Hi i am looking for some advice on disc stats in 4.2. This is my alt and i have convinced my guild to let me take him to Firelands. I was wondering what the stats i should be going for are, i have heard a plethora of different answers in my web searching ranging from keep them all balanced, to stack haste, to stack mastery and stack crit :3. This is my armory ( http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...think/advanced ). I raid 10 man and we are currently at 6/7 normal. i normally heal tanks and help with raid. Our tanks don't tend to ever need spammed heals so my healing consists of around 20-30% PoH and 25-30% DA and the rest is normally shield in 3rd followed by greater heal and penance in different orders.
At the moment i have a mastery heavy build that i have been using as i really don't know anymore. For 10 man should i get more crit or haste or... i normally run SOS build in raids; Any character advise you can offer will be greatly helpful.
Also we run healer that are either Sham/Hpally/Disc ( Me) or sham/druid/disc. In Sham/Hpally/Disc is me going on my druid a big gain compared to disc?
Thanks for reading , ( i know my gems are screwed 40 Intel all the way ). Also looking into getting logs tomorrow.
Personally, I prefer a stat build focused more so on Mastery. Usually, I'm on the raid with occasional tank focusing, but over all, I use the general Intellect->Spirit->Mastery->Haste setup, ignoring crit for the most part(I always reforge crit) as it's Discipline's worst stat, unless you're tank healing all the time, and even then, you'll be fine with a mastery build.
The reason I prefer to shoot for more mastery is when I raid heal, the majority of my healing comes from PoH, which always procs Divine Aegis, which provides great absorbs healing (especially on fights such as Beth'Tilac and Ryolith). Pretty much everything about a disc priest scales well with Mastery.
The reason you keep hearing / researching to find different answers is because there is no "wrong" answer. It's on play-style.
Some disc priests swear by mastery and use shield a LOT. Others think that shield usage is just meant for tanks and to keep rapture up. Every disc USES shield, it's just one of those things of how much do you use it. One thing to consider is what kind of tank are you healing? DK's, for example, don't have as much avoidance and so the shield gets eaten pretty quickly, and because of borrrowed time, it's hard to keep a shield up on him all the time, and thus takes mastery down. In my opinion (and again, OPINION because it's all play-style based), mastery is the most powerful stat for 25 mans or if you just LOVE to use PW:S alot. Based on your reading you don't.
Haste is very, very good if you use Prayer of Healing a lot (for AOE healing or keeping DA up or whatever), and/or if you use greater heals a lot for tanks. In my opinion and experience, haste is much more powerful then mastery for ten mans. Faster heals = more DA bubbles for the raid, or faster heals for the tank for greater healing. It helps with mana too, because you get your inner focus faster for your greater heals.
In summary, I think Haste is more powerful stat for you then Mastery, but don't ignore mastery. In fact, balancing them seems to be very "safe", and what I tend to do, even if I favor haste over mastery. No matter what you do, it's not wrong, so long as your reforging out of crit.
As far as class balancement goes, I've healed both as a druid and disc in Firelands. They both have their benefits, but I think in both group makeups that disc priest is the way to go. When you have the pally, focus on AE heals and keeping DA up and shielding the tanks but let the pall focus on tanks. When the pally isn't there, focus on the tanks and let the shammy and druid heal the group with the shammy focusing on the offtank. Druids are higher HPs, but disc makes healing easier for everyone, and has much better mana management.
Thanks for the great advice Coro and emplorer. just a quick question, is crit really that worthless? From what i have gathered it helps alot in maintaining Da on the tank, or is crit only good for One tank healing that happens in 25 mans? also If i just use mainly use shield on the tank for rapture/healing and not much else does this affect mastery in a negative way as Da does not scale as well as PwS? Also does crit gain more value in PoH due to th massive Da shields that PoH crits put out ( not sure why , but they do). Also been seeing people with a Crit/haste build for raid heals and a mastery/crit build has anyone got any comments on what these builds exel at?
