Random battlegrounds and general stupidity.

[fewagainstmany]

I'm not trying to troll. I'm simply looking for some outside perspective here.

It being WSG weekend and me leveling my mage from 80-85, I figured I would do some battlegrounds instead of the typical quest grind all over again.

It's good experience when you win so it seems like a good idea, right? Nope...

Just tonight I stubbornly did 28 matches in Warsong Gulch and my team only won 2. Neither of those wins were 3 caps, they were last cap - drawn out the entire 25 minute matches. This is really annoying to me, because I'm marginally above average. I've been 2600 in 3v3 arena several times and have the same rating in RBG on two different toons, this isn't about me though.

What I can't figure out is how unmistakably STUPID people can be in battlegrounds... it's not just every few players that are exceptionally terrible, it's almost every single one... this boggles my mind. I just can't wrap my head around this. I've seen players just stand there and get killed, doing nothing. They aren't bots either, I get into debates with them about their play. I try not to be a dick... but being stern is my last resort. To me it's like... why join if you don't play to win? I would expect terrible play in the low level brackets, but not 80-84. It just makes no sense. I'm not going to deny me being an asshole, but put yourself in my shoes, you know? Almost every match I'm either running the flag or trying to return ours. I will sit there in the enemy base WAITING for some help to come, sometimes for ten minutes, but it never does. I'll say in bg chat "hey, i can't kill 5 people by myself. i need help" and get no responses. The worst matches are the ones where nobody says a single word and we lose 0-3. It's like all of them have accepted defeat before the match even started. "alliance sucks why bother" - this kind of mentality drives me mad. It's why I hate playing the alliance.

So after eight long hours of getting frustrated I finally gave up. I /afk'd out and now I'm sitting in a dungeon queue while typing this. Rage essay? I'd say so... but don't dwell on that. I want your thoughts on why or how people are so awful in battlegrounds, and what you think could be done to improve this. Yes I'm frustrated. I gave 110% every match and it showed. I was always at or near the top. The only times I died was when I would attempt to go 1v3-5 and get our flag back for the win. I care about winning, it's what's fun for me... I just wish more people gave as much of a damn as I do, maybe then I wouldn't get so freaking frustrated seeing people with absolutely no clue how to play their class, or no desire to win.

/end rant, I guess

[Sesshomaru]

I've seen people only go in PvP action, not caring about the Flag or healing.

Still, you can't call people who like doing such for dumb.
Some people like to squeeze out the rest of the bottle, but you are not required to do so.

[Azaile-]

Some people do bg's literally to run around get kills, unfortunately its a pug and they are free to do as they please. Sometimes you get great games where everyone wants to play to win, and sometimes you get games where you could run that flag up and down the field alone and noone could care less, they might even tell you not to cap so they can farm.

Pugs: working as intended.

[Koen]

I am in no way trying to defend these players who are terrible and doing nothing, in fact I made similar posts as you but something struck to me when I was gearing up my latest toon. Perhaps the reason is, why so many people are terrible, that they recently started gearing up their character and have to go through the hassle of farming honor in shit gear while getting owned by the decent geared players. It's just absolutely awful having to go through this process and whereas you might be able to keep trying the first 5 games after a while it gets so boring that you give up and just ' leach' honor until you have decent gear.
This is not so much the players' fault I think, more so a design flaw from Blizzard's part.

In fact, I haven't really seen a lot of bad people whom were geared. Most of them are just under geared and probably trying to get some gear. Still, most people in BGs are indeed awful, you are right about that.

[bigjenk]

Carry harder...

Really if you want to level quick on a bg weekend just get a few friends to do so especially if you are all geared for your bracket and rack up 90%plus winrates if you are good. Played with some friends on a wsg free week a while ago and we literally won every game for about 8 hours straight and almost all 3 caps.

