this shield, Divine Aegis procs from all crit heals. Divine Aegis will absorb about the same as PW:S in an average raid. Divine Aegis shields can be "stacked" if you continue to heal the target(s) before damage breaks the shield. Divine Aegis absorption cap is equal to 40% of your maximum health.

    Penance: Penance is still one of the best heals in game, instantly heals with large bursts and applies a full stack of Grace to your target. When tank healing use PW:S>Penance>Greater Heal. Raid Healing life saver when needed. Only time Penance should not be used on cooldown is when you know predicable damage will hit before your next CD. Learn to love Penance as it is also mana friendly. Glyph of Penance is highly recommended.

    Greater Heal: Greater Heal has the same cast time as Heal, and will continue to stack Grace on your target. Greater Heal combined with Train of Thought will lower the CD of Inner Focus. In a raid environment use GH over Heal increasing throughput. Avoid overhealing with Greater Heal, if your focus targets are in no real danger, Smite Heal or just wait a moment for another hit. (Yes, you can leave a player at 95% health most of the time.)

    Prayer of Healing: Both Disc and Holy will use PoH for group heals, but as Disc each time you cast PoH you will also proc Divine Aegis giving you an extra shield on every member of that group. Use PoH when three or more players of a group need healing. PoH can also be cast before predicable damage to mitigate and Glyph of Prayer of Healing will help balance out raid healing. Make sure you are casting PoH on a raid member in the middle of the group range. PoH has a 30 yard range from the player you cast on. Ask your raid leader for assist so that you can group raid members to utilize Prayer of Healing fully, each raid encounter is not the same, switch groups according to damage patterns and raid member placement.

    Prayer of Mending: Prayer of Mending is a smart heal that will bounce around raid, healing low health targets when damage is taken. PoM used to be cast on just the tank, the Glyph of Prayer of Mending has change this, if a raid member is taking damage, casting PoM will insure a larger heal to that player before it bounces. Even if you are tank healing don’t be afraid to help save a player that could die.

    Inner Focus: Inner Focus plays a key role for Disc, every 45 seconds Inner Focus will give you a mana free cast, plus 25% chance to crit on the cast. Inner Focus is best used with Prayer of Healing and/or Greater Heal. If tank healing, macro Inner Focus to Greater Heal, if Raid Healing, macro Inner Focus to Prayer of Heal, your mana bar will thank you later.

    Inner Focus / Prayer of Healing Macro:

    #show Prayer of Healing
    /script UIErrorsFrame:Hide()
    /cast Inner Focus
    /cast [target=target] Prayer of Healing
    /script UIErrorsFrame:Clear(); UIErrorsFrame:Show()

    Inner Focus / Greater Heal Macro:

    #show Greater Heal
    /script UIErrorsFrame:Hide()
    /cast Inner Focus
    /cast [target=target] Greater Heal
    /script UIErrorsFrame:Clear(); UIErrorsFrame:Show()


    Flash Heal: Avoid Flash Heal as a main spell, the mana cost is very high. Flash Heal should only be used on targets below 25% health and taking damage. If you need to use Flash Heal, cast it one or two times, then fill in with Penance or Greater Heal.

    Binding Heal: Binding Heal is a great spell, use when you and another player, usually the tank, are in need of a fast heal. Keep in mind the cost of Binding Heal is roughly the same as Flash Heal. Only use when really needed.

    Heal: In a tank healing spec, use Heal to maintain Grace stacks on tank, or low raid heal damage. If raid healing, use Smite over Heal.

    Renew: Renew is really not a great spell for Disc. Renew can be used on tank to smooth out damage or while you are on the move. Renew is for the most part a waste of mana and GCD spent. With that said, you will still find yourself moving on many fights, combine PW:S and Renew for these moments.

