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  1. #61
    I see a LOT of this:

    20X 100 g
    20X 100 g
    20X 99g
    20X 98g
    15X 75g
    20X 74g

    ...

    Man...Did people look at stack size to undercut?? lol.RIght now (everytime) there is not a single mat on the AH that is not affected somehow by this behavior.
    Is some kind of addon people use that induces to error? because i cant understand theres SO many guys that undercuts auctions of different stack size....or do people think they have to undercut every stack size with his full stacks?

    Human nature.A mistery to me.

  2. #62
    High Overlord Embodier's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Primi View Post
    I see a LOT of this:

    20X 100 g
    20X 100 g
    20X 99g
    20X 98g
    15X 75g
    20X 74g

    ...

    Man...Did people look at stack size to undercut?? lol.RIght now (everytime) there is not a single mat on the AH that is not affected somehow by this behavior.
    Is some kind of addon people use that induces to error? because i cant understand theres SO many guys that undercuts auctions of different stack size....or do people think they have to undercut every stack size with his full stacks?

    Human nature.A mistery to me.
    Actually many people don't want to have this relist stuff. They just hope to sell more than 1 gem when they got the timeframe where their auctions are the cheapest ones. I use that for strategic deep undercutting and to block a market/an item.

    The question in your posted example is: how is the supply and demand for that gem. If that was one of the top cut inferno rubies or top meta gems, I would buy them all and relist.
    If there is tons of cheap ore and you "know" the selleres as frequently relisters, don't interefere here, just undercut by some copper/silver.

  3. #63
    A quick reply for all the people who think that heavy undercutting, or buyers ignoring the 1c undercutters has any impact at all on serious AH players.

    You do know that serious AH sellers, and by that I mean anyone with 1 million gold, or above, use addons to automatically price and undercut auctions? These addons look at limits that the user has set, minimum list price, and so on. It means that any serious seller uses those addons to list and so doesn't even see when someone is undercutting them, by how much, and so on. All we do is go to the auction house with full bags, hit 'list' then spam a confirm key macro and drink a cup of tea. if someone is posting a cheap glyph or gem wall, we don't even see that, it has no effect on us. if someone has done that, then the addon just won't list my item, it saves them for when prices are back to normal.

    So, I hate to spoil your fun, but undercutting to get a reaction will not even flag up on my radar. Also, buying someone else's auction for more gold than mine, just because you don't like the fact that my addon doesn't list in round numbers, will also not register, I just don't see it. All you are doing is spending more of your gold, you are certainly not changing my behaviour because I can't even see what you are doing.

    Instead, I just list with the addon and then collect all the gold 12 hours later. There is usually so much gold and so many mails that I don't even check what sold. I can work that all later, again with another addon. So, any tactical undercutting and buying will not effect what I do.

    And that is how it is with most serious sellers that I know...

    If anyone is interested, I list with 4 bank alts, just to handle all the stock, each alt having finished goods from one crafting prof in their bags and own Guild Bank. Listing all the items held by those 4 bank alts takes about 10 mins total with addons, after you have setup all your groups and prices, which you do only once.

    I would only change how I do things if the gold stopped arriving in the mailbox.

    Saite

  4. #64
    Quote Originally Posted by Idoru View Post
    Once again you are projecting your own reasons for playing this game onto others. So let me say this again: I don't care about maximizing my virtual gold stash. No matter what you say, I don't care. Period.
    dont use the ah. or sell things for 1 silver, since you dont want to maximize. You obviously dont want to minimize your profits. Why don't you just grind dailies if you want a small amount of gold? Seriously, at this point do yourself a favor and get an AH addon like auctionator. If you sell more than 2 items a day it will reduce how much time you spend AH'ing by a ton. Then you will also see how easy it is and why people undercut when a mod tells you the price to set it at. This is the reason you see 1c undercuts, no one in their right mind is going to undercut by a copper using the garbage blizzard interface for the AH. Sure you could set the addon to undercut by 10 gold or something, but that would be stupid. And if you dont care what others have to say, why are you using the forums?
    Last edited by McCheese; 2011-07-06 at 04:04 PM.

  5. #65
    Same here. What gets me are the people who undercut by 20-50%, at a time when items are selling (rather than someone posting an outrageous price on an item). I'm talking about when enchanting mats start to go up, etc. Drives me nuts.
    Simple answer here, BUY EVERYTHING you see below your known listed sale point where you are actively getting sales. Stockpile their stock, and resell it at a slower rate. Maintain the slow feed into the market and maintain the higher price point.

    I do this often in the gem market and am quite happy that gems now stack in 20. It saves me a massive amount of mailbox space on my alts. Example: Catch someone that lowered the price from the usual 70-50g down to 30g. Then for some unknown reason they list 10x at 30g and people simply follow suit. Undercutting down to 20g. Well, I will ensure the issue is not as easily repeated. Buy up all the uncut gems of this listing. Buy out all the gems up to 30g. Relist my gems at 49g 75s x 5-8 depending on flow. Repeat the process for 20-25 cuts. Some days I may spend 5-10k buying out the market. But I always make 5-10k every day in overall sales, so an output cost of 20-30k a week in defense costs and usually 5-10k in raw ore to maintain a higher price benefits everyone in the gem market. Gem sales avg 8k a day , 56k a week.

