Page 1 of 3
1
2
3
LastLast
  1. #1

    Going OOM as Discipline

    Im just getting into 5-man Heroics and im having mana issues when it comes to taking severe raid damage as Discipline. It seems like if the whole party gets under 50% health I have a hard time getting them back up to full health without going oom. This is an alt so I have a lot to learn but im not completely unschooled in the spec. The main healing spells im using are Power Word: Shield, Penance and Greater Heal. Any advice?

    Armoury link added: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...atmeh/advanced
    Last edited by Ultima; 2011-09-12 at 08:28 AM.

  2. #2
    if the party isn't in danger of taking huge amounts of damage again for a while their isn't an immediate need to top everyone off so just topping the tank up with penance+gheal is good here. Otherwise a quick emergency of Power Infusion + PoH x 2-3+ possibly under a power word:barrier to get everyone up is good too especially combined with Archangel if you're running an attonement build.

  3. #3
    When damage-to-party is low, Smite, and stack up Evangelism and then unleash Archangel. This is your method of emergency mana.

    Tank Healing. Your Main Healing/protective spells are Shield, Penance, Heal, Flash Heal and Greater Heal

    Party healing. Your main healing spells for party is Prayer of Healing (Wide spread damage), Renew, Shield, Greater Heal (After Shield)

    Party Damage intake is low/Tank Avoiding alot: Shield Tank, Smite.
    Smite - The mana cost is reduced when you have Evangelism, you get more damage = more heal, reduces the cooldown of your cheap hard heal (Penance) and helps with group damage. Longer fight = more damage = more healing. Make sure you take Divine Accuracy so you don't miss ;]


    Managing your healing is the best way to save mana. Observe and think on your feet. Your spells do not have to heal all the way to 100%. Overhealing is a waste of mana and GCD.

    If you are finding your mana to still be an issue, I suggest checking your spec and using Inner Will instead of Inner Fire (If applicable)
    Last edited by Isolyphic; 2011-09-11 at 10:23 AM.
    Packard Bell IPOWER X3.0
    CPU - Intel® Core™ i7 CPU 870 @ 2.95GHz (Oct-Core) (Factory Clock)
    Memory - 8GB DDR3
    Video - NVIDIA GeForce GT 330
    HDD - 2.5TB HDD (5xHDD)
    Mouse - Microsoft Gaming 7-Button Mouse
    Keyboard - Microsoft Multimedia Keyboard / Belkin n52te Gaming Keypad
    Monitor - 22 Inch 1920x1080 DVI / 22 Inch 1920x1080 VGA

  4. #4
    To be perfectly honest, disc isn't too great in 5 mans. Keep your eye open for opportunities to use PoM, try to keep rapture on cooldown, and use heal to save mana whenever you can. Don't shield people who aren't actively taking damage. Shield is a great spell, but it costs a lot of mana. Could you link your armory so we can give character specific advice as well?
    Almost every class at 90. Yaks of Wyrmrest Accord.

  5. #5
    Says I can't link anything with the number of posts I have. Name is Motorboatmeh on US-Skullcrusher. Im more running a tank healing build and not running the build using Smite. I wasn't sure if this is something I "need" to do or not. Also don't comment on enchants and such. Only enchanting blue Heroics and Epic gear. Just an alt.
    Last edited by Skullknight10; 2011-09-11 at 11:01 AM.

  6. #6
    Your gear is more than fine for HC-s, your talentpoints are well placed. Is your party dieing on trash or bosses? Are they moving out of the avoidable dmg sources, are they pulling aggro off the tank?
    If you have to AoE heal always do 1 PoH then ask yourself, will the party survive without another aoe for a few seconds? If yes, then let your PoH glyphed hots heal then when it is about to fade, cast a new PoH. Use pennance / greater heal as filler on low hp members. Oh and I would advise against Renew totally, it's a lot of mana and doesn't heal that much.