    Smite Healing: Make sure you have all of the talent points needed for Smite Healing and Glyph of Divine Accuracy and Glyph of Smite . Smite Healing is very fun as a Disc healer. Just remember your job is to heal not DPS. Use Holy Fire and Smite to build up stacks of Evangelism. If damage is low and no incoming predicable damage on the way, do not pop wings, save Archangel for heavy damage. Remember that with five stacks of Evangelism the cost of Smite is lower than Heal, maintain the lower mana cost until you need the extra healing. Five stacks of Evangelism will give you a total of 15% healing increase when used. Try and learn damage patterns, this will help you know when to build stacks and when to use your extra healing. Magmaw is a very good example, when Magmaw is chained (Head phase) Smite heal and build your five stacks of Evangelism, when Magmaw leaves the phase, this is the best time to pop the wings for the extra 15% heals as he will then cast his AoE damage.

    Smite and Holy Fire Macro's with healing mods on same key:

    Holy Fire (with Greater Heal)
    /cast [@target,help,mod:alt] Greater Heal; [harm][@targettarget,harm][@focustarget,harm] Holy Fire; Holy Fire

    Smite (with Heal)
    /cast [@target,help,mod:alt] Heal; [@targettarget,harm][@focustarget,harm] Smite; Smite

    The above macro's will let you cast Holy Fire and Smite on your target, a friendly target and your focus target. If you press the Alt key when on a friendly target you will either Greater Heal or Heal, icons will also change on bars. (Holy Fire is show twice in macro, could not get Holy Fire icon to show without, will also show Holy Fire cooldown.)


    Holy Nova: Causes an explosion of holy light around the caster, causing damage to all enemy targets within 10 yards and healing up to 5 targets within 10 yards. Healing is divided among the number of targets healed. These effects cause no threat. The use of Holy Nova is best when raid members are stacked or moving together in packs, avoid using when spread. Most of the time Prayer of Healing is a better spell, but if damage has hit multiple raid members (not in same group) Holy Nova can be used for a fast HP top off.
    Note: Actual healing done with Holy Nova is very low compared to the mana cost so use sparingly, but does have it's moments. Highly recommended for killing critters, and yes, we all love the spell animation.


    Power Word: Barrier: If used correctly PW:B can be one of the biggest raid saving spells in game. The barrier should be placed before large AoE damage is taken, make sure to get your raid members in it, as long as standing close won’t cause other friendly fire. PW:B can also be used for saving a tank from death, don’t be afraid to use this spell to save a wipe.

    Pain Suppression: Mainly used to mitagate damage from tank, can also be used on raid member taking large damage, or is focused on by boss for some sort of mechanic. With a three minute cooldown you can also use PS to ease damage on tank and save mana.

    Power Infusion: In Wrath Power Infusion was used on top DPS to increase damage done. With the mana changes in Cata, Power Infusion is now one of the best ways to save mana and also increase our cast time during heavy AoE damage. No need to wait and use this spell, try and use PI early in a fight just to save mana, with a two minute cooldown PI will be ready again when you need it for burst damage, or when using multiple shields. Note: PI does not stack with Bloodlust / Heroism, avoid using at this time.

    Power Infusion Macro: Set to only self target, this will save time and miss click casts on other players.

    #showtooltip
    /cast [@player] Power Infusion


    Divine Hymn: Full raid heal, use when raid is taking huge damage. Divine Hymn is a smart heal and will target the five lowest health members every two seconds for eight seconds total. Keep in mind this is not always the tank. If you are on tank heals make sure to alert other healers to cover tank while you channel Divine Hymn. Best used with Bloodlust / Heroism as the number of heals increase with haste.
    Note: Haste levels will change the number of ticks, see discussion below.

    Leap of Faith: So much more than a grieving tool, used to pull party/raid members to safety.

    Inner Fire: Discipline favor Inner Fire for the added spell power.

    Inner Will: Best used for movement fights and when multiple PW:S are needed for heavy burst damage.

    Class defining spells other healers envy are Fade and Mass Dispel, learn to love both.

