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  1. #581
    Over 9000! Nindoriel's Avatar
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    It doesn't really surprise me, that WoW lost a few subscribers. Not because the game sucks, but because it's just normal, that the numbers go up and down a little bit. Sure 1 million is a lot, but if you look at this chart...

    http://users.telenet.be/mmodata/Charts/WoW.png

    It was at 12 million in 2009, then it dropped a little bit during Wrath (ignore the asia thing), then it climbed back to 12 million when Cataclysm was released, now it goes down a little bit... It will go up again eventually. Sure some day, the subscriptions will start falling drastically and will one day put an end to WoW, but that day will be far into the future, and even then, MMOs can survive with a few thousand subscriptions.

    Just look at the numbers of all the other MMOs.

    0-50.000 subscriptions
    http://users.telenet.be/mmodata/Charts/Subs-4.png

    50.000-150.000 subscriptions
    http://users.telenet.be/mmodata/Charts/Subs-3.png

    150.000-1.000.000 subscriptions
    http://users.telenet.be/mmodata/Charts/Subs-2.png

    1.000.000-12.000.000 subscriptions
    http://users.telenet.be/mmodata/Charts/Subs-1.png

    Closest to WoW is Aion with less than 3.000.000 subs.
    A lot of those games like Warhammer, Age of Conan and Rift get a lot of subs and then after a few months they drastically fall again. Look at Rift. They had about 600.000 subs, now it's down to less than 500.000.
    From all of these MMOs, WoW is the one, that has the least problems with dropping subs right now.

  2. #582
    High Overlord Dirtydozen's Avatar
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    Can't wait for this years Blizzcon, gonna be fun to hear what they have to say on the upcoming expansion and titan.

  3. #583
    The Patient razisgosu's Avatar
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    WoW subscribers are going to continue to fall, I for one am going to be deactivating my account after my next 6 month cycle is up, so it will end around the end of June.

  4. #584
    Quote Originally Posted by DoubleTrouble View Post
    Correct!
    Why? Its simply because of the shared 10/25 ID system. People mainly raiding 10mans used to be able to PUG 25mans when they had time and the other way round. Why was that so important?
    I want to add to this as I think this is a big part. Another part is guild runs. Our guild has been mostly 10 man focused but we always ran 25 man twice a week. With 2 10 man groups who knew the fights there were enough of those 20 (like 12-15) who wanted to 25 man and we could fill it in with others from the guild. We would have about 10 regulars who ran just 25 man and then we would fill the last spots with whomever was on or PUGs.

    I raided 5 days a week. With shared lockouts that was gone. I leveled another tank and tried to get 25 man going, but of those 20 in 10 man groups, only a few could/would dedicate time for a second raid ready toon. The 25 man failed!

    A lot of the 10 man folks just log on to raid and log off. I rolled a PvP toon for arena, but without PvP there would be no reason to log on between raids. Not everyone likes to both PvP and PVE.

    So we have seen people sort of drop off after years of playing.

  5. #585
    Over 9000! Nindoriel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by razisgosu View Post
    WoW subscribers are going to continue to fall, I for one am going to be deactivating my account after my next 6 month cycle is up, so it will end around the end of June.
    How do you even know that?

  6. #586
    Quote Originally Posted by Nindoriel View Post
    How do you even know that?
    Economy for starters.. + the fact that a large playerbase of any MMO are poor people who dont have a dollar to their name and receive govt aid or are in the military.
    These people should get a life

  7. #587
    Over 9000! Nindoriel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darlok View Post
    Economy for starters.. + the fact that a large playerbase of any MMO are poor people who dont have a dollar to their name and receive govt aid or are in the military.
    These people should get a life
    Economy tells you, that the numbers of subscriptions of a certain MMO will continue to fall, because they are bouncing back and forth between 11 and 12 million since 2009? Again I have to ask, how do you know that?

    Quote Originally Posted by Darlok View Post
    + the fact that a large playerbase of any MMO are poor people who dont have a dollar to their name and receive govt aid or are in the military.
    These people should get a life
    This "fact", like every other "fact" needs proof first. There is absolutely no reason for you to assume something like that. Throwing around phrases like "a large playerbase of any MMO" without any concrete evidence doesn't really mean anything. Did you make a survey or some kind of study, that looked at the financial situation of MMO players? And if so, why were the subscriptions for WoW continually rising from 2005 to 2009? What changed now that " a large part of the playerbase" now can't afford it anymore?

