1. #5801
    Quote Originally Posted by Airlick View Post
    Don't tease me.
    What? It's up to you to choose to believe the magic 8 ball or not :/

  2. #5802
    Quote Originally Posted by Pejo View Post
    I don't believe you will see that in this game - the developers want the characters to have a distinctive silhouette. You will most likely see sliders for face (most likely all of it) but not beyond that.
    Well that sucks. Guess I will be Granok after all.

    I'm not so keen on a lot of characters looking the same. Armor does little to differ characters.

    I mean look at WoW. Before transmog a lot of characters looked the same. Transmog helped a little, but a lot of characters still look the same.

  3. #5803
    I am Murloc! SirRobin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Airlick View Post
    Don't tease me.
    Well until they are revealed, there are no guarantees, but there are places where you can take a peak.
    Sir Robin, the Not-Quite-So-Brave-As-Sir-Lancelot.
    Who had nearly fought the Dragon of Angnor.
    Who had almost stood up to the vicious Chicken of Bristol.
    And who had personally wet himself, at the Battle of Badon Hill.

  4. #5804
    Quote Originally Posted by SirRobin View Post
    Well until they are revealed, there are no guarantees, but there are places where you can take a peak.
    If what on reddit is true, I really hope they didn't invite a pretty bad PvE guild to test PvP. /facepalm

  5. #5805
    Quote Originally Posted by SirRobin View Post
    Well until they are revealed, there are no guarantees, but there are places where you can take a peak.
    No Aurin Medic! *sniff*
    /despair

  6. #5806
    I am Murloc! SirRobin's Avatar
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    So... Who else thinks this W*W will be only about announcing the Pay it Forward winners?
    Sir Robin, the Not-Quite-So-Brave-As-Sir-Lancelot.
    Who had nearly fought the Dragon of Angnor.
    Who had almost stood up to the vicious Chicken of Bristol.
    And who had personally wet himself, at the Battle of Badon Hill.

  7. #5807
    Quote Originally Posted by Airlick View Post
    No Aurin Medic! *sniff*
    /despair
    I wouldn't believe the datamined website. It doesn't list granok as engineer but it's confirmed that they can be.

  8. #5808
    Quote Originally Posted by zito View Post
    I wouldn't believe the datamined website. It doesn't list granok as engineer but it's confirmed that they can be.
    Actually it does list Granok as engineers and medics. Maybe we were looking at different lists?

  9. #5809
    I am Murloc! SirRobin's Avatar
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    Doesn't mean its final either. Just what they've got listed in that build.
    Sir Robin, the Not-Quite-So-Brave-As-Sir-Lancelot.
    Who had nearly fought the Dragon of Angnor.
    Who had almost stood up to the vicious Chicken of Bristol.
    And who had personally wet himself, at the Battle of Badon Hill.

  10. #5810
    Banned Kelimbror's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SirRobin View Post
    Doesn't mean its final either. Just what they've got listed in that build.
    Which is the complete opposite of confirmed. Especially with NDAs.

  11. #5811
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kittyvicious View Post
    Which is the complete opposite of confirmed. Especially with NDAs.
    Absolutely, its not unusual at all for out of date stuff to be in builds, especially beta builds. I still remember all the stuff from the first Shogun Total War that was left in the gold Medieval total War build.
    Sir Robin, the Not-Quite-So-Brave-As-Sir-Lancelot.
    Who had nearly fought the Dragon of Angnor.
    Who had almost stood up to the vicious Chicken of Bristol.
    And who had personally wet himself, at the Battle of Badon Hill.

  12. #5812
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    Quote Originally Posted by SirRobin View Post
    Absolutely, its not unusual at all for out of date stuff to be in builds, especially beta builds. I still remember all the stuff from the first Shogun Total War that was left in the gold Medieval total War build.
    I was just reading through an oldschool 'What you didn't know about...' thread about Vanilla WoW. I always forget how completely different the game was in alpha, then beta, then release. Like...mind bogglingly different. Pretty much every game with iterative design (read: almost every MMO ever) does this.

    It's honestly at least 50% of the reason they have NDAs in the first place.

  13. #5813
    I am Murloc! SirRobin's Avatar
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    I'm still ticked over them bailing on the original honor system in WoW. It was even in the manual.

    Yet, I just can't really get behind NDA's anymore. Yes its the dev's choice to make, but someone looking for an excuse to complain? Is going to find one. Whether what they are complaining about is a WIP or not. Plus, with so much money spent making these games nowadays? It gives devs an even bigger excuse to "exaggerate," or outright lie. I'm looking at you War Z, ACM, and SC5. Anything to prop up those preorders and first week of sales.

    NDA's, remember Vanguard, can too easily become a tool to hide just how bad and incomplete their supposedly finished product may actually be. When you consider how much money some people end up spending on these games? Collector's Editions, upgrading their PC's hardware, cash shops, and DLC's? NDA's just don't have a whole lot of inherent credibility left, in my humble opinion.
    Sir Robin, the Not-Quite-So-Brave-As-Sir-Lancelot.
    Who had nearly fought the Dragon of Angnor.
    Who had almost stood up to the vicious Chicken of Bristol.
    And who had personally wet himself, at the Battle of Badon Hill.