    Btw. I have tried to do some HC-s myself lately with a tank alt, and a lot of players are just plain dumb / don't know tacts and never ask for them / or even worse, they know tacts but ignore them, since "it's only a HC, not ZA!"... Oh asking for a CC is like to ask them to trade you their souls, etc. So, maybe your healing has no problem at all, but it's the party that's giving you too much unnecesary troubles. The bad thing is...that there is nothing you can do about your party being incompetent / ignorant. Ask for CCs and take the blame that it's you who cannot keep up with the heals (because they will blame you and not themselves for overaggroing or not moving). Eventually you will get enough gear to escape from the nightmare and hop in ZA/ZG. I found much easier to heal them.

  7. #7
    http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...atmeh/advanced

    There's the link for you. I recommend not reforging into crit, as you get plenty of crit bonuses from talents and the extra isn't going to help as much as haste or mastery would. Your staff is unenchanted, heartsong or power torrent both give great mana returns for disc. Power torrent is probably better. Your talents look fine.

    Try to pick up the Core of Ripeness asap, that's a huge mana gain over your current trinkets. Honestly at this point you're at the low end of the gear curve, just getting in there and getting the JP gear is going to do the most for you. You look like a competent player - and that's a compliment I don't hand out lightly.
    Almost every class at 90. Yaks of Wyrmrest Accord.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Terashi View Post
    [url]I recommend not reforging into crit, as you get plenty of crit bonuses from talents and the extra isn't going to help as much as haste or mastery would.
    Hi there! Crit means 200% heal for the same mana cost (+ a nice shield on the target). OP is doing regular HCs and has mana problems. I wouldn't dismiss crit right here and now under these circumstances.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Ceilingpony View Post
    Hi there! Crit means 200% heal for the same mana cost (+ a nice shield on the target). OP is doing regular HCs and has mana problems. I wouldn't dismiss crit right here and now under these circumstances.
    I'd still go for haste or mastery. More haste means more Heals (the Heal heal, the mana efficient one) and more mastery means more damage absorbed from the spells that do crit. You get 10% crit on weakened soul targets and an additional 25% chance each time you use Inner Focus (by the way, make sure you use IF every time it's available, free Greater Heals are tasty). YMMV, of course, but I think in the long run crit is just weak.

    Are you tracking your Rapture procs for mana regen? While you don't quite have enough mana to be mana positive while casting shield, triggering Rapture every time it's off cooldown will save you quite a bit. I know it made a huge difference for me when I was learning Disc. I use TellMeWhen - Curse.
    Almost every class at 90. Yaks of Wyrmrest Accord.

  10. #10
    I tend to think of myself as a high end caliber player (at least on main) so it's frustrating when I just wanna zip through Heroics but have a lot of trouble when the tank pulls a lot, no CC or there is massive damage from trash. Then im told im a bad healer and people leave when we wipe once lol.

    Thanks for the suggestions and compliments. Yeah this is my first healing class so I just need to learn the hard way I guess. From what I read on Manaflask forum I was told to stack Mastery and Crit. Apparently Crit is suppose to be amazing now for Disc. If that's wrong then yeah I need to know.

  11. #11
    Blademaster
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    Manchester UK
    Posts
    32
    An alternative to TellMeWhen is Ingela Rapture Bar (http://wow.curse.com/downloads/wow-a...asrapture.aspx). Simple blue bar that counts down the 12 seconds.

  12. #12
    Field Marshal
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    Earth
    Posts
    79
    To be honest, holy is an easier spec in a 5 man. You have a lot more insta casts and aoes that it becomes easier to manage 5 people's health.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Ceilingpony View Post
    Hi there! Crit means 200% heal for the same mana cost (+ a nice shield on the target). OP is doing regular HCs and has mana problems. I wouldn't dismiss crit right here and now under these circumstances.
    Even if it had a buff, Haste and Mastery are still far more superior then crit.
    "There's never enough time to do all the nothing you want" - Calvin and Hobbes