    Mass Dispel: Dispels magic in a 15 yard radius, removing 1 harmful spells from each friendly target and 1 beneficial spells from each enemy target. Affects a maximum of 10 friendly targets and 10 enemy targets. This dispel is potent enough to remove Magic effects that are normally undispellable.

    Fade: Fade out, temporarily reducing all your threat for 10 sec.



    Stats:


    Intellect: Increases mana, spell power, and crit.
    Our number one stat, all red gems sockets should be +40 int and if matching bonus sockets +20 int +20 [secondary stat], never use a gem without intellect.

    Enlightenment:(Passive) Intellect increases by 15%.

    Spirit: Increases mana regeneration.
    Spirit allows us to regen mana, most of your gear, if not all, should have spirit. If you find yourself running low on mana during long fights, reforge crit to spirit.

    Meditation: (Passive) Allows 50% of your mana regeneration from Spirit to continue while in combat.

    Combat Regen: Amount of mana regenerated every 5 seconds while in combat.
    Note: The five second rule is dead, anytime you are in combat, casting or not, you will only regenerate mana at your Combat Regen amount, NOT your Mana Regen amount.

    Mastery: Increases the potency of all your damage absorption spells, each point of Mastery increases the potency by an additional 2.5% increase to PW:S and .75% increase to Divine Aegis per 179.28 rating.
    Mastery is very important to Discipline, remember our specialization, mitigate damage.

    Haste: Makes spells cast faster. 25% Haste = 1 extra 2.5sec cast within a 10sec period [or drops a 2.5sec cast down to 2sec].

    Crit Chance: Chance of spells doing extra damage and healing. Chance for healing to be 200% normal amount. Activates Divine Aegis on any heal and doubles Divine Aegis on Prayer of Healing crits.
    Keep in mind as a healer, you can not rely on RNG. Most Disc Priests will reforge out of crit, even after reforging, crit levels will be high with raid buffs.
    Note:The value of Crit may change when 4.2 goes live.

    What stat is best for you? Should you stack all Mastery? Should you reforge all Crit and Mastery and stack Haste? Should you give equal value to Mastery and Haste?
    All the questions above can only be answered by you, also, depending on your raiding role and raid healing team your stat priority will change. You will find many discussions on stat priority here in the Priest forums that elaborate on the topic.
    Note: All fights are not created equal, you will find some fights favor Haste over Mastery or Mastery over Haste. Change gear accordingly.


    Mana Management:


    Rapture: Rapture has been changed, you can now only receive mana back from ONE fully absorbed PW:S every 12 seconds. Do not try to shield your entire raid, the bubble spam days are long gone. Using an add-on to track Rapture is highly recommended, or a Power Aura timer will work just as well. Rapture is the Discipline Priests largest mana gain during each encounter, learn control over PW:S usage in order to get the most from Rapture.

    Power Infusion: In Wrath Power Infusion was used on top DPS to increase damage done. With the mana changes in Cata, Power Infusion is now one of the best ways to save mana and also increase our cast time during heavy AoE damage. No need to wait and use this spell, try and use PI early in a fight just to save mana, with a two minute cooldown PI will be ready again when you need it for burst damage, or when using multiple shields. Note: PI does not stack with Bloodlust / Heroism, avoid using at this time.

    Shadowfiend & Hymn of Hope: Before casting Hymn of Hope, use Power Infusion (if not on CD) and toss out a PW:S for the haste buff, this will give more ticks on Hymn of Hope. Using Shadowfiend before channeling Hymn of Hope gives more mana back than if you were to use separately. Sometimes during heavy damage you may not be able to use both at the same time, don't worry, just let your Shadowfiend go, you can HoH when you have a moment to spare, still better than running out of mana. Hymn of Hope is a channeled spell, let your raid know you are casting HoH so that your focus targets can be covered.
    Note: Haste levels will change the number of ticks, see discussion below.

    Don't forget: Mythical Mana Potion and Potion of Concentration, during some encounters using a mana pot may be the difference between killing the boss or wiping. Also use Flask of the Draconic Mind if your raid is missing a cauldron.