  14. #5814
    Quote Originally Posted by SirRobin View Post
    NDA's, remember Vanguard, can too easily become a tool to hide just how bad and incomplete their supposedly finished product may actually be.
    Eh, Vanguard is a special kind of fucked up because Brad McQuaid can't run a damn studio (STILL BREAKING MY HEART)

    Honestly, if early (and I mean actual early) betas/late alpha's weren't NDA'd, people would flip their shit at the games. Having played through many of them at this stage, I know if the majority of the "average joe" gamers on the net would go banana's shit talking a game in alpha or early beta for its terrible performance, unfinished visuals, rough UI and menu system, clunky combat, etc. etc.

    I'm not the biggest fan of NDA's, but they definitely serve a good purpose when used appropriately.

  15. #5815
    Banned Kelimbror's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by edgecrusher View Post
    Eh, Vanguard is a special kind of fucked up because Brad McQuaid can't run a damn studio (STILL BREAKING MY HEART)

    Honestly, if early (and I mean actual early) betas/late alpha's weren't NDA'd, people would flip their shit at the games. Having played through many of them at this stage, I know if the majority of the "average joe" gamers on the net would go banana's shit talking a game in alpha or early beta for its terrible performance, unfinished visuals, rough UI and menu system, clunky combat, etc. etc.

    I'm not the biggest fan of NDA's, but they definitely serve a good purpose when used appropriately.
    Yep. The negatives would vastly outweigh the positives. A game without an NDA that goes through iterative design phases like this one would be eaten alive in minutes and would provoke people to literally campaign against their existence, killing off half the potential playerbase before it has even been completed.

    Not to mention the effect it would have on developer morale to work for so many years just to have your game trashed before you're even finished making it. Kinda like someone look at you do anything that you've only worked on for 5 minutes and telling you it sucks and you should never do that activity again. Only multiply 'someone' by hundreds of thousands.

    The internet is not an intelligent or kind place. I'd prefer games be developed in the sanctity of the studio. Not enough companies pull messed up stunts like EA or the few examples you mentioned to warrant ruining pretty much every game ever made going forward.

  16. #5816
    I am Murloc! SirRobin's Avatar
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    I don't think dropping their NDA worked out badly for Firefall. And anyone whose morale is that vulnerable? Should probably not be trying to make computer games in the first place. With some devs already publicly selling Beta and even Alpha access? It would seem to me that they have survived, no matter how unintelligent a place you believe the internet to be. So it would appear that the NDA-less path is a viable one.
    Sir Robin, the Not-Quite-So-Brave-As-Sir-Lancelot.
    Who had nearly fought the Dragon of Angnor.
    Who had almost stood up to the vicious Chicken of Bristol.
    And who had personally wet himself, at the Battle of Badon Hill.

  17. #5817
    Banned Kelimbror's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SirRobin View Post
    I don't think dropping their NDA worked out badly for Firefall. And anyone whose morale is that vulnerable? Should probably not be trying to make computer games in the first place. With some devs already publicly selling Beta and even Alpha access? It would seem to me that they have survived, no matter how unintelligent a place you believe the internet to be. So it would appear that the NDA-less path is a viable one.
    The crux of my argument wasn't simply that people's feelings would be hurt. That was just flavor writing. Obviously the damage to the actual playerbase is the bottom line of the argument as it would affect the literal bottom line.

    And FireFall dropped an NDA to have an invite only 'open' closed beta...where they made money from in game sales. So let's not talk about a soft launch where they are trying to generate revenue as anything remotely close to a game still going through iterative design and expecting to earn the bucks when they actually release. Definitely not the same situation.

    If Wildstar launched an early form of the game where they were taking payments, I guarantee the NDA would drop as well. Magic 8 ball seems to think that this isn't going to happen in this game.

  18. #5818
    Magic 8 ball seems to think that this isn't going to happen in this game.
    !

    How do you know of magic 8 ball

  19. #5819
    Quote Originally Posted by SirRobin View Post
    I don't think dropping their NDA worked out badly for Firefall. And anyone whose morale is that vulnerable? Should probably not be trying to make computer games in the first place. With some devs already publicly selling Beta and even Alpha access? It would seem to me that they have survived, no matter how unintelligent a place you believe the internet to be. So it would appear that the NDA-less path is a viable one.
    Eh... Firefall is a mixed bag. Plus it's a shooter not an rpg which affects things right there. And there has been a ton of bad things said about it since the NDA was lifted as well. They are actually walking a pretty hard path right now.

  20. #5820
    Banned Kelimbror's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by zito View Post
    How do you know of magic 8 ball
    I keep one handy for all of life's important questions. When asked about this specific question it relpied "Highly unlikely".

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Arlee View Post
    And there has been a ton of bad things said about it since the NDA was lifted as well. They are actually walking a pretty hard path right now.
    This is true actually. Though it has had a positive effect on their company specifically since they are so open with anyone communicating with them. Without it, maybe we wouldn't have seen so much good content get added. However, a lot of people bailed from the game when it was in the early stages from hearing that it had nothing going on but thump, thump, thump, thump.

    A lot of those people won't give products a second chance. It's true what they say about first impressions, especially in the video game market as most people (read: not MMO-C posters) will only give it that much time to make a decision.

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