[Ganza]

its not only on low bracketts, its all over the place, its not just on alliance either, got 10 tons at 85 and its all about luck at high end when you queue and when it pops up to get in, as soon as loading ends and u get on wsg and you already enter a losing wsg, or you start to watch ppls gear and you imidiatly say "damn to many crap out gear, we lost this" and this i experienced both sides alliance and horde, on 80-84 well you may have like a small portion of players playing on that particular lvl's so you probably can always get same crap players for 5 games in a row, i always rant that the players that dont give a rats ass in random bgs are rift players coming to wow to ruin game to real wow players =P some times this rant is worst then calling ppl noobs and they step a little up to show some real care, but doesnt work all the time =P

[Deleted]

Joining with one or two friends helps so much. Maybe some friends have alts at the same lvl as your alt, or you notice some good players from your realm in battlegrounds and you could ask them to join as a group. If the opposing team is shit as well, then a group of 2-3 players can run a lot of flags.

[-Zait-]

Random BG's can easily be compared to a bunch of monkeys running around with machine guns.

Why would you be in a place with a bunch of monkeys with machine guns? You should group up with friends (: Even having 1 friend with you can make it more bearable imho

[Aliessil]

I've just got my rogue levelled up to 85 and am now working on getting his S10 gear. However I also levelled a lot in battlegrounds so when I hit 85 I had 4k honor (weapon and thrown) and 6 pieces of the crafted set. The moment I dinged I was over 2k resilience, which is enough to be noticeable. It really wasn't hard to do!

Another thing I noticed (in my battlegroup at least) was that Alliance could hold their own quite happily until the end of the 80-84 bracket, then fall to pieces in the 85 one. We seem particularly bad at WSG, AB, TP, BfG, but do better at the large ones - AV, SOTA, IoC. Curious whether this is similar in other battlegroups ...

Anyway, the point is if you're planning to enter lvl 85 battlegrounds, do yourself and everyone else a favour and get the crafted gear. It's not hard to make, it's relatively cheap and you can do just fine in HCs with it too (certainly you can meet the minimum DPS requirements).

[bigjenk]

its not only on low bracketts, its all over the place, its not just on alliance either, got 10 tons at 85 and its all about luck at high end when you queue and when it pops up to get in, as soon as loading ends and u get on wsg and you already enter a losing wsg, or you start to watch ppls gear and you imidiatly say "damn to many crap out gear, we lost this" and this i experienced both sides alliance and horde, on 80-84 well you may have like a small portion of players playing on that particular lvl's so you probably can always get same crap players for 5 games in a row, i always rant that the players that dont give a rats ass in random bgs are rift players coming to wow to ruin game to real wow players =P some times this rant is worst then calling ppl noobs and they step a little up to show some real care, but doesnt work all the time =P

At 85 its because half the bg is bots.

[Deleted]

I am in no way trying to defend these players who are terrible and doing nothing, in fact I made similar posts as you but something struck to me when I was gearing up my latest toon. Perhaps the reason is, why so many people are terrible, that they recently started gearing up their character and have to go through the hassle of farming honor in shit gear while getting owned by the decent geared players. It's just absolutely awful having to go through this process and whereas you might be able to keep trying the first 5 games after a while it gets so boring that you give up and just ' leach' honor until you have decent gear.

Hmm. I always rationaled it differently. If my gear is shit, why would i get into the big fights? If my gear is shit, shouldnt i try even harder to mean something to the team and focus on flags and bases instead of my futile attempts to kill a 5k resil healer?

[reverendball]

its alliance pvp sir, you have to win the BG solo, or not at all.

and believe me its doable, on any class

[fewagainstmany]

I also get lost in my own pessimism. One of the matches we did manage to win was one of the most memorable and epic matches I've ever had. It trumps most of the rated BGs I've been in by far. It was down to 3 minutes and we were down one cap. The enemy flag carrier was a very geared lvl84 prot warrior with his group of healers(2 hpals and a dpriest). We lost every match against them until this one. Me, a rogue, and a resto druid charged in with 10 stacks. I poly'd and counterspelled his hpal and dpriest while my rogue sapped into blind the other pally. I got off one good shatter and blew that warrior up and returned the flag with under a minute left. We got the last cap and won. It was truly epic and I need to focus on matches like that over all the losses... but I guess as a person we focus on our fails more than our victories.