    Helpful Links:


    Power Auras is one of the best ways to keep track of cooldowns, can also be used for warning raiders of fight mechanics.
    http://wow.curse.com/downloads/wow-a...s-classic.aspx

    Derevka (lurks here on MMO-C as well as other forums) has a wonderful set of Dicsipline Power Auras.
    http://talesofapriest.com/discipline-power-auras/
    You will also find Derevka's UI on this link.

    Compiled list of fight mechanic Power Auras, share them with your raid.
    http://fallingleavesandwings.wordpre...s-bwd-tfw-bot/



    If you made it this far thanks for reading. There really is more to a Discipline Priest than tossing around a few bubbles.

    Please be kind, first attempt at a guide.
    Last edited by Madam; 2011-11-29 at 11:24 AM.

  2. #2
    Nice ty, i'll read this once i have time

  3. #3
    I skimmed it. Nothing too off.

    However, I'd have 2/3 Darkness as your baseline cookie-cutter over 2/2 focused will for your tank healing spec.

    Also, GoSmite is nearly as mandatory for an AA spec as GoDiv.Acc. in post-4.1.

    EDIT: Also missing a Holy Nova description.

    Re-EDIT: Also, for a entry beginner's guide, I would go over some of the key talents and how they work in practice [ie- ToT/SoS/BT/Grace]. And basic tricks like popping PI when having to throw out multiple shields.

  4. #4
    As someone getting back into Disc, these are questions that people like me would want to ask (though some have been answered on this forum before):

    -What are the stat priorities for tank healing? For raid healing?
    -Are there any stat caps or plateaus?
    -What is this 12.5% haste cap everyone rages about? (runs from Spiritus)
    -How should I be gemming?
    -How should I be reforging?
    -How should I be enchanting?
    -What glyphs are best for tank/raid healing?
    -What useful macros are out there that I should use? (One for atonement spec in particular)
    -Is Power Infusion something to gift away still?

    I'm not trying to troll at all here, but those strike me as many basic things new disc raiders will want to find, as well as basic questions disc priests on this forum never want to answer again (haha, 12.5%). Adding that info would make it easy to redirect any of those questions to this thread, allowing new threads to focus on specific fights, healer combos, etc.

    Thanks very much for starting this thread as well. They're a lot of work, and it's bound to help a lot of raiders, myself included. =)

  5. #5
    The Patient Madam's Avatar
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    Zuziza, some of the question regarding stat/gems/reforging will change with your gear/fights/other healers in raid....
    Since we are unlike any other healer in game, there really isn't a cookie cutter stat model, and depending on if you raid 10 man or 25 man your priorities may change.

    As for glyphs, they are listed on specs links.

    Power Infusion is your new best friend, if you gift it away make that player pay you in cookies.

    As stated in guide, I wrote this for my guild, I will do my best to answer questions, but would really like to see some of our seasoned players respond as well, can always add to the guide...

  6. #6
    I think we could probably draw a consensus around Disc gemming for pure intellect. Considering that (a) we get 15% more intellect from Enlightenment, and (b) desirability of secondary stats depends on role, intellect is extremely compelling.

  7. #7
    So healing through Atonement. What type of heal would this be equivalent to as far as mana cost to amount healed? Heal, Flash Heal, what?

    I think i may be healing a bit oddly as disc in raids so i'm not sure i could switch to that spec. I tend to throw PW:S on the tanks whenever i can and have a PoM jumping around at all times. Hit low health players with Penance and maybe a greater heal. I also tend to do a lot of Prayer of Healing to even out raid damage and prep for aoe damage. Between my trinkets, fiend and HoH I rarely have mana issues.

    So if i switched to an Archangel\Atonement spec would i replace those PoH casts with Smite and Holy fire?

