1. #1

    Ragnaros and Bloodlust

    When do you guys use Bloodlust? Do you feel that is the most optimal time to use it?


    Currently, my Ten Man is working on Ragnaros. We are making it to the second Transition, but in order to do so we need to use Bloodlust in the second phase. If we do not use bloodlust in the second phase then he spawns a 4th set of Molten Seeds at 40% right before the transition starts and we are stuck with Molten Elementals during the transition and invariably leads to a wipe. I do not feel like this is an optimal time for it, but if we do not use it then we would have to stop DPS and take care of the 4th set of Molten Seeds. Which would strain the healers more as I think the fight is balanced to transition before the 4th set of seeds come out.

    Should we continue to Bloodlust in Phase 2 to push to the transition or Hold DPS and do a 4th set of Molten Seeds in order to Bloodlust the second transition or 3rd phase?

  2. #2
    We use it at the end of the second transition when its time to down the big adds and move into P3

    You are having a slight DPS problem imo
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  3. #3
    You should time it so that you push Rag past 40% after you kill the Molten Elementals. My raid group just downed Rag for the first time this week and we time warped when we were killing the scion lords in the second phase transition.

  4. #4
    We are also a 10-man guild, and we found it was most useful to use once all of the Sons of Flame are dead (except for one, to keep the intermission phase longer) and we need to blow up the Scions before the last phase starts.

  5. #5
    Hold dps and let the 4th set of seeds go out. Lust after the Sons of Flame are all down and you are on the Scions.

    [Edit: post above me made a great point to leave a son of flame up at low health to lengthen the phase.]

  6. #6
    As the people above said, let the 4th set of seeds spawn.
    Remember to use any raid cooldowns available to you while seeds are on you, as well as any personals when you do not have a raid cooldown ready.

    Ragnaros spawns his first Meteor after both Lava Scions are dead, or after a set amount of time. So after you are finished dealing with the Sons of Flame, focus down one Scion.
    Then have the second scion die as close you can to the Meteor spawn so you will have as little uptime as possible.
    Heroism / Bloodlust / Time Warp will be used once sons of flame are done with, so your raid can do max dmg to Scions and Ragnaros.
    Keep as much dps on Ragnaros after 1 is dead, and move the primary dps back to the last scion when you have to.

    Remember that the dps in phase 3 need to dmg the boss a further 30%, so have the healers kite the comets as long as possible. When a dps is targetted, have them do whatever to keep the meteor on them for as long as possible without sacrificing their dps. When a dps can't take a comet any longer, blow the comet back.

  7. #7
    Does anyone know what the 4th Set of Seeds come with? This is what I have for the timer breakdowns and how things go for the first 3.

    Molten Seed 1 spawn
    We run to the other side
    Molten Seeds Explode
    Engulfing Flames somewhere When all seeds get to us
    We kill the seeds
    Spread out

    Engulfing Flames + Molten Seed 2 Spawn at same time
    We run to the other side
    Molten Seeds Explode + Sulfurus Smash Right when seeds explode
    We dodge the hammer + Kill the seeds
    Spread out

    Molten Seeds Spawn (A sulfurs smash goes down right before this one)
    We run to other side
    Molten Seeds Explode
    Engulfing Flames somewhere when all seeds have gotten to us and are 70-30% health
    Move out of Engulfing Flames and Kill Seeds

    I'm guessing it is going to be Sulfurs Smash when the Seeds get to us, but if anyone knows the relative timing that would be sweet.

  8. #8
    Moderator Wilderness's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Myrkur View Post
    When do you guys use Bloodlust? Do you feel that is the most optimal time to use it?


    Currently, my Ten Man is working on Ragnaros. We are making it to the second Transition, but in order to do so we need to use Bloodlust in the second phase. If we do not use bloodlust in the second phase then he spawns a 4th set of Molten Seeds at 40% right before the transition starts and we are stuck with Molten Elementals during the transition and invariably leads to a wipe. I do not feel like this is an optimal time for it, but if we do not use it then we would have to stop DPS and take care of the 4th set of Molten Seeds. Which would strain the healers more as I think the fight is balanced to transition before the 4th set of seeds come out.

    Should we continue to Bloodlust in Phase 2 to push to the transition or Hold DPS and do a 4th set of Molten Seeds in order to Bloodlust the second transition or 3rd phase?
    The enrage timer for normal Rag is crazy long compared to how long the fight takes so why worry about the 4th set of Molten Seeds? Just don't push him into the second transition until you finish the seeds and then you can use lust at a better time (either at the end of the 2nd transition or we just use it in P3).
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  9. #9
    Bloodsail Admiral Saegno's Avatar
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    On our kill we found that the scions die fast enough without hero and saved it for when he was at 35ish% to maximize execute time. It sounds to me like you are having DPS issues if you are getting to many molten seed spawns.
    Being the gear check that rag is, that doesn't surprise me. We went into it mostly 372 geared(Myself being the lowest geared of the bunch at 363) with some 378's.

    As for the 4th seed spawn, I would imagine it to be another hammer phase followed closely by fire. Our timers went seeds seeds spawn, kill em, fire about half way to dead, spread, seeds spawn, hammer, kill them, spread, fire, seeds spawn, kill them, next phase.
    Last edited by Saegno; 2011-07-19 at 07:43 PM.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lohe View Post
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  10. #10
    I wonder if, with the super long enrage timer, if some folks lust/warp/hysteria immediately and then again when everyone's debuff has worn off ? Haven't been into the fight yet myself.

  11. #11
    Bloodsail Admiral Saegno's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Count Zero View Post
    I wonder if, with the super long enrage timer, if some folks lust/warp/hysteria immediately and then again when everyone's debuff has worn off ? Haven't been into the fight yet myself.
    I would imagine that pushing the fight that long will have healers OOMing before the second hero.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lohe View Post
    If you're semi-hardcore or semi-casual what's the other half? To me, they're both the same thing.
    Canicus - 577 - Arcane Mage - US Mal'Ganis Horde - 12/14H T16

  12. #12
    There's almost no damage in p2. You can wait for a fourth set of seeds if you need to with no real consequence. Your healers are either overhealing too much, you're not spreading enough for the seeds, or you're somehow taking a ton of unnecessary damage. P1 has the most damage by a fairly wide margin with the traps.

    We place the two tanks, two healers and one dps on the far left side (hugging the edge), and one healer and the rest of the DPS on the far right side (hugging that edge). When seeds spawn, everyone runs straight for the middle, then we split up again as soon as adds are dead.

    The most optimal time to burn hero I think would be at the end of the second transition phase. Getting the extra burst damage to take down the two big adds from there is crucial to having a smoother and less hectic p3.

    I don't get why people are freaking out over healer mana. If the healers are good and your raid doesn't run into lava or waves, it's impossible to go OOM on this fight. On Normal mode, there isn't much dangerous damage, and it's all very, very spread out and easily controlled. So long as you manage your cooldowns properly and don't freak out and overheal, you can't run out of mana. I end the fight with like 60-70% mana as a Resto Druid. Our Pally and Shaman end at a good 40-50% themselves.

  13. #13
    Use it in p3 after the scions are dead.
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