Beth'tilac 10N - How many Frenzy stacks can your healers take?

[Deleted]

Hello MMO-Champion!

I recently registered on this site just for asking this question, as we spent two consecutive nights wiping on Beth'tilac after 3 shotting Shannox, and while reading how everyone had an easy time with her it got me asking "Why can't we kill the damned bug?"

I know for a fact that our DPS isn't cutting it, basically due to having too many ramp-up classes (Fire Mage, Enhancement sham, Affli lock). We've tried switching the mages specc but then the AoE falls short. Anyhow, the times we do make it to P2, with only the Enhancement shaman up top, we die to the Frenzy. People seem to suggest to pop heroism at about 40 % hp which is what we're saving it for, and dying around the same amount, at this time we have between 25-35 stacks of Frenzy, and the AoE starts dealing 50-60k damage, DPS is obviously hanging low but are our healers too weak and should they be able to handle 40-50 stacks with hero up toward the end?

Thank you for any advice given.

[Deleted]

This save, we screwed up and Bethilac healed to 100% at start od P2, we killed it anyway with 31 stacks of frenzy at the end, if you have more stacks while not messing up phase transition, healing is not your problem, DPS is, more than 30 stacks is pretty much IK for your tanks even if healers can handle raid dmg.

I also dont uderstand what you say about ramp up classes, ramp up takes at most 20-25 sec, and aff locks are currently one of best DPS spec singletarget overall)

[Deleted]

I'm not sure regarding your iLevel but we're all 356-360 geared so we're cutting the bare minimum, I don't consider any of our DPS "bad" players per se, Maybe she's just a gearcheck that we're failing but the amount of people calling her piss easy is worrying.

The ramp up part being for spinners primarily, the lock and the mage for example wastes so much damage potential having to deal with them.

[Kortiah]

Although I think Enh Shaman is one of the class with the shortest "ramp up" in the game.
Our shaman was capable of reaching his 21k+ mark within 10sec maybe...

And ramp up doesn't apply for Beth P2 as it last few minutes

[Deleted]

The ramp up part isn't an issue for P2, but rather P1 which is where we struggle.

Sure our DPS may not cut it in P2 but that is no way the classes fault, what is an issue for our ramp up classes (shaman having to get 5 stacks of searing flames for instance) is spinners, Our DPS falls so incredibly low in P1 it's unreal, this is were the issue lies as we're forced to have 4 people down and can only bring Beth to 85-80 % before P2.

[Deleted]

My guild is using heroism much much earlier (around 10-15 stacks) to get her down faster and relieve a little bit of pressure. The question is: how much % does she have when she gets down to you? she should be at around 85-90%, thats what we have. Also, time your healer cooldowns (tranq, totem of resto shamy, etc), this should help a lot.


ps: we also had an enh. shamy, fire mage and affl. lock so it shouldnt really be your dps classes fault...

[vhaman]

We send 2 DPS up top, Frost DK and Mut rogue. The 3 DPS on bottom are aff lock, spriest, hunter. The hunter easily solo's the Spiderlings, leaving the dot classes to the Spinners and Drones.

Also, Enhance has little "ramp up" if played right. It doesn't have immediate "burst" in the first GCD, but once searing totem starts building stacks, you're done.

Use the classes you have in the best roles possible, melee work well on top. Good bursty AOE works well on Spiderlings, build up dot classes work well on Drone and multidot Spinners.

It sounds like you problem is only having 1 DPS up top. If 3 people can't handle adds below they need to pick it up. For reference, Beth'tilac IS a semi-gearcheck fight, but at 356-360 you SHOULD be okay if playing correctly. Each of you DPS should be doing a minimum of 17k, preferably 19+.

[Deleted]

Alright, Vhaman, we'll try that but I find 19k+ next to impossible to do with our current gear level, granted i'm an Elemental Shaman which aren't exactly in the perfect condition right now, but I pull 20-22k on Argaloth (without food or flask, but still) and with a fight with as much target swapping etc. as Beth doing 19k+ Just seems out of this world.

[Mowg]

Ramp up classes, or more specifically DoT classes should be at the top for phase 1 (In my opinion). Right before they need to jump down, they can quickly refresh all their DoTs, which will continue to tick even when they're at the bottom.