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Zuziza View Post
    As someone getting back into Disc, these are questions that people like me would want to ask (though some have been answered on this forum before):

    -What are the stat priorities for tank healing? For raid healing?
    -Are there any stat caps or plateaus?
    -What is this 12.5% haste cap everyone rages about? (runs from Spiritus)
    -How should I be gemming?
    -How should I be reforging?
    -How should I be enchanting?
    -What glyphs are best for tank/raid healing?
    -What useful macros are out there that I should use? (One for atonement spec in particular)
    -Is Power Infusion something to gift away still?

    I'm not trying to troll at all here, but those strike me as many basic things new disc raiders will want to find, as well as basic questions disc priests on this forum never want to answer again (haha, 12.5%). Adding that info would make it easy to redirect any of those questions to this thread, allowing new threads to focus on specific fights, healer combos, etc.

    Thanks very much for starting this thread as well. They're a lot of work, and it's bound to help a lot of raiders, myself included. =)
    - int>spirit(AA should be around 1800 while SoS should have around normal healers so like 2200?)>mastery>crit>haste
    - mmmm spirit wise as seen above
    - 12.5% haste can be ignored on disc. we dont need haste as much as holy priests but even when i was holy i stacked mastery
    - Brilliant Inferno Rubies (40 INT), Artful (20 Mastery, 20 INT) Ember Topaz and Purified Demonseyes (20 INT, 20 Spirit)
    - see stat priorities
    - see stat priorities
    - SoS spec is the best tank healing spec by far so glyph accordingly
    - use mouse hover macro. if you dont know the macro line just google it.
    - SoS specs give it away while AA specs use it for themselves

    thats just the way i play and it works fine. hfgl

  9. #9
    The Patient Madam's Avatar
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    Smite and Holy Fire Macro's added.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Madam View Post
    Shadowfiend & Hymn of Hope: Before casting Hymn of Hope toss out a PW:S for the haste buff, this will give more ticks on Hymn of Hope, using Shadowfiend before channeling Hymn of Hope gives more mana back than if you were to use separately. Sometimes during heavy damage you may not be able to use both at the same time, don't worry, just let your Shadowfiend go, you can HoH when you have a moment to spare, still better than running out of mana. Hymn of Hope is a channeled spell, let your raid know you are casting HoH so that your focus targets can be covered.
    Hymn of Hope's tooltip is this:
    Restores 2% mana to 3 nearby low mana friendly party or raid targets every 2 sec for 8 sec, and increases their total maximum mana by 15% for 8 sec. Maximum of 12 mana restores. The Priest must channel to maintain the spell.
    You can't get more tics out of the Hymn with the tip you described, but you can finish the Hymn faster so you can get back to healing. That same tip is also useful for Divine Hymn (which works in a similar fashion), which can be useful for topping off raids at phase changes.

    ---------- Post added 2011-06-10 at 12:21 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Madam View Post
    Inner Focus: Inner Focus plays a key role for Disc, every 45 seconds Inner Focus will give you a mana free cast, plus 25% chance to crit on the cast. Inner Focus is best used with Prayer of Healing and/or Greater Heal. If tank healing, macro Inner Focus to Greater Heal, if Raid Healing, macro Inner Focus to Prayer of Heal, your mana bar will thank you later.
    It would be nice if the macro for this was actually written out. =)

    (I am totally a macro tard, and I'm sure I'm not the only one; I typically just have a crazy amount of keybinds and go nuts with stuff off the GCD.)
    Quote Originally Posted by Purpleisbetter View Post
    Power Torrent, Volcano and Theralion proc'ed, dots just refreshed. Everyone dies. Just a tank and a boss with around 200k hp. Everyone in vt yells "omg we failed omg omg" and you "don't worry amigos, my dots are steamrolling!". Boss dies while you'd say "Enjoy your loots" with a lot of purple awesomness spilling thru your voice. Just happend yesterday.

    Seriously, i thought i'd reroll warlock for 4.2, but that was the sign that i'm purple inside and i can't reroll. never.

  11. #11
    Scarab Lord Zka's Avatar
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    Divine Hymn gets extra ticks during PI, I'm sure I had wol logs with 15 DH ticks. Sadly, report expired now.
    BT does not give extra ticks to it on the other hand.

