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  1. #21
    Warchief Byniri's Avatar
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    Let's compare 2 scenarios:
    -Player A has an ilvl of 346, and was 'carried' once through BWD, doing less than 10k the entire time. He died on every fight from avoidable damage.
    -Player B has an ilvl of 359, and killed every boss except Nef. He knows the fights inside and out, and has never died to stupid mistakes


    Going by the 'link achievement' stupidity, Player A would get an invite, and Player B would get turned down.

    Scenario 2:
    -Player A has done one run through of Bastion of Twilight, and is still learning all the fights.
    -Player B has BoT on farm, has 8+ Cho'gall kills, but the character with the achievement is on another server.

    Once again, Player A would get an invite, and Player B would get rejected. In fact, most 'must link achievement' pugs I see end up failing because of people who have only done 1 run or were carried before.
    Quote Originally Posted by Unknown User View Post
    Usually pug raids on my server goes something like this:

    PUGLeader: LFM BOT link achi and item lvl!
    RandomPlayer: Can I join? I have the achievement on my main.
    PUGLeader: Noob! No achi=no raid! I got achi long ago was so easy noob! Bye noob!
    *a while later when the raid has been filled and the final boss is downed*
    PUGLeader has earned the achievement [Lying about having the achievement]

    TL;DR People are asking for achievements because they don't have it themselves and wants to get carried to it.

    I actually had this happen during Wrath. I got into a ToC 'achievement only' run, and the RL was absolutely obsessed with having people who had the achievement. He was the only one who didn't link his achievement, and sure enough, after downing Anub'arak... (player) has earned the achievement [Trial of the Crusader]!

    I put this dude on ignore right after I got my loot.

  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Reganom View Post
    What about option c) Someone who hasn't seen BWD or BoT from the inside, has only started wanting to raid this expansion but has spent time watching strat guides, has read up on each boss, has spent time getting the best gear they can get, gemmed/reforged/enchanted correctly, has flasks and buff food.

    Or even option d) Someone who has kingslayer (among others) dated from when it was hard to get, had to sit out for the raids at the start because of other issues, knows their class inside out, knows boss mechanics, has everything they need to be a valued member.

    Don't forget about poor option e) Someone who has the achievement after being carried through, average gear, some enchants, doesn't pull their weight, doesn't give more than they have to.

    Edit:

    I recently asked to join a BWD pug, leader asked for achievement which i didn't have. So i said i've read all the tactics for BWD and know all the boss mechanics. He tested me by saying "council tactics" to which i assumed he meant omnitron (seeing as that is the council type fight in BWD), he responds with "OMG n00b! Thats omnitron n00b" so i quickly pointed out that the council he wanted tacts for was in a different raid and that why would someone test someone about the wrong raid.
    Sure, there are those other options like c) or d). I had the pleasure to raid with some and they ended up failing less then people who already had the achievement. But those persons are rare. It's just easier to choose someone who has proof that they already killed the boss and hope that they weren't carried.

    It also depends what you are looking for. T11 nhc post-nerf are easy enough that even people who never have never seen BWD / BoT from inside before might be able to complete them, but a guild group searching 1 person for T12 HC content might have other requirements.

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Loop View Post
    Have you tried to tell the pug leader some of the tactics for some of the bosses?
    Always work for me.

    There was ICC10 run for Bane of the Fallen king, and i wanted to join with my alt,
    i told him about shadowtraps, about defile, about frostmourne room, and i've got an inv.
    So just try that next time,
    or you can always get Underachiever, and link fake achv's like everyone else and get a spot.

    So? That clearly happenned at cata and he is speaking about current content.


    On Topic: I wouldnt even bother join a pug if the leader himself ask for things he doesnt even have.

  4. #24
    Achievements =/= Knowing the fight, people get carried ALL THE TIME to their achieves.

    Asking for the achievement is worthless, most likely someone who is MUCH MORE than willing to link it very quickly, is overly excited about having it and thinks they are now pro in that content.