    And even more so, to even classify someone as a player of an MMO like WoW, means those are people currently paying a subscription. So saying, that WoW players are poor and can't afford a subsription, doesn't even make any sense. Because to be a WoW player, you have to have an active subsription.

    To say, that the WoW subs drop, because most MMO players are poor, would mean subsription numbers for every MMO must be continually dropping, which isn't even logically possible.
    Last edited by Nindoriel; 2011-08-27 at 02:17 PM.

  8. #588
    Pandaren Monk Deleo's Avatar
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    A product's life cycle from marketing PoV



    The only problem is figuring out where in the chart wow is atm. Judging by Blizzard's approach and marketing strategy I'd say wow has reached maturity. Diversity of market is one of the approaches that companies take when the product is in the estate of maturity, AKA "milk it to death" phase. I'd be surprised if they manage to turn this around and will be happy to play a more interesting game when they do.

    There is nothing wrong with it though. There is no need for everyone to enjoy the same game and you don't need each other's approval to play a game. The mindset of what I have/do is better than what you have/do has to stop. If you don't enjoy wow and play some other game you don't need to curse people who do play it and vice versa.
    Last edited by Deleo; 2011-09-03 at 11:31 AM.
    I've walked the realms of the dead. I have seen the infinite dark. Nothing you say. Or do. Could possibly frighten me.
    We are not monsters! We are not the mindless wretches of a ghoul army! NO! We are a force even more terrifying! We are the chill in a coward's spine! We are the instruments of an unyielding ire! WE ARE THE FORSAKEN!
    Those who do not stand with the Forsaken stand against them. And those who stand against the Forsaken will not stand long.

  9. #589
    Over 9000! Nindoriel's Avatar
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    Has anyone ever considered, that maybe 12 million subscribers is as much as possible? All of the other MMOs arent even close to that. You can't get the whole world to play your game. There's a limited amount of people even interested in stuff like MMOs. At some point it's just not possible to gain more customers.

  10. #590
    I'll be back for 4.3.
    Don't let me down blizz

  11. #591
    Quote Originally Posted by Nindoriel View Post
    Has anyone ever considered, that maybe 12 million subscribers is as much as possible? All of the other MMOs arent even close to that. You can't get the whole world to play your game. There's a limited amount of people even interested in stuff like MMOs. At some point it's just not possible to gain more customers.
    Do you seriously expect Blizzard to suddenly get their lost subs back? Good luck with that... lols

    WoW is getting old and nothing can stop that. Decline will continue until all "casuals" quit. You will end up with lore nerds and hardcores. Hardcores eventually quit because of the lack of content as usual.

  12. #592
    dayum! looks like the final loss was the kick in the butt blizzard so badly needed

  13. #593
    dayum! looks like the final loss was the kick in the butt blizzard so badly needed
    I suspect Blizzard is getting vocal because Q3 is almost over, and that Q2 loss, unfortunately for them, doesn't look to be anywhere close to "final".

    We'll know in early November if that was the case.
    "There is a pervasive myth that making content hard will induce players to rise to the occasion. We find the opposite. " -- Ghostcrawler
    "Almost every time I have gotten to know a critic personally, they keep up with the criticism but lose the venom." -- Ghostcrawler
    I hate these casual Fridays ruining it for real Fridays.

  14. #594
    The Lightbringer shadowkras's Avatar
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    Raise from your grave!

    Necroposting at it's best.
    People take stupidity to a whole new level when they sit in front of a computer.

    www.poepra2.com.br Um blog para quem prefere jogos multiplayer.

  15. #595
    Dreadlord roboscorcher's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nindoriel View Post
    Has anyone ever considered, that maybe 12 million subscribers is as much as possible? All of the other MMOs arent even close to that. You can't get the whole world to play your game. There's a limited amount of people even interested in stuff like MMOs. At some point it's just not possible to gain more customers.
    Yup, I believe the term is called 'market saturation.'