    Retired raider coming back for WoD.
    WoD BETA CLUB

  12. #12
    Holy Nova: Causes an explosion of holy light around the caster, causing damage to all enemy targets within 10 yards and healing up to 5 targets within 10 yards. Healing is divided among the number of targets healed. These effects cause no threat.The use of Holy Nova is best when raid members are stacked or moving together in packs, avoid using when spread.
    May want to bring up the fact that the actual healing done is very low compared to the mana cost. The reason such a note should be added is so that a new disc raider can understand that unless the group is stacked and/or moving, PoH would be a much stronger and more mana efficient heal (that also benefits from mastery and the glyph) in comparison. As the description is now, a new raider may be surprised (in an "oh shit" way) when they see how fast their mana gets drained from spamming it.

    ---------- Post added 2011-06-10 at 12:31 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Zka View Post
    Divine Hymn gets extra ticks during PI, I'm sure I had wol logs with 15 DH ticks. Sadly, report expired now.
    BT does not give extra ticks to it on the other hand.
    I would really feel more comfortable if you could find a log to show it. I know for sure that the duration is shortened (spriests stack haste, and my hymns are stupid fast), and from the tooltip, I'm very inclined to be skeptical without proof of a log. =\

    ---------- Post added 2011-06-10 at 12:47 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by holydoc View Post
    - int>spirit(AA should be around 1800 while SoS should have around normal healers so like 2200?)>mastery>crit>haste
    - mmmm spirit wise as seen above
    - 12.5% haste can be ignored on disc. we dont need haste as much as holy priests but even when i was holy i stacked mastery
    - Brilliant Inferno Rubies (40 INT), Artful (20 Mastery, 20 INT) Ember Topaz and Purified Demonseyes (20 INT, 20 Spirit)
    - see stat priorities
    - see stat priorities
    - SoS spec is the best tank healing spec by far so glyph accordingly
    - use mouse hover macro. if you dont know the macro line just google it.
    - SoS specs give it away while AA specs use it for themselves

    thats just the way i play and it works fine. hfgl
    <3

    Even if the answer is "it varies", that's something that should be mentioned in the guide so that people don't think you just forgot to bring it up. Even if it's just general trends (like, is atonement raid healing more or less viable in 25man compared to 10man?), that information is helpful.

    For example, the stacking mastery vs. haste preference is something that many new raiders just won't know if they're only starting to take it seriously. You don't have to get too into detail, but explaining the benefits of each gives the readers what they need to know to make their own decision of how they want to gear/gem/enchant/reforge.

    Explaining the implications of 10 and 25 man raiding would also be invaluable. A lot of it goes over my head just because I haven't done any 25 man raiding in Cata, even though that's all I did in ICC. The trend I've seen on my server is that raiders typically stick with one or the other, even if they switch guilds around. I literally have no clue how much difference there is between the two, so if I (or a new raiding disc priest) got recruited to 25 man from my normal 10 man, including tips on that would be greatly helpful in the guide.

    Keep in mind, a lot of my posts are trying to be constructive. I don't mean to belittle your effort for the guide at all, I'm just trying to help improve it. I wanna see another sticky. =)
    Quote Originally Posted by Purpleisbetter View Post
    Power Torrent, Volcano and Theralion proc'ed, dots just refreshed. Everyone dies. Just a tank and a boss with around 200k hp. Everyone in vt yells "omg we failed omg omg" and you "don't worry amigos, my dots are steamrolling!". Boss dies while you'd say "Enjoy your loots" with a lot of purple awesomness spilling thru your voice. Just happend yesterday.

    Seriously, i thought i'd reroll warlock for 4.2, but that was the sign that i'm purple inside and i can't reroll. never.

