Blizzard's Anti PVP Hypocrisy

[Korgoth]

With 4.2 PVP players now have to build up multiple weeks of points to be eligible to purchase a Tier 1 weapon which is item level 378. PVE players have no wait time and can get an ilvl 384 drop off Ragnaros. So we have to wait weeks to get T1 and it's worse then what drops from Rag.

Then you have the T2 which might be withheld for months as Blizzard will hold back pvp players from getting their earned weapons due to the amount of PVE players who haven't gotten their drop yet. Even then the T2 weapon is much worse then the Heroic drop off Ragnaros. So a PVP player has to wait until the PVE player has an advantage and then the PVP player is allowed to get their worse weapon.

Blizzard supposedly does this to make it so PVE players wont feel like they have to PVP for a weapon. Yet now they are making it so a PVP player should feel like they need to pve for a weapon.

Here is the T2 pvp weapon, for this comparison the 2H mace.

Ruthless Gladiator's Bonegrinder
Binds when picked up
Two-Hand Mace
2418 - 3629 Damage Speed 3.60
(839.9 damage per second)
+460 Strength
+689 Stamina
Durability 120 / 120
Requires Level 85
Item Level 391
Equip: Increases your critical strike rating by 306 (1.71% @ L85).
Equip: Increases your resilience rating by 306 (3.87% @ L85).

Here is the Heroic Drop from Ragnaros, Sulfuras:
Sulfuras, The Extinguished Hand
Heroic
Binds when picked up
Two-Hand Mace
2700 - 4051 Damage Speed 3.80
(888.2 damage per second)
+446 Strength
+730 Stamina
Red Socket
Red Socket
Socket Bonus: +20 Strength
Durability 120 / 120
Requires Level 85
Item Level 397
Equip: Increases your critical strike rating by 333 (1.86% @ L85).
Equip: Increases your mastery rating by 262 (1.46 @ L85).

Sulfuras is 6 items levels higher, has over 400 more top end damage, and 2 Gem sockets with a bonus.

In fact moving from the T2 pvp weapon to Sulfuras is about the same size upgrade as T1 to T2, as it has the 2 gem sockets and slower speed which is better for PVP. With the T1 having 3200 top end, T2, 3600 top end, and Heroic Sulfuras 4000 top end.

By PVE'ing a PVP player can get a weapon that is practically a tier higher and they could get it before they could get the Tier 2 weapon.

So this is Blizzard's hypocrisy, making it so a PVE player wont want to pvp for a weapon, but making PVP players at a disadvantage in PVP if they dont PVE, and not just until T2 is released but for the whole season.

If Blizzard actually cared about PVP and making the loot equitable they would implement a T3 weapon, 2400 rating, with a 397 item level, 2 sockets and matching speed of the PVE weapon.

[Shoobie]

heres the thing. we just dont want pvp screwing up our pve game. if pve screws up pvp, we dont care. This is a pve game, so if you pvp on a pve game thats the whats gonna happen.

and if you dont believe me its a pve game, look at the content flow of both and try telling me its not a pve game. nuff said

[Iosif]

WoW really is a PvE game... PvP is a subculture within that game.

[Stanton Biston]

...

You're complaining about a mace that 4% of the guilded, raiding population will have access to over the course of the next 6 months.

That realistically, one or two guilds in the entirety of the world will have access to in the next 60 days.

If anything, this just underscores how many people play a 2h melee and like to whine, because I've seen more hate about that stupid mace than I've seen about the legendary caster staff that will be easier to get.

[Deleted]

heres the thing. we just dont want pvp screwing up our pve game. if pve screws up pvp, we dont care. This is a pve game, so if you pvp on a pve game thats the whats gonna happen.

and if you dont believe me its a pve game, look at the content flow of both and try telling me its not a pve game. nuff said

Thank you!
Oh and also: if at some day Blizzard decides that those who do world PvP get huge laserbeams pointing at them with saying "noobs here lolol", you know what? They can actually do that? it's their game, their rules. Mkay? So hypocrisy? Don't make me laugh =D

[Korgoth]

heres the thing. we just dont want pvp screwing up our pve game. if pve screws up pvp, we dont care. This is a pve game, so if you pvp on a pve game thats the whats gonna happen.

and if you dont believe me its a pve game, look at the content flow of both and try telling me its not a pve game. nuff said

Because having PVP weapons that are equal screws up PVE how? How does your raiders being able to get loot from another source if they can't get a drop a bad thing for PVE? And this game was always both. I've got 400 days played and all on the character I rolled in 2004; and PVP has always been in the game. It has changed, but then PVE has also changed just as much, if not more.

