Anyone notice that whoever builds the most tank items faster tends to win? Last game had a J4, Blitz, Kayle, Shen and Xin and all 5 of them just build pure tank, and we couldn't do much due to them having naturally high dmg. However i'm finding this game MUCH easier to play now that iv'e started playing dota 2, lol.
And some heroes has build-in defensive steroids (Garen, J4, Cho, Rammus, Sion, Maokai), for example, building Cho in health can be a total failure, because you will have low amount of armor/MR and be easy target to shut down because you don't have means to recover you health quickly (unlike Mundo). Building MR/Armor on some heroes are rewarding (Garen, Rammus) Garen has extra 30% defensive stats, Rammus will hit harder.
Just building Belt into Warmog's is not a form of snowballing, even with it you can lose hit trades to champions with easy escape (Rene, Lee, Xin, Vi), and building health against ranged champions (Jayce, Teemo, Nida) on top will end bad
Last edited by Charge me Doctor; 2013-02-10 at 09:23 AM.
Edit: Also don´t ever start dorans Blade on jarvan.
Last edited by Trollspwn; 2013-02-10 at 09:50 AM.
About not stacking HP on Garen and Rammus: Sure they scale with Resistance but their EHP will still rise more with HP than resistance.
@J4 build: Depends on if you if you lane top/mid or jungle. Top: Cloth+5 or Boots+3, Biants belt, Brutalizer, Sunfire or Warmogs (sunfire adds more damage the earlier you can get it), Hexdrinker or Aegis, Black Cleaver etc. I suck at giving item builds though because I hadrly ever build a fixed path and change it every game depending in my needs and who is fed.
Mid against AD would be the same. Against an AP you'd most likely get something like a Hextech and a dorans earlier so you can instantkill them at 6. If you can't reach them a warmogs will keep you in lane and make nearly impossible to kill for most AP champs.
Jungle: Don't complete the wriggles. Madreds is enough and go into tanky items (warmogs, aegis, Sunfire) if you don't get fed, add a brutalizer somewhere inbetween and complete it later.
Also warmogs makes it so towers aren't nearly as lethal in the early game. If you're winning your lane and rush a warmogs you can harass the guy under tower.
Personally, (on tanky bruisers) i prefer building aegis + upgraded boots first to get more versatility (i can sustain damage due to higher armor+MRes+regen and avoid ganks with increased movement speed). Building warmog as first item is very expensive, and you will be easy target to kill (due to lane phase, mid laner and jungler can easily dive into you tower and rape you)
And to get get twice amount of health on line you need to have at least 2 belts -.-
Winning lane and building more tanky IS a way to win games, but i want to point out that building straight health as first items (especially if your mid lane was lost) not always worth it, since you will be probably ganked several times or zoned out of lane.
And from personal experience, you don't want to rush one stat (as bruiser), you need to rise all your stats to dominate lane early (like getting Armor+5 pots on top against riven and then rushing armor boots), and building straight health is not a instant win option
How is Kha'zix nowadays? Has he been nerfed? His win% is pretty low but he seems interesting.
Additionally most bruisers deal more damage by going HP first because the additional damage they would do with with damage items is completely negated by the fact that they can stay in the fight longer. There is a reason why Hp stacking works so well and became so popular.
I've got a real problem with your logic how the best overall defensive item makes you EASIER to kill and dive than not having one at all. Obviously having more hp wont automatically win you the lane but denying the enemy the ability to all in you while you still can all in him, gives you a really strong advantage in lane.
But in the end we will just have to agree that we disagree
Get a brutalizer early, then make your t-force, finish cleaver, then finish your warmogs or go for the last whisper. Add in GA or Locket/Bulwark to the mix and you'll be a carry-demolishing machine.
Skills: Q>E>Q>E>Q>R>Q>W>Q>E>R>E>E>W>W>R>W>W. You don't need W early because it's too mana intensive.
Runes: I'd go 9x Arpen Mark and 3x AD quint, seal and glyph should be obvious.
Masteries: 9/21/0, you don't need 21 in offense, since the build allows you to decimate enemy carries in mere seconds.
~Advice from a Gold I 100% J4 winrate player. Don't disregard bruh.
IMO the best item against poke is a Banshee =)
And Omen brings much more utility into a fight than Warmogs
I mean extra HP can be negated by long-range poke and bringing ONLY HP is a bad thing to do, while bringing less HP but mixed with armor/MR (depending on threat) is good, but even with armor/MR you need means to recover your lost health (lifesteal, regen, abilities, potions).
I tried building Rene into sunfire and it was horrible, i did zero damage on line, i had 400 more health and ton of armor on line, but enemy irelia hit me twice as hard and i couldn't even deal damage to her due to healing from her lifesteal. But if i fight on top and mine enemy builds warmog, usually it won't end good for him since i still be able to crush through it with hit-and-run tactic.
Maybe i think like this because of that horrible olaf with 7/0/0 at 15 minute and boot+phage+warmog who owned our J4 on top and then went bot to kill us but gave me +500 shutdown and proceed to try to kill me under tower resulting 4 more kills and almost free Big Fucking Sword
Last edited by Charge me Doctor; 2013-02-10 at 02:46 PM.
Banshee is not great vs poke, it's not bad either though. It shines vs initiation (like those binds people fish all day long, or perhaps wild mumu/malphite ult). Extremely good on kiters to build on. (for example Ashe with that thing will just slow bruiser who will not get his secondary effect from gap closer and walk away, for example Xin Zhao charging it will not get his slow off, and between furor boots, frost arrows and PD/SS there is nothing to keep him in range anymore).
Sunfire is OP as hell, no other item gives so much damage on it's own, but it has some limits.
I don't personally know how good randuins is, because ... well it's a bit weird item at the moment, gives some edge over AD carry, but it's no longer that old item which had killer AS reduction, it's more like just slow/hp/armor item now. But warden's mail, the thing you build it from is extremely good item in lane vs autoattackers. Unlike tabis it also affect on-hit guys like Irelia.
When talking about poke, I think the best item against it is bulwark.
Last edited by AFK-Champion; 2013-02-10 at 02:48 PM.
cool, thanks for all the builds, I'll be trying them out momentarily...
time to ddduuunnnkkk!
Reading the A song of Ice and Fire series is like playing with an adorable puppy, then someone comes up out of nowhere and shoots the puppy, then punches you in the face
It's an interesting feeling when you get so fed as Poppy that your ult is more for just ignoring CC rather than damage. Triforce/Gunblade/Shurelya's/GA with a score of 19/2/9. Didn't even use my ult sometimes because I was chasing Kat and Graves away from their entire team in a 1v2 situation and neither wanted to stop running. Was more like let the one I catch die so the other can get away.
Oh Poppy, you so unfair to the enemy sometimes. Too bad it's hard to lane as Poppy and she has no wave clear for mass farming. Apparently Riot doesn't want to try to make Poppy viable for competitive play because of how oppressive she can be. I guess that makes sense considering she can win games all by herself if she gets items. They cant really mess with her ult or passive without ruining who Poppy is like how you cant change Shen's ult.