  13. #13
    Scarab Lord Zka's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zuziza View Post
    I would really feel more comfortable if you could find a log to show it. I know for sure that the duration is shortened (spriests stack haste, and my hymns are stupid fast), and from the tooltip, I'm very inclined to be skeptical without proof of a log. =\
    Managed to find a report pretty fast, so now I'm checking all recent ones.
    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/r...D%22Khetana%22

    I don't know what triggers it tbh. I tought it was PI, but filtering this very log, neither BT, PI or BL are active when I start to cast this DH.
    I'm around 18% haste raid buffed because I'm stacking it.

    Holy shit, an 18 tick DH here.
    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/r...2Khetana%22%29
    Again, no BT/PI/BL seems to be up when I pop it.
    Last edited by Zka; 2011-06-10 at 07:55 AM.

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  14. #14
    I just realized, there's no explanation of the mastery in the guide. XD Pretty sure that's important enough to add as well.

    ---------- Post added 2011-06-10 at 12:56 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Zka View Post
    Managed to find a report pretty fast, so now I'm checking all recent ones.
    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/r...D%22Khetana%22

    I don't know what triggers it tbh. I tought it was PI, but filtering this very log, neither BT, PI or BL are active when I start to cast this DH.
    I'm around 18% haste raid buffed because I'm stacking it.
    That is crazy. Is it a bug? It's very clear from the tooltip that it's NOT intended, but I dunno how else to explain that it happened. It's clear that it healed 15 times from the 1 spell, duration just below 8 seconds...

    I'll try testing this out tomorrow, messing with the haste levels to see if that affects the number of tics.

    ---------- Post added 2011-06-10 at 01:04 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Zka View Post
    Holy shit, an 18 tick DH here.
    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/r...2Khetana%22%29
    Again, no BT/PI/BL seems to be up when I pop it.
    WTF? I have to look mine up. I know I have 30% haste self-buffed, so if you're pulling that with 18%... o.O
    Quote Originally Posted by Purpleisbetter View Post
    Power Torrent, Volcano and Theralion proc'ed, dots just refreshed. Everyone dies. Just a tank and a boss with around 200k hp. Everyone in vt yells "omg we failed omg omg" and you "don't worry amigos, my dots are steamrolling!". Boss dies while you'd say "Enjoy your loots" with a lot of purple awesomness spilling thru your voice. Just happend yesterday.

    Seriously, i thought i'd reroll warlock for 4.2, but that was the sign that i'm purple inside and i can't reroll. never.

  15. #15
    Scarab Lord Zka's Avatar
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    Checking this EJ thread releals that probably the tooltip is just dumb, DH scales with haste just like hots (gets extra ticks). I got to test this some time in the near future.
    http://elitistjerks.com/f77/t110244-...ompendium/p10/

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  16. #16
    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/g...e/spell/64844/

    A 15 tic Divine Hymn by the Disc priest in our guild (who's stacking mastery, not haste, so he doesn't have much). On his armory, he has 2.08% haste.

    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/s...2Mammetu%22%29

    A 15 tic DH by me, who's stacking haste as an spriest. My armory shows me at 20.33% haste.

    Why do they both have 15 tics if we have wildly different haste amounts? Is it just a tooltip error where it actually does 15 tics?

    ---------- Post added 2011-06-10 at 01:11 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by zka View Post
    checking this ej thread releals that probably the tooltip is just dumb, dh scales with haste just like hots (gets extra ticks). I got to test this some time in the near future.
    http://elitistjerks.com/f77/t110244-...ompendium/p10/
    database is down. /nerdrage
    Last edited by Zuziza; 2011-06-10 at 08:26 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Purpleisbetter View Post
    Power Torrent, Volcano and Theralion proc'ed, dots just refreshed. Everyone dies. Just a tank and a boss with around 200k hp. Everyone in vt yells "omg we failed omg omg" and you "don't worry amigos, my dots are steamrolling!". Boss dies while you'd say "Enjoy your loots" with a lot of purple awesomness spilling thru your voice. Just happend yesterday.

    Seriously, i thought i'd reroll warlock for 4.2, but that was the sign that i'm purple inside and i can't reroll. never.