    Then dabble in a few other markets. Scrolls, Glyphs, and epic resales and I usually hit 75k profit(150-180k net) a week. Which in the end supports my speculation for for 4.2 and by horrible BOE addiction. Yes this works, No it doesn't take a ton of time (15-20min sessions 2x a day). Sitting on 1.35mil and only working hard enough to maintain it.
    As ret I feel like an apartment complex handyman. Supposed to be able to do it all, but I suck at everything I do compared to any professional. Sure I can fix a leaking faucet and screw the hinges back into a cabinet door, but god forbid a water main breaks and the cabinets fall off the wall. Handymen are good for 1 thing, applying bandaids. If you want the job done right, hire a professional. -Furbiscuit

  6. #66
    Undercutting costs way too much money, I just post my items at the same price as the cheapest competitor and choose the 12h option. That puts me at the top of the list as long as his/her auctions still run for more than 12h.

  7. #67
    Fluffy Kitten Aciaedius's Avatar
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    Calling undercutting a bad thing just implies to me that someone would be a sore loser, and frankly, makes me wonder if they have ever had to compete for profit in real life. I don't get the attitude that competition is bad. Why would it ever be?
    PvE:er to the bone. Plays a druid. Also plays DotA and a whole bunch of other stuff. Listens to mostly everything.
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  8. #68
    I always undercut gems for about 1g. Its business, keep it up or get out of the way

  9. #69
    High Overlord Mob's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Furioer View Post
    Simple answer here, BUY EVERYTHING you see below your known listed sale point where you are actively getting sales. Stockpile their stock, and resell it at a slower rate. Maintain the slow feed into the market and maintain the higher price point.
    This is ofc correct but you can do it only if you have a big chunk of money to spend. I'm currently at 45k gold so i can't even TRY to stockpile every other seller's stocks. I would end up with 0 money, a very big stock of gems and the AH situation would be the same.

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  10. #70
    You are undercutting every time you post something in AH at a lower price. Doesn't mean anything if you undercut by 1c or 200g.

    I undercut by 1c because i'm not dumb. I want to sell my things asap, so i want them on top of the AH list. But posting them for half the price means that i will gain half the gold and mats price will drop down, becuase there will someone who will post things at an even lower price.

    You want to earn money? Undercut for a few copper.

    You want to crush prices? Undercut for tons.

  11. #71
    Quote Originally Posted by Salamalak View Post
    Hello

    I'd just like to know what you think about undercutting. Many peoples says it's bad, many others says it's acceptable. What about you ?

    For my part, i think it is acceptable, but only if it's done by a fair amount. Let me explain:

    Not so long ago, i looked at the AH to know the prices of the enchanting scroll that grant +20 stats to chest (peerless stats). There was 2 of them at 1999g each. I made a scroll, and listed it for 1499g. 2 hours later, someone else listed 2 of these scroll for 1299g. This is what i call "fair and acceptable" because they are actualy willing to sell it cheaper than mine. No problem with that.

    Another case now. I looked at "delicate inferno ruby", and the lowest ones listed was at 149g. I list 6 of them for 139g 99s 99c. 30 minutes ago, someone else list 10 of them at 139g 98s 99c. I personaly find it very irritating. Should i be that much irritated ?

    So, what is your opinion about undercutting ? Is this acceptable to undercut by a fair amount ? and if it is, what is the threshold between a "fair" amount and a "not-fair" amount ?

    Another thing: 2 weeks ago, i had about 400x inferno ink sleeping on my bank. I looked at the AH: 30g each. I listed all of them for 15g each, just to get rid of these. Couple of minutes later, i get a wisper from someone who is known to be an "Auction house player" on my server. He told me i was killing the economy by dooing that. I asked him why he didn't just buy all of them and relist it for more, and his answer was some kind of wall of text about how the economy is working.. and well, i didn't understand half of what he meant.. (i know very little about economy, and i'm still trying to understand why the gasoline prices is gooing up these years.. lol).
    You got it all wrong. You are exactly the kind of AH user I hate the most. Always undercutting more than what is needed. Your example about the peerless stats. If your's is cheaper, people will buy it. No need to undercut the price by 500g (jesus this is making mad). Just undercut by 1 copper. This what I always do. Nothing is more infuriating than for example resetting the price of some gem and actually put it up for a reasonable price like 80g. Then some douchebag undercuts to 30g. I seriously think there is something mentally wrong with these folks.

    But hey, atleast it is cheap stuff for me to relist for higher price. So I end up making nice profit regardless.
    Last edited by Keulanaama; 2011-07-07 at 12:55 PM.

  12. #72
    The Lightbringer Toffie's Avatar
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    I made about 130 k in 7 days, by undercutting by 1 g. Buying from people like you (clueless) and reselling for the price they are suppose to be (little higher) Everything i put up, gets sold. I may be pissed at people that ruin it for the rest of the people trying to make money by putting 20 scrolls of an enchant for 50 % the price.. I tend to whisper them that they are throwing money away ( butthurt ).. But i've just learned to live with it, I just buy it off and resell.. I never lose money by it.

