Should raid sizes become 15 man?

[Smigel]

I would like to believe that if they went to 15 man only, it would give them more time to focus on the content and mechanics and coming up with new ideas instead of having to spend so much time on the balance of 10 and 25 man. It's nice that you can have a choice between 10 and 25 right now, but if you aren't in a 25 man guild you're basically never seeing 25 man content. 15 would be an ideal size. It might not feel like a "raid" but then again 10 mans don't currently feel like that now anyway.

If Blizzard wants to be able to put more creative effort in to the encounters at the cost of 2 different raid sizes I'm all for it.

[Myrkur]

Pass the popcorn, manni is force-feeding random scrub #74195 (with poor English skills) some pwn cake.


I'd think about resubbing if they went back to the 25-man raids and 10-man raids being separate entities. I don't want to bash my head against the wall with 24 of my guildies on content for weeks and weeks only to have complete and utter morons sporting the same gear/achievement/whatever as me.

10 mans are a joke, and everyone knows it. Let the Kara-Tards be bad, and let the players with half a brain that thrive on playing their characters to the fullest see the real raid content.

This is an MMO, people...10 players is NOT massive.

So you unsubbed because 10 man "Kara-Tards" and "utter morons" have the same gear as you [could have because you don't raid anymore]? Do you also hate the fact that people who have never even stepped foot into a Raid before can be wearing the same Neck, Chest, Bracers, Gloves, Pants, Ring and Relic/Range as you? How do you not suffocate under the weight of your own self-entitlement?

I would welcome 15 man raids. I think that would solve a lot of the issues I've had this expansion with 10 man raiding. I try to run a very small roster since my raid only runs 9 hours a week. I try to balance the group through available buffs and Tier Token representation. That means when my Hunter is not longer able to play, I feel obligated to replace him with another Hunter to keep the same buff and Tier Token Representation. Shaman are under-powered and a Warlock would put 5 people on the same token, both are undesireable. With 15 man raids I think it would be easier to be able to rotate people in and still maintain strong progress.

I was going to argue for a single Raid size no matter what they do. But then I realized that it doesn't really matter to me. I am going to Raid with the smallest group possible because I play with 7 IRL friends. And I don't care about the "25 man is the only thing that counts" debate nor that "[Insert group setting] is more difficult than [the other setting]".

I do think they should scrap the "Heroic" level gear. Make Heroics strictly for Achievements, Titles and Notoriety except for a special "Heroic Only" boss who would drop higher iLvL stuff like Sinestra/Algalon. Make the last 3 Normal Mode Bosses harder, taking the average guild upwards of 60 attempts to kill. Gives the Hardcore players what they really care about, Fame on their server through Titles, wowprogress standing, and that BiS weapon from the Heroic only boss. Gives the Semi-hardcore something extra to try without making them feel like they are falling behind the power curve when they hit walls. Gives the Casuals somethign to shoot for in that the End Boss normal modes are highly challenging.

I think that would do a lot for guilds like mine, who are between 2/7H and 6/7H who feel pressured to kill the Heroic Mode bosses for those extra iLvLs of gear. If that "Heroic" tag was not on the gear, then I would not be stressing over the Heroic modes. They would be what I think Blizzard intended to be, for extra difficulty/fun. But as it is, I feel obligated to do Heroic Mode content for the gear and not for the Fun of it. That obligation feeling takes the fun out of working on Heroic Modes for me, and I'm sure a lot of other people feel this way also.

[Vasti]

I want to solo current endgame content!!! Gief 1 man raids!
/rage

[Deleted]

Players in raid / 5 = number of non-tier token drops
Players in raid / Max possible players in raid * Boss health and damage at max raid size

There, wrote it for you.

OT: There should be a way to have as many people as you want in a raid, with boss damage and healing scaling based on multiples of 5:
Would include 10, 15, 20, 25, 30, 35, 40 man raids. That would make people happy wherever they wanna go, and imagine 40 man raids coming back again! Would be interesting to see DW40

interesting so a 40 man raid boss would be hitting for 4x the ammount a 10 man would...

to not 1 shot a tank thats <200k at 40, scaled down that means boss hits would only do <50k at 10.

you would ahve to put in a "cap" to boss damg on certain things when above a certain member size.
people would eventualy work out these "caps" and plan raid sizes around them.
same for loot if it's one per 5,
why take 19 people for a harder fight when i can take 15 and get the same ammount of loot and an easier fight -> encourages people to be put on standby instead of being taken which is what the scaling was meant to do.
at what threshold does an aditional add spawn?
at what threshold does the debuf the boss applies mean it needs a tank swap?
at what threshold does the boss become tankable by a dps ( 3 maning?)
at what threshold can you get away with 1 less healer
at what threshold does the "nuke boss ignore ads" as his hp is to low tactic become viable.

i could go on.

[Llamaeggs]

I like the idea of 15 man raids. Did both sizes in Wrath and mostly 10s in Cata. I've enjoyed the smaller group setting, but at times certain mechanics don't translate well between 25 and 10 man encounters. I think 15s would give the devs room to play with more mechanics withou getting lost in the anonymity of 25s.