  17. #17
    Scarab Lord Zka's Avatar
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    EJ up again. A post says that haste limits are 12.5, 37.5, 62.5, 87.5% for 15,18,21,24 ticks respectively.
    37.5 is pretty easy to reach, 62.5% is not out of the reach aswell.

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  18. #18
    Deleted a bunch that totally got negated when I found the proper post on EJ.

    Post #235 by jhneoh at http://elitistjerks.com/f77/t110244-...ompendium/p10/ (near the bottom)
    Regarding the Haste vs Divine Hymn discussion, I did some maths on it, and yes, it looks like it's correct from what Alv!ra and the others are saying.

    Formula:

    You get k more ticks for a hot/dot that has m ticks at 0% haste if your haste is higher than (2k-1)/2m.

    For both Divine Hymn and Hymn of Hope, m = 4.
    k = 1 : 12.5% haste
    k = 2 : 37.5% haste
    k = 3 : 62.5% haste
    k = 4 : 87.5% haste

    Lifeblood (herbalism) = 4% haste
    Borrowed time = 14% haste
    Power Infusion = 20% haste
    Berzerking = 20% haste
    BL/TW/Hero = 30% haste

    Alv!ra stated that he got 21 ticks. To get 21 ticks of DH, that means that k = 3 , which necessitates 62.5% haste. Borrowed Time + Power Infusion + Berzerking = 54% haste, so if has 8.5% haste from gear and talents (not difficult), then 3 extra ticks for 21 total ticks is definitely possible.

    On another note, a Troll Disc Priest popping Berzerking, Power Infusion, and PWS for Borrowed Time while under the effects of Timewarp/Bloodlust/Heroism could get a 4th bonus tick of Divine Hymn / Hymn of Hope...
    Very cool, something I never knew about. =D And yay for EJ not being total BS about something.

    So, to summarize the post:
    -DH and HoH each last for 8 seconds, and with enough haste, you get an extra set of 3 tics.
    -If you have the exact amount of haste for a tic, it's 8 seconds, but it'll be slightly shorter if you're between the bumps.
    -The tooltip is utterly wrong about the mechanics of the spells.

    Looking back at my comment on my hymn being fast, it's just because I was right below the second extra set of tics (I raid with 30.5% haste, 33.5% with DI), so the hymn was cut much shorter.

    ---------- Post added 2011-06-10 at 01:50 AM ----------

    And as much as I hate to point it out to Spiritus, the first new tic is at 12.5%....
    Last edited by Zuziza; 2011-06-10 at 09:38 AM. Reason: Rechecked.
    Quote Originally Posted by Purpleisbetter View Post
    Power Torrent, Volcano and Theralion proc'ed, dots just refreshed. Everyone dies. Just a tank and a boss with around 200k hp. Everyone in vt yells "omg we failed omg omg" and you "don't worry amigos, my dots are steamrolling!". Boss dies while you'd say "Enjoy your loots" with a lot of purple awesomness spilling thru your voice. Just happend yesterday.

    Seriously, i thought i'd reroll warlock for 4.2, but that was the sign that i'm purple inside and i can't reroll. never.

  19. #19
    If you want to easily test the Haste with Hymn thing go to Vortex pinnacle and use it upwind during the battle with Altairus.
    That with Power Infusion and Lifeblood (and possibly as haste trinket proc I can't remember) put me at 154% haste.
    I think I tried it once and mana poured in like crazy but it might have been a hasted shadowfiend so I wont say it works there with 100% certainty
    ><)))*<

  20. #20
    The Patient Madam's Avatar
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    Thank you all for the feedback, keep it coming.


    Zuziza, thank you for taking time to help better the guide.

    My original goal was to try and help new raiders, but along the way I have also learned a few new things, making this project worth even more.

    I added a few more macro's, per your request, and changed wording on HN, DH and HoH.

    Yes, I agree we need to add stat priorities and explain mastery, but my time is up for now...work in progress...

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