    My solution, when I am on an alt, is to ask for an invite and when they ask for iLvl/achieve I simply say: "You first. Let me see your achieve, and have a look at your gear so I know we are on exactly the same level or you are better off if you are going to be leading this."

    ONE time I have been invited after asking that, and almost none of the ones I wasn't invited to succeeded because the RL was looking for a fat carry, usually to gear their alt, and therefore couldn't explain the fights or mechanics.
    Quote Originally Posted by Komie View Post
    They still say Cata needs a lot of work, and this expansion (edit for reference: MoP) is in the final stages.
    Quoted for... truth? on 11/30/2011.

  5. #25
    Warchief Shawaam's Avatar
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    All I can see is "I hate it because I didn't get in". For me, linking such achievment is obvious. Why would ANYONE want to explain tactics over and over again each week? People really expect to get into raids and being told what to do and everything.
    Vol'jin fanboy

  6. #26
    Stood in the Fire Deschim's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shawaam View Post
    All I can see is "I hate it because I didn't get in". For me, linking such achievment is obvious. Why would ANYONE want to explain tactics over and over again each week? People really expect to get into raids and being told what to do and everything.
    i have done BoT BWD ToTFW on my Priest as dps several times.
    when im on my rogue (dps) who wouldnt have achiefs it means i know nothing?

    makes sense

    Armory
    *If you want to criticize my english, Atleast post something usefull on the topic to*

  7. #27
    Warchief Shawaam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deschim View Post
    i have done BoT BWD ToTFW on my Priest as dps several times.
    when im on my rogue (dps) who wouldnt have achiefs it means i know nothing?

    makes sense
    Log your main and link the achievments then. It's that easy.
    Vol'jin fanboy

  8. #28
    Banned Frenikk's Avatar
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    Put yourself in a pug leaders shoes, which one of these people that you've never played with before and have no idea of their skill would you choose?

    Person1: Hi, (achievement link) im a prot paladin and would like to join your group

    Person2: Hi, im a prot paladin and would like to join your group, i've never done it before but i watched a video so please please please invite me

  9. #29
    Basically, confidence is your key.

    I was a very confident player. I was not affiliated with my main guild on my alts. I spoke to the leaders with confidence, how I could help and why. What my previous or current knowledge is, Plus an obligatory " I do nat has downs "

    I honestly didn't read much of what you wrote because it seemed to be an " can't get in, no cheeves " situation. so tl;dr

    goodluck in the future,
    I was a Death's Demise.
    F all you hand out baby snatchers.

  10. #30
    Warchief Vayjir's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shawaam View Post
    Log your main and link the achievments then. It's that easy.
    what if your main is on a diffrent server?
    DA(>^-^)>Dont Click on this. <(^-^<) Steamz Sig&Ava By Elyssia

  11. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by DMac84 View Post
    I am in a guild with friends. You know, thats why we play this game. To play with friends and stuff.

    But you know, there are times when we can raid this week because people are gone or working, no one wants to raid because their gear sucks.

    So sometimes you have to PUG... and it should be more inviting. Im not saying PUG with all noobs, we all see how the random heroics go. But at least look at past achievements of other raids and stuff you have done. Chances are if you completed, Naxx, Uludar, ICC, BOT, BWD... you can handle FL without showing you have already downed the bosses there.
    First, checking the loong list of achievements is hard work.
    Second, all older raids mean anything only if you've completed them when they were in their prime, notin a nerfed state.

  12. #32
    Typical scenarios that happen everyday on my server-

    [2]Randomtool: LFM BH - need 1 tank GTG
    'me' /w Prot Pally
    'Randomtool' /w ilvl
    'me' over 9000

    no more responses.