  14. #14
    Oh, another thing, make sure you're using your cooldowns (Power infusion, pain suppression) as often as possible, or in time with high damage times of a fight. At low gear you really can't heal stupid, so if someone is standing in fire let them die. Just let the tank know that you're not in full 378 gear and it shouldn't be a problem (assuming the tank isn't a jerk -_-). Good luck and happy healing!
    Almost every class at 90. Yaks of Wyrmrest Accord.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Terashi View Post
    I'd still go for haste or mastery. More haste means more Heals (the Heal heal, the mana efficient one) and more mastery means more damage absorbed from the spells that do crit. You get 10% crit on weakened soul targets and an additional 25% chance each time you use Inner Focus (by the way, make sure you use IF every time it's available, free Greater Heals are tasty). YMMV, of course, but I think in the long run crit is just weak.[/URL].
    We agree on mastery, it is awesome for disc. I'm not sure about haste, as I was crit focused when i geared up my priest so i know that it is possible (it was even before the buff). But you are right, one should go for the stat that fits him better

    To OP: one thing is for sure... if crit doesn't work out for you then try to reforge to haste and give it a go.

  16. #16
    Just to clear up misinformation archangel is not a mana return, it takes more to stack than it gives back you use it as a throughput CD to be stacked up when you have time you don't need to heal. For stats they all work well for disc and your play-style is how you should pick what to go for, I like haste and do 10 mans so that's what I go for.

    If you don't have train of thought in your spec I would pick up those 2 points so you can spam Gheal more efficiently, its really nice when people are too far spread to PoH 3 or more of them or just for sustained tank damage. Shield costs 6300 mana in inner fire so I would mostly only use it on non tanks when they are in danger of immediate death if you don't. If you tell someone hey dud you need to interrupt that or hey stop standing in fire and they don't stop or even tell you to heal through it, don't waste your whole mana bar just let them die and finish the fight without them. If you have gear to support it fine but if you are going to oom and wipe because of it he should have the courtesy to use a few strafe keys.

    Someone mentioned flash heal and renew, there are a few situations in raids where flash heal is good but unless you cant cast a Gheal in time they have weakened soul and also penance is on CD don't use it. Renew is even less useful, unspecced and unglyphed as disc it heals for about 3k per tick without buffs in firelands gear so although you may want to use it when on the move running in from a wipe or to top off someone over 80% cheaply in inner will every so often you wont use it much. That is to say you wont ever be there going oh man people need healing renew!!!!!!

    Divine hymn is a really efficient spell if nothing else and can be used just because you are low mana and need to do something for the group. Borrowed time from shielding hastes all channels to give them ~1 extra tick to tooltips that say max of 12 ticks are wrong, have been for a long time. So you can have a faster ticking(not 4 tick) penance and then cast a spell that is also hasted or you can shield the tank before divine hymn or hymn of hope and get extra ticks. This works even better with power infusion which, at the end of it after making use of the majority of the CD you can shield and use either hymn to get 2-3 extra ticks out of. (depending on your haste from gear + PI + borrowed time) As long as you cast it before the buff falls off the whole hymn is empowered so to speak. Lastly a little widely known trick is to use fiend when you can also take a moment to hymn of hope with it(usually the shield on the tank will be fine to keep him up for the 8 seconds if not timed at a poor moment plus it gives that extra tick on the hymn and hopefully rapture while you have a higher mana pool. So you get 3% of the higher mana pool per fiend hit the mana from the hymn and 7% from rapture off the higher pool at once and you can even time it with lightweave and/or power torrent too for maximum effect.

    A lot of these things aren't 100% necessary to get what you need done but even a few of the easier tips to pick up on will solve your mana issues

    and the rest will help you if not now at some point down the road

  17. #17
    To be completely honest 5 man heroics are quite hard, unless you have an overpowered group and/or you completely understand your class and every bit of incoming damage chances are you will be losing 90% of your mana on each pull.

    When cata first came out and I went from normals to 5 man heroics I actually questioned being a healer which is big for me because I never leveled any other class and always played a healer so for a player that is only getting into healing on any class it will seam a lot harder.

    What you need to look out for in instances is what damage is avoidable and what is not, Tanks should be the only ones taking any real damage on most fights and there is usually only one other mechanic that targets a random player for large damage then standard aoe ticks everything else should be avoidable and shouldn't require you to flash heal till oom to keep stupid people alive.