[reverendball]

see?

dont give up! as your username says, few CAN triumph against many
and carrying a team of herpderps IS possible, its just a very difficult task resulting in a rather rare event.

[Foxroth]

First I want to say, I know your pain very well.

I've really stopped playing WSG, Twin Peaks cause they are usually very...
Full of people who run circles in the middle. >_> Which does make me frusterated.

I play wow almost only for the sake of pvp. (I do very little pve)
And I only enjoy big Bg's where there are lots of people, AV for example, it's still my favourite bg on alliance.

But when I see WSG on the Call to arms. I just que to random bg, and hope for the best.

[Metalzadeh]

Have you ever heard about bots ? :P

[Deleted]

I try not to play too many games in a row. The more games you play the biggger the chance is you'll get frustrated at one point. A few possible reasons:

* Too many bots on your team match after match
* No healers on your team.
* Getting killed by the worst DK you've ever seen because he gets healed by a holy paladin and a disc-priest and I'm the only one on my team to go after the healer.
* People not contributing to the game at all. Like in EotS 4-5 people fighting midfield somewhere between two towers.
* Battle of Gilneas start: 6 of your teammembers roflstomping one horde somewhere between mines and waterworks.. Loosing both the advantage in offense on WW and defense on LH.
* Holding 2 bases in Arathi Basin and people keep going BS and dying there over and over again without changing tactic whatsoever. Go GM or farm already!
* 9 people defending your flag in WSG while the score is 2-0 in favor of the opposing team.

Could write down way more. The most frustrating about above reasons is that there is nothing you can do about it. You just have to cope with it or get out. I've /afk'ed out plenty of times to do some dailies or take a short break

[fewagainstmany]

I know about bots but I don't know their limitations.

Some bots are pretty convincing, while others aren't.

[6kle]

I used to get more frustrated by this behaviour in pugs. My guess would be that on average only about 2 out of 10 players care a lot about winning in pug BG's. Most of the players seem to try score kills first and battleground objectives come second. I often find myself spending at least half my time sitting alone at some flag in AB because there is normally a high need for that, it's boring but needs to be done to win it. What's even more frustrating is being the only one who tries to kill enemy flag carrier if he has more than one player helping.

Usually when it's hopeless it's better to admit that you won't win this and try have fun in other ways. I won't try to kill a flag carrier alone forever if I get no help, it's better to just go get some kills or have a bit of fun in some other way untill the bad BG is over. Half the players in the pug BG's don't make a lot difference anyway. The players with bad gear are not very helpful in attacks/defending even if they try to do the right thing so it makes little difference where they are running around.

[Deleted]

I'm not trying to troll. I'm simply looking for some outside perspective here.

It being WSG weekend and me leveling my mage from 80-85, I figured I would do some battlegrounds instead of the typical quest grind all over again.

I've been 2600 in 3v3 arena several times and have the same rating in RBG on two different toons, this isn't about me though.

I'll say in bg chat "hey, i can't kill 5 people by myself. i need help" and get no responses. The worst matches are the ones where nobody says a single word and we lose 0-3. It's like all of them have accepted defeat before the match even started. "alliance sucks why bother" - this kind of mentality drives me mad. It's why I hate playing the alliance.

There is a fallacy in your misplaced rage. You are a mage, you can solo anyone, anywhere no matter their numbers.

Also, yes, I don't know why people in BG's usually aren't goal or teamplay oriented. When I do bg's for fun purely (not needing honor/cp for nothing) I still try to work for the team, but usually pursue a personal subgoal (like trying to kill the same person over and over again, I'm such a swell guy). But giving up before even trying? Can't say I have an answer.