    [2]Randomtool: LFM BH - need 1 tank GTG
    'me' /w Feral/Resto druid
    'Randomtool' /w ilvl
    'me' Feral 349/Resto 365
    'Randomtool' /w too low

    [2]Randomtool: LFM BH - need 1 tank GTG
    'me' /w Prot Pally
    'Randomtool' /w ilvl
    'me' 385 << (lieing)
    Randomtool has invited you to a group

    ilvls mean shit all these days - the majority of active players on my server are 360 ilvl + and struggle to do more than 10K dps.

  13. #33
    I really hate the link achievement thing. I've cleared 13/13 heroics t11 and 2/7 heroic t12 on my main, but no one gives a flying fuck when I'm on my single horde alt on blackrock trying to get into pugs. I've had maybe 2 groups take my word on it, or would armory my hunter and send me an invite, but almost every other time I get ignored. I decided to grab one of the achievement fakers because technically, I'm not lying about anything, its practically just a way for me to link my achievements across servers. Still today when I was trying to get in a firelands pug, linked the fake achievement, the guy armory me and says he reported me and I'm going to be banned for using an achievement faker and didn't care when I said I had 2/7 heroics cleared.

    It's just annoying people are so ignorant. Especially when I finally get in a raid and end up top dps and explaining the fight in detail to the rest of the group >.<

  14. #34
    Warchief Shawaam's Avatar
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    If you can't fucking prove it, why should they take you? I rather take someone who can prove they know the fights rather than someone who say they know the fights. People are liars, egoistic and selfish. Why should they bother trusting some random stranger without proof?

    So, with the logic many people here uses, I will do this:

    Hi, I'm a professor. I just discovered that you can use uranium to ressurect humans! I have don't have any proof at all, but it's really true.

    So, you guys telling us that you can claim that you know the raids just by saying it without proof, you have to agree with me or you are hypocritical morons.
    Vol'jin fanboy

  15. #35
    I usually make raids and ask for raid experience, or uncompleted achievements. Ilvl too, wtf? You need 333 average to do all the first tier raids in cata atm.

  16. #36
    Brewmaster
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    Asking for achievements is an easy way to get rid of a part of the noob players.
    I always ask for an achievement.
    If you think you are pro, and can convince me you are, you can still get an invite.
    Just whisper those guys inviting next time with the tactics of the last boss and show em why they should inv you.

    People really should stop thinking they deserve an inv too.
    You only deserve something if you actually do something to deserve it.

  17. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by butterzz View Post
    achivements should be accountbound, makes stuff way easier so you dont get to deal with all the herpderps on your alts.
    so what your saying is you get your achievement lets say on your healer right, then lets say you use this account bound achieve on your tank. now your on your tank linking your healers achieve but have never really tanked the raid is that fair to the 9/24 other ppl when you fail cause you havent tanked it before
    I QQ at QQers who QQ about people QQing

  18. #38
    Gear(Player) Score imo.

  19. #39
    People ask for achievements because its a retard check. Any retard without achievement will not waste time by whispering. Those who are skilled and experienced enough and have the dedication / interest to do it will simply whisper something to them to let them know that they know the fights.

    The raid leaders that don't invite you even afterwards are probably not worth grouping with anyway.

  20. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by reauxmont View Post
    It's not nonsense. It's simple: be there when new content is released and no one will ask you for achievements, because nobody has any.

    Imagine the following: You were there when T11 started, you worked your way up, starting in 346 gear, spent hours and hours wiping on normal modes when you finally reach, lets say, 12/12 NHC.

    Now, your guild tells you to stay out for this ID, and ofc you still want to complete it. You want to pug it and are able to choose from:

    a) Someone who has never seen BWD or BoT from inside, that has barely read a guide and saw the first 2 minutes of a Video.

    b) Someone who has done all those fights. People who worked their way up the ladder just like you, who wiped hours and know the fight and its mechanics 110%.

    Who would you choose?
    That is a biased option. Might just aswell say

    A) Someone who youtubed the fight, knows tacts but has not killed the boss
    B) Someone who got carried and still dies in fire.

    See what I did there?
    A wise man speaks because he has something to say; a fool because he has to say something.
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