  16. #596
    The Patient Phocket's Avatar
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    If you know anything about marketing, the only way to determine where you're at is to review sales data. Optimally, you want to be ready to release a new patch or new content when you think you're in the maturity stage, just before the decline stage. Now, this being said, it doesn't mean we're in the decline stage because general fluctuations do occur, and one cannot jump to conclusions as to what part of the product cycle you're in. That being said, Blizz could be entering maturity, and they probably realize this. We shall see soon, because this type of thing can only be speculated and not calculated.
    Quote Originally Posted by Lokoz View Post
    Me: "Ok if its a healer/dps go for healer then dps! Alright?"
    Partner: "What if its a Paladin combo?"
    Me: "Then just leave..."

  17. #597

    Straight talk

    Ive read alot of the posts above and felt i should make a few points.

    Yes Blizzard has nerfed the game content drastically since TBC. Not at the release of TBC but when the requirements for the raids were removed. Battle Grounds like AV and WSG have been nothing but zerg fests, resources and time limits on a battle? Ridiculous. Battles go until its over, have you capped three flags? no? then continue until you do. Have you killed the opposing general and conquered the the opposing forces battlements? no? then get on with it. Yes AV took hours, often, but it was a 40 man Battle ground. get over it its meant to be tough to win and yes even turtles were expected.. Its called defense, not that 90% of the player base even has a clue of what that word means.

    Raids... wow theres a good one... many players have the opinion you should have access to all the gear in the game as a casual player.....Are you delusional? A raid is a 20 man cooperative instance that requires teamwork of the highest ability. It takes preparation and scheduling to make them happen. The LFR system is nice but few if any of the idiots using it could have survived in Vanilla Molten Core.

    Get over yourselves, if you are a casual player then youll have access to casual gear. vanilla casual players managed just fine with what they had access to what makes you whiners any better? The ones who are paying the toll are us veterans who have played for 6+ years and watched the whining player base screw up a game that we loved. Sure, Blizzard has added alot of content, a few continents, Arenas, Dungeon finder, and achievements which do spice up the game a bit, bit it does nothing for us raiders and serious PVP players who want more challenging content, new battle grounds that arent a rehash of previous ones, and give us back our NPCs that got in the way.

    so what 900k or more players have left the game in last year or two, its a recession. Dont clump all of those who left the game due to financial reasons with the idiots that are whining over content being too hard or they cant get the best gear because theyre too lazy, busy, casual. And no i do not rate casual players with lazy ones it was just a short list. Whine all you like, but Blizzard has already said they are making content more challenging and I for one want them to do it. MoP has a few nice things in it, the PVE scenarios are a head turner for one.

    In closing I'll say this, yes players left, sure more will leave, but in the end WoW wont die, if that were possible then why are games like runescape and Everquest still around? I could list a whole lot of games that were released over the last 5 years that were labeled as WoW killers.. they all failed SW:ToR will be no different. I have already seen players in my guild come back from ToR claiming the end game content was non existent.. yep a WoW killer there. WoW set the standard for the newest mmo's and the game codenamed Titan is supposed to be the next great thing in MMo's. So for now lets enjoy whats left of cata, get ready to de/sell/trash the gear we are working for or have already gained and get ready for MoP. Theres only a few more expansions left. 2015 isnt that far away folks.

  18. #598
    Akumawraith: so, in the same message, you whine about how things should be, then tell us to get over ourselves. Hypocrit much?

    I'm also amused about the reference to 20 man raids. You playing Rift, by any chance?

    Anyway, enjoy the casual future. And, necro?!
    Last edited by Osmeric; 2012-02-03 at 03:08 AM.
    "There is a pervasive myth that making content hard will induce players to rise to the occasion. We find the opposite. " -- Ghostcrawler
    "Almost every time I have gotten to know a critic personally, they keep up with the criticism but lose the venom." -- Ghostcrawler
    I hate these casual Fridays ruining it for real Fridays.

  19. #599
    WoW is always losing subscribers but it won't matter because there are still enough subscribers for the game to stay strong

  20. #600
    Grunt Aadren's Avatar
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    At least they didn't lose as many subscribers as Eve did when that info about the Incarna expansion was leaked.

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