    You tell me you saw the inks for 30 g and put them up for 15 g ? Why? Keep the market stable dude... I see no issue if it's just 1-3 items listed poorly... But 400? Do you hate gold? I'll gladly take you're gold..

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  13. #73
    Quote Originally Posted by Toffie View Post
    I made about 130 k in 7 days, by undercutting by 1 g. Buying from people like you (clueless) and reselling for the price they are suppose to be (little higher) Everything i put up, gets sold. I may be pissed at people that ruin it for the rest of the people trying to make money by putting 20 scrolls of an enchant for 50 % the price.. I tend to whisper them that they are throwing money away ( butthurt ).. But i've just learned to live with it, I just buy it off and resell.. I never lose money by it.

    You tell me you saw the inks for 30 g and put them up for 15 g ? Why? Keep the market stable dude... I see no issue if it's just 1-3 items listed poorly... But 400? Do you hate gold? I'll gladly take you're gold..

    Sincerely, rich wow player......... -.-
    Thank you. Undercutting by just 1 copper ain't necessary on all occasions, but when the price isn't outrageous to begin with, I just can't quite grasp why someone would deliberately undercut you for more than 5%. That is just stupid. But there is nice ways around this. Especially in gems. Drive the prices down yourself with huge quantities of cheap gems, and when people undercut you, cash in, buy their auctions and cancel yours and re-list shit for their actual price. Just have to know when to do it to not lose in the ensuing battle.

  14. #74
    I usually don't undercut. I use the Auctionater add-on, and it shows like "3 stacks of 20 for 100g". If there are only a few stacks at the lowest price, I go higher so when those are bought out mine will be the lowest. Since I have Herbalism and Skinning, I try not to undercut and drive prices down so I can keep making loads of money.

  15. #75
    Blademaster
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    I personally do what I need to, to sell my stuff. Sure, I would like to make as much as possible. I play on a heavily populated server, so if you don't undercut by enough, you'll just get undercut yourself.

  16. #76
    Here is a RL analogy:

    Let's say Future Shop and Wal-Mart both sell the exact same computer.

    Future Shop price: 1999,99$
    Wal-Mart price: 1999,97$

    This is what Wal-Mart does to stay true to their "lowest price guarantee". If it works in RL, it works in VL.

  17. #77
    Bloodsail Admiral Idontlikeyou's Avatar
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    All I have to say, if the higher price is so great, and you make so much gold, why is your item still on the AH?

    I farm pretty much everything. When I say farm, I mean pick up while doing my dailies. I turn around and base my price off of that while staying above vendor prices.. Got a problem with it, sorry. I will undercut you to sell my crap, as it didnt cost me a single copper to obtain in the first place. If you can make more gold with your prices, buy my crap, and relist them.
    "My sword? [Heck] yeah I know how to use it. What's to understand about swish-swish-stab? It's a [freak'n] sword dude, it's not a fighter jet." -Tucker "This One Goes to Eleven

  18. #78
    Quote Originally Posted by Idontlikeyou View Post
    All I have to say, if the higher price is so great, and you make so much gold, why is your item still on the AH?

    I farm pretty much everything. When I say farm, I mean pick up while doing my dailies. I turn around and base my price off of that while staying above vendor prices.. Got a problem with it, sorry. I will undercut you to sell my crap, as it didnt cost me a single copper to obtain in the first place. If you can make more gold with your prices, buy my crap, and relist them.
    Here is a fine example of someone who knows nothing about economics.

    Two words: opportunity cost.

    Undercutting so much did cost you something.

  19. #79
    Bloodsail Admiral Idontlikeyou's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maelstrom51 View Post
    Here is a fine example of someone who knows nothing about economics.

    Two words: opportunity cost.

    Undercutting so much did cost you something.
    Cost me what? My time? That time was spent doing dailies. I had a surplus of items that I sold, with zero cost to myself.

    Sorry you dont like it, just buy my stuff will ya, if you think its so cheap. Not worth your time to reinvest? Then I rest my case.

    Last thing, prove to me that your high prices were going to sell. I posted them when you still had them up on the AH. So apparently not everyone wants that one item.

    Time and time again, when I post something it sells. I have watched high prices just sit there and not sell even when they are the only ones selling.

    Most people will go, is it worth X amount of gold to buy that, or should I just go farm it.

    Price to high, and you will force people to go farm. Not everyone has 10,000 gold just to unload on the AH. I would rather target the people with a few thousand gold, and sell to them. Consider me the generic brand, vs your name brand.
    Last edited by Idontlikeyou; 2011-07-08 at 12:35 AM.
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  20. #80
    undercutting by a small margin preserves the price and "first up is best dressed" (if you had siblings growing up you will understand that saying

    Id rather be undercut by 1c than 20g. It keeps the price high. It keeps everyone's margins higher. Whether they are 1c or 20g cheaper they STILL have the jump on me and will be the first to sell.

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