    Quote Originally Posted by Skullknight10 View Post
    I tend to think of myself as a high end caliber player (at least on main) so it's frustrating when I just wanna zip through Heroics but have a lot of trouble when the tank pulls a lot, no CC or there is massive damage from trash. Then im told im a bad healer and people leave when we wipe once lol.

    Thanks for the suggestions and compliments. Yeah this is my first healing class so I just need to learn the hard way I guess. From what I read on Manaflask forum I was told to stack Mastery and Crit. Apparently Crit is suppose to be amazing now for Disc. If that's wrong then yeah I need to know.
    Crit is awesome but only as you start reaching 30% raid buffed ( actual crit in raids = 45% with renewed hope + procs and 70% with inner focus ) in lower end gear when you have around 20% crit ish it tends to only ever proc when you don't need it and you can't really rely on it to make your healing easier, hence why haste / mastery works better earlier on as they are stable + healing stats with no luck required.
    Last edited by CoolNitro; 2011-09-11 at 03:03 PM.

  18. #18
    The Patient Madam's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Azeroth
    Posts
    324
    OP~ At your current gear level you may not want to be stacking Mastery or Crit.

    In five mans (with crazy pugs) your job is to keep everyone alive. A few things to keep in mind, with 80k mana you don't have the mana pool to support PW:S spam, and casting a Greater Heal (or Heal) without Haste takes 2.5 seconds. Keep PW:S on tank for Rapture procs, time PoH for predictable damage.
    Don't heal DPS taking unneeded damage, let them die. Focus on tank, most DPS will not die after taking a bit of damage, they don't need to be healed to full most of the time. Mastery only gives you more powerful PW:S's, and does help DA, but to a lesser degree, but will not buff any of your single target heals.

    With 4k Int and only 2.94% Haste your heals will feel very weak. The good news is this gets better. Reforge your Crit and some of your Mastery into Haste. The faster you can get your Greater Heal/Heal, the less you will feel the need to spam PW:S, your mana bar will be very happy. Try and get +Int trinkets ASAP, Int makes every heal/absorb stronger, our passive Mysticism also increases our Int by 5%, making Int our absolute number one stat.

    Once your gear gets better go ahead and reforge for your healing style, but for now, IMO grab that Haste, you will instantly see the benefits.

    The guide you read from Manaflask is for raiding, high levels of Mastery and Crit will benefit 25 man raiders, not random heroic healers.

    One other thing you may want to try is the Glyph of Mass Dispel instead of Desperation, many of the heroics have stressful healing times where this glyph can save lives.

    Good Luck, and have fun.

  19. #19
    Havent bothered to read through all the posts but from my knowledge (this might be something to do with gear though) you mana regen comes from replenishment+rapture. Prober tracking of rapture is the key, with my gear rapture provides me with roughly 6k mp5 so tracking this 12 sec cd will def increase you mana regen. One more inportant thing is the use of your mana regen cd's. The more haste the more ticks you get of Hymn of hope. So they way to maximize you mana regen if to use PI, pop your fiend, PW:S someone for the 14% haste bonus then use hymn of hope. This way you increase the ticks you get off Hymn + you maximise your manaregen from the fiend since its mana gain is based on the max mana pool. In raid i can go as low as 30k mana and end up with almost full mana after my hymn. Hope this helps and that ppl havent already havent said the same

  20. #20
    Dont use Heal...ever, with train of thought its the same HPM as Greater Heal.
    Use Inner Will.
    Also, haste isn't good(it affects your shields in no way), especially if your going oom, ignore these people, if mana is a problem go spirit, otherwise alot of crit and mastery(they compliment each other).

    Try to not let DA from PoH go unwasted.

    Disc isn't a good heal them up spec, its preventitive in nature via shields and damage reductions, so you will have alot harder time healing up then other healers but your party's EHP is much higher with you healing.
    Last edited by Eskodas; 2011-09-12 at 06:53 AM.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •