1. #6881
    Herald of the Titans Cyrops's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Turin View Post
    I just blame it on Pan not having a powerful rival to reach super saiyan. Goku, Vegeta and Gohan had a big reason to reach it, while Goten and Trunks always fought to be the better of the 2. On the other hand, Pan was a sole fighter of her generation. She didn't have powerful enemies to overcome, nor did she have powerful friends to surpass. Anyway, that's just my take on it.
    Was there a manga on Pan? If her story wasn't told and if she is never shown to use SSJ doesn't that mean she could potentially be able to achieve SSJ?
    Also, are there any female SSJ's?
    PM me weird stuff :3

  2. #6882
    Banned GennGreymane's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by derpkitteh View Post
    certainly the most sexy dbz villain >.>


    i personally liked syn shenron, his voice was quite awesome. but i think frieza tops it above all, the not vocally butchered frieza from kai either. the original voiced frieza.

    No no Buu is the sexiest


  3. #6883
    love it, review twice.

  4. #6884
    Stood in the Fire Turin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zoma View Post
    Wasn't it "I can absorb every ki attack and grow stronger, but I can't defend from physical attacks while absorbing!"
    Yeah, it's possible that it was something like that, I don't really remember perfectly. It just came out of nothing. Super 17 was owning everything and all of a sudden he was defeated.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cyrops View Post
    Was there a manga on Pan? If her story wasn't told and if she is never shown to use SSJ doesn't that mean she could potentially be able to achieve SSJ?
    Also, are there any female SSJ's?
    Uhm, iirc only 4 year old Pan was shown at the very end of DBZ. But when I was talking about ssj Pan, I was talking about GT.
    As for whther there are any female ssj, as far as I'm aware, there isn't a canon one. Besides, I can think of only 3 female saiyans in total and only 1 of them was a fullblood and that one was from a movie. The other 2 being Bra and Pan and we only saw them as children.

  5. #6885
    Scarab Lord Skorpionss's Avatar
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    I remember reading on the old Cartoon Network site(I think), when they aired DBZ that Pan reached SSJ actually during the tournament at the end of DBZ... it was in her character biography... but yeah it was years ago... like more than 10 years xD but I'm 100% sure that's what it said... that's also why I was surprised she didn't turn once during DBGT... I was expecting her to go SSJ from the first fight....

  6. #6886
    Scarab Lord Master Guns's Avatar
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    Pan can't be a SSJ. Her blood is too diluted, and it never happens in the manga nor the anime. And Akira himself states that her saiyan blood is too diluted to go ssj.

    Check out the directors cut of my project SCHISM, a festival winning short film
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DiHNTS-vyHE

  7. #6887
    Bloodsail Admiral Rendia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Master Guns View Post
    Pan can't be a SSJ. Her blood is too diluted, and it never happens in the manga nor the anime. And Akira himself states that her saiyan blood is too diluted to go ssj.
    I counter with Goku Jr. and Vegeta Jr.

    They were 1/16th Saiyan, and they both went SSJ as children.

    Last edited by Rendia; 2013-10-05 at 03:23 PM.
    "There is no teacher but the enemy. No one but the enemy will tell you what the enemy is going to do. No one but the enemy will ever teach you how to destroy and conquer. Only the enemy shows you where you are weak. Only the enemy tells you where he is strong. And the rules of the game are what you can do to him and what you can stop him from doing to you." -Mazer Rackham - Ender's Game Orson Scott Card

  8. #6888
    Banned GennGreymane's Avatar
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    Its a shame they did turn the super saiyan into a childs play toy

    they should have went the route of empowering tien, krillin, piccolo, and yamcha instead

  9. #6889
    I really hated it when suddenly vegeta, gohan and co also became super saiyans...
    imo would have been much more epic if vegeta got an ancient saiyan power up
    for example instead turning into a giant ape, he would stay in his normal body size but would get the power from a giant ape and only growing some hair(sth like they did with ssj4)

  10. #6890
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    Quote Originally Posted by rarhyx View Post
    I really hated it when suddenly vegeta, gohan and co also became super saiyans...
    imo would have been much more epic if vegeta got an ancient saiyan power up
    for example instead turning into a giant ape, he would stay in his normal body size but would get the power from a giant ape and only growing some hair(sth like they did with ssj4)
    I liked everything about the SSJ except how they made the children SSJ as well. Everyone before the children SSJ had been pushed too their limits multiple times, even as far as close to getting killed.

  11. #6891
    yeah but since cell it was pretty much:
    "EVERYONE GO SUPER SAIYAN" who didn't was as useful as a trashcan

  12. #6892
    Fluffy Kitten Pendulous's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rarhyx View Post
    yeah but since cell it was pretty much:
    "EVERYONE GO SUPER SAIYAN" who didn't was as useful as a trashcan
    Remember when Piccolo was as strong as Cell? Man..those were some times.

  13. #6893
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    SSJ for Goten and Trunks is ok imo... they have pretty much perfect conditions... Saiyan/Human Hybrids are said to generally have more potential: Look where Gohan is when he is a Teenager (SSJ2 = a few billion PL) and then look where Goku and Vegeta were as Teenager (Goku at PL 300 or something like that, Vegeta maybe a few thousand). Gohan simply didn't keep the path of a Warrior and we don't know about Goten/Trunks as GT isnt canon and DBZ ends before they are Adults.
    Moreover they can train with some of the best Fighters in the universe... Vegeta, Gohan, Piccolo. AND as motiviation they have this rivalry between them (although they are friends).