[Jaingo]

We downed her on tuesday with a similar group composition. Our mage, me, solo d the spinners in phase 1. I was able to add dps to other mobs as soon as they died. I am not fire, and I would not recommend fire on this fight for a mage. Thats just me though.If she drops down got the final phase at full health, then you will have trouble. And we lust as soon as we are clear of p2 adds.

[seam]

We run Afflic lock, Fire mage, SV Hunter, Spriest, then either Rogue or Paladin.

Myself(The hunter) and the Mage go on little adds, then dps Drones in downtime. Spriest is on the Drone full time, and Afflic Lock is on Spinners alone. Rogue/Paladin goes up top.

Looking at our last kill, we get to 31 Frenzies before she dies.

Here's the log, if it helps.


30ish seems to be the time when shit hits the fan, though.

[Graven2]

Pigy, my guild is in the same situation (and I'm an Ele Shaman also). The issue we had I think was in assignments. We were always assigning 2-3 DPS to the Spiderlings as a top priority when the truth is our Frost DK could likely solo them. We're going to try it again tonight with the Enhance Shammy going up top (he can bring her under 80% solo), me on Spinners, DK on Spiderlings, Fire Mage on Drone and Hunter going where needed (mostly on Spinners I suspect.

Also, concerning your DPS, I'd suggest you stick yourself on the Spinners as well and do your best to multi-dot other Spinners and the Drone -- it should help significantly.

[Nekrabyte]

we killed it last night, having her at about 73% for the start of phase 2, and it got to almost 35 stacks before it started falling apart and we killed her by the skin of our teeth (6 alive i think?)

we were 12/12 1/13H last tier and are mostly low 360's ilvl.

[shadowik12]

As pally healer in last kill my raid group take 33.
Rogue and warrior dps up top all 3 times.

[Magnificat]

Had to brez a tank at 33... killed her at 35... stupid healing-up-to-full boss.

[zuke8675309]

We got our kill at 31 Frenzy stacks. Dps is Kitty druid, frost dk, spriest, arcane mage, and SV hunter.

We sent the kitty druid up top the first two times and kept all 5 dps down the last time so that we were certain adds were under control below. Boss was at 80% when phase 2 began. We found that the spinners fall to the ground if they are taunted so what we did was have our prot warrior (with vigilance for taunt refresh) taunted all the spinners to the ground and grouped them up with the drones. Spinners died from tank cleaves and spriest aoe splash.

We found it very important to plan healing and defensive cooldowns ahead of time because the boss hits HARD and even more so with frenzy stacks. Tanks were told not to use their 50% cooldown during phase 1 in order to save it. At the start of phase 2 our DK tank had the boss first and used minor cooldowns while he had the boss, prot warrior took boss and used shield block & last stand, DK then used some more minor cooldowns followed by IBF, prot warrior then used shield wall and I think that's when the boss dropped. Lay on Hands and Guardian Spirit got used in there too somewhere.

Afterwards our holy pally calmly said on vent, "I already hate that guy."

[Neganova]

35 stacks is quite a few. I think when we downed her on 10m, she was maybe in the 27-28 range.

[Denae]

Once you get past 25 stacks or so, it's very possible for the tank to die from an unlucky melee hit + fire aoe that happens at the same time. Past 30 stacks, healers will oom pretty quick from the raid damage going out. Basically, this fight is entirely on the dps -- if dps if high, the fight is a joke, if dps is low, it is impossible.

[Magnificat]

35 stacks is quite a few.

Agreed.. unfortunately she was at 100% shortly after p2 started so we just pushed it as well as we could. Would have been far less if she hadn't healed. We had shaman/druid/hpriest healing... probably couldn't have managed without all that aoe.

[Skelly]

Agreed.. unfortunately she was at 100% shortly after p2 started so we just pushed it as well as we could. Would have been far less if she hadn't healed. We had shaman/druid/hpriest healing... probably couldn't have managed without all that aoe.

You have to get all dps to focus on the last batch of spiderlings than come down. There isn't much time between them spawning and her descending, and if any are still up, she'll start eating for 10% health each no matter how far away they are.