[Larwood]

You'd prefer if there were a bunch of PVErs PVPing just for the weapons?

[drroastbeef]

You are using a drop from heroic ragnaros for comparison. Very few are going to have him down anytime soon

[Stanton Biston]

You are using a drop from heroic ragnaros for comparison. Very few are going to have him down anytime soon

Didn't you hear? You can just stroll up to him and he hands everyone a i397 weapon appropriate to their class and spec just for entering the Firelands.

EDIT: Nevermind that his hammer SHOULD BE Orange and not Purple, since it was way back when.

[Deleted]

Because having PVP weapons that are equal screws up PVE how? How does your raiders being able to get loot from another source if they can't get a drop a bad thing for PVE? And this game was always both. I've got 400 days played and all on the character I rolled in 2004; and PVP has always been in the game. It has changed, but then PVE has also changed just as much, if not more.

400 days? Congratz! Perhaps it's now time to do something else?

And indeed, PvE has changed for PvP reasons. It has changed too much even ...

[Korgoth]

...

You're complaining about a mace that 4% of the guilded, raiding population will have access to over the course of the next 6 months.

That realistically, one or two guilds in the entirety of the world will have access to in the next 60 days.

If anything, this just underscores how many people play a 2h melee and like to whine, because I've seen more hate about that stupid mace than I've seen about the legendary caster staff that will be easier to get.

It just underscores that 2h melee are based so very much on weapon damage, and that advantage from it is huge.

For example, I just took an 8% damage nerf, making my damage range drop from 7k top end to 6.5k. That difference is roughly the same as going from T2 to Sulfuras due to the higher item level and slower speed. Slam will hit that much harder, which is significant.

[Deleted]

WoW is not a "PvE" game, its both. Get over it.

[Frog]

You'd prefer if there were a bunch of PVErs PVPing just for the weapons?

i see that everyday for the S9 weaps and will see that every week for the S10...

[Flaks]

So as I see it, normal mode raiding = normal arenas (<1800). Heroic mode raiding = 2200 rating arenas/rated bgs. Heroic ragnaros is above heroic mode raiding. I propose newer weapons be added so that heroic ragnaros = 2800 rating arenas/3000 bgs.

[Calgron]

Just so you know, raiders don't get weapons faster than pvp'ers. Raiders have to HOPE the weapon drops in the first place, then, they have to HOPE they can win the roll/have more points than the other melee in their raid. Pvp'ers only have to wait 5 weeks and be GUARANTEED a weapon. Most of the time in this 5 week period only one melee DPS out of a whole 25 man raid will have a weapon, when on the other hand, everyone doing arenas has their weapon. Learn to look at things from both sides of the table and stop just QQing cause its not as easy for you to get it anymore.

[Patrickstarr]

You'd prefer if there were a bunch of PVErs PVPing just for the weapons?

Yes, I would love that. Free HKs.

[Korgoth]

So only 4% of PVE players will get a Sulfuras? Alright lets make it fair then, Blizzard implements a T3 weapon, at lets say 2600 rating, which should be close to the top 4-5% of pvp players, and it matches the stats of Sulfuras, except of course for Resil instead of Mastery.

Whats the problem with this?

[Desminn]

aside from what people have already said here i dont see any serious pvper working that hard for a weapon that has a CHANCE to drop.

so most people you might encounter in pvp with this will either have a low rating or not much pvp gear.

the few that you do see with this that have a high rating and good pvp gear would also probably only be hurting themselves as by the time most people will get this a comparable (and it is very comparable) pvp weapon could have been obtained that has resilience and a lot of it nah i dont think the 400 extra top end and bit more of str will make that big of a difference to any serious pvper.

also, what are your thoughts and the legendary staff in this case? lol

ahhh right you prob want a 3k rating legendary weapon so its not unfair right?

[Patrickstarr]

So only 4% of PVE players will get a Sulfuras? Alright lets make it fair then, Blizzard implements a T3 weapon, at lets say 2600 rating, which should be close to the top 4-5% of pvp players, and it matches the stats of Sulfuras, except of course for Resil instead of Mastery.

Whats the problem with this?

The problem with that is that its a smart idea.

Let's see if this becomes Shadowmourne 2.0.
Let's see what % of the top melee teams have warriors, DKs, pallies, furals, etc with Raggy's hammer.

I'm willing to bet 90% of the teams.

[mickybrighteyes]

WoW is not a "PvE" game, its both. Get over it.

yet every patch really caters to pve and merely chucks slightly better armer on a vender for pvp.

WoW has never been about pvp really, the closest it was was during Kalgan's time during the first few seasons of arena. PvE has always come first, it's been that way since launch (which didn't include real pvp anyways).