    Of course it would have been cooler without kids... every SSJ would have his story:
    Goku while fighting a seemingly undefeatable villian who starts to kill his friends in front of him.
    Vegeta near death and full of anger that he is not "the" legendary SSJ.
    Future Trunks because his best Friend and nearly all of Mankind got killed by the Androids.
    Future Gohan because Piccolo and Krillin got killed by the Androids.

  14. #6894
    Quote Originally Posted by Pendulous View Post
    Remember when Piccolo was as strong as Cell? Man..those were some times.
    Or when he pwnd android 17 and after that he was pretty much only a spectator :/

  15. #6895
    Toriyama showed is from the beginning that Gohan had the potential to be more powerful than anyone (given his mood swings), and it was only a matter of time, especially once SSJ was revealed. I think the way they gave it to Gohan was acceptable, but (present) Trunks and Goten was kind of bullshit. Trunks shouldn't have gotten it until he saw Buu beating the crap out of Vegeta, Goten should have gotten it until something equally emotionally disturbing happened (losing Goku/Gohan/Chi Chi to Super Buu).

    It would have kept the whole theme they had for it with Goku's traing for Gohan ("The Super Saiyan transformation is a response to a need, not a desire."), and could have had the potential to keep it from becoming what we think of it now (pretty much summed up as Vegeta's "The Super Saiyan... Reduced to a child's mere plaything?! Preposterous!").

  16. #6896
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    Quote Originally Posted by Turin View Post
    I disagree that it should have ended there. It's true that it was a good place to end, but the continuation was incredibly well done, IMO. Mainly Vegeta. His character development is one of the best. In many manga/anime, a villain that turns good, simply has a sudden change of heart. This was not the case with Vegeta and that's why it was so awesome.
    His whole change was a process that lasted over 10 years and is now still continuing.
    First, he came from being a full blown evil being that destroyed whatever came in his path. The first change didn't actually come from his own will, but came of necessity. Due to circumstances, he was forced to side with the humans. But even then it wasn't like he was a good guy. Then, during the whole Cell mess, we see Vegeta care about someone other than himself for the very first time. During the whole saga, he was still acting as his bastard self, but when it truly came down to it, it was shown that he cared.
    And then lastly, during the Buu saga. A temporary return to his evil self, but it appears that even then, he is still in control of himself. It is shown that he cares about more than just fighting and himself. He now has a family after all. But the most amazing moment was Vegeta accepting that Goku had more talent. And for the very first time, he truly cheered for Goku.

    It is rare that an evil villain has a believable path to becoming a good guy, but Vegeta's story definitely managed it. While I still watch dragonball for Goku, I don't want to see the series end, simply because of Vegeta and his continuous progression. Even with the recent movie, we see that Vegeta is still changing.
    God, I love that guy ^^
    Ah shucks, you won me over. I actually concur with you on all points (as hinted at in my original post), but my divided opinion on where the story should have ultimately ended (all points considered, not just Vegeta's character arc) has unduly influenced my stance on his personal story as well; but I concede your points - his development was always my favourite part of the Z saga, and he is undoubtedly one of my all time favourite fictional characters, so yeah: screw it! He deserved the opportunity to evolve as he did, fair enough

    - - - Updated - - -

    Also, I'm wondering what people's opinions on Battle of the Gods is (only managed to get around to watching it the other day) ...
    Myself? I enjoyed it quite a bit - a fun nostalgic romp that kept true to the original series' characters & style imo. It's obvious to me that Toriyama has retained his heart & still has a lot of love for the story.
    I'm also curious as to what the movie's conclusion means for the franchise as a whole? Do you think this will beget a new series of anime and/or manga with Toriyama at the helm (or another block of movies perhaps)? I'm sort of curious, but also nervous about such a prospect - given how these sorts of belated, long-term re-visitations of fictional universes rarely pan out for the good *coughstarwarscough*
    Thoughts?

  17. #6897
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    Quote Originally Posted by UnifiedDivide View Post
    GT is non-canon so... they basically don't count.
    If GT is non-canon and doesn't count, then Pan not going SS in GT also doesn't count. The whole problem evens itself out. If we are to go by the information we have of Pan from DBZ then we hardly know anything about her, we don't know anything of her past the age of 5 (I think).

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Shadow-cleave View Post
    It would have kept the whole theme they had for it with Goku's traing for Gohan ("The Super Saiyan transformation is a response to a need, not a desire."),
    I don't think being able to keep up with your dad is a desire, but at that point it is a need. Basically if you aren't a SS you're useless like Krillin, so it is very much a need.

  18. #6898
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    I wish he would've appeared more in the series as he's my favorite character. A real shame.

  19. #6899
    Scarab Lord Master Guns's Avatar
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    Radittz is your favorite character lol? That's kind of odd lol.

    Check out the directors cut of my project SCHISM, a festival winning short film
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DiHNTS-vyHE

  20. #6900
    Banned GennGreymane's Avatar
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    but he is sooo sexy

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