Last edited by Aussy100; 2011-09-20 at 02:23 PM.
Reason: Added more stuff i just found :3
Crit isn't a USELESS stat, it's just less valued then haste and mastery, because you get more benefit out of it. I forgot to mention mastery affecting DA, but emplorer did a good job of mentioning that. I use to stack Mastery for that very same reason, but then found haste to work better for me.
DA does benefit from mastery, and DA tends to be your biggest heal/absorb at the end of the day if your raid healing. But, I find that having 25 DA uses faster with less shield is more reliable then 20 uses with higher absorb amounts. Also, where some people get confused, is DA is all critical heals from ANY heal spell plus Prayer of Healing no matter what. Meaning, PoH does not have to crit to get DA up, it will always go up, whether you crit or not. So basically, DA crit statement that it talks about is just putting up a shield on the tank when your greater heal / pennance crits. This is again, why I value haste more then mastery, if I can get a heal off twice as quickly as a shield that absorbs twice as much, I'm double dipping in absorbing the same amount as well as doing a heal for twice as much.
Again, this makes crit useful, but not as useful as haste or mastery. Your generally going to have a lot of crit (buffs, stat, int etc), so losing 1% crit when your already pretty high to get 1% more haste or mastery is very noticible.
If you haven't yet you should look at askmrrobot.com they do a pretty good job at setting up your gear for you. They have 2 different setups to pick from. The default is your "typical" balance everything with a slight preference towards mastery as the synergy between haste/mastery/crit is actually really good for disc. If you do 25s and find yourself healing a lot I would go with their haste build which is setup to maximize your AoE healing. The great thing about their priests is they actually have someone on staff that has played a priest since Vanilla and helps to do all the math and prove everything in game.
So disparaged the people that say haste/crit and mastery/crit. when the servers gets up im gonna go try a haste mastery build and then Mr robots build to see what works best for me thanks for the advice guys.
It boils down to this, do you like casting fast? if yes go haste then decide are you tank healing or raid healing or moreover doing 10 man or 25 man? it tends to be both of the former result in mastery being the second one you stack and the latter both going for crit second. Now if you say nah I don't care to cast fast. Alright you go mastery secondarily haste for 10 man tank healing or crit for 25 man raid healing.
Something like that, I'm sure someone is the exception to this and I wouldn't say they are doing it wrong its very player by player raid setup dependent (especially in 10 mans)
Ive been trying different reforges out over the last couple of week and the one im trying for atm is 11.50 % haste 17 % crit and 19 mastry .. the results seem pritty good atm im keeping up with a restodruid and holly palla in HPS . but i really want to know how people find healing with more haste than mastery ... i tryed this once and i could only get my haste up to about 1800 haste with about 13- 14 mastery but my healing out put was awfull ,
haste doesn't actually let you heal more unless you're regen capped. What it does is let you ride out big damage spikes more comfortably, at the expense of the total amount of healing you can do over the course of the fight.
If you're not regen capped, you can get yourself a lot closer to being regen capped with just proper playstyle. Perfect play would get you 3300 mp5 from rapture alone, but even the best players can typically only manage around 2600. If you carry AA and use it properly, that's as much as another 1k mp5. People make cases against AA saying it's a net mana loss, but they forget the huge efficiency boost wings represent. It's about break even, so that 1k mp5 is a gain.
If you are regen capped, consider cutting back on spirit until you're not anymore. Extra mana at the end of any fight is meaningless.
You can keep going back and forth between these two points endlessly, but the result is: try to find a meaningful haste point that is (1) low enough so you're not OOMing and (2) high enough so you still have enough burst to comfortably heal out all the big damage spikes. The rest of your secondary stats can go into mastery and crit, because these stats actually boost your healing done.
What's the right mix? It really depends where you're at and how good your execution is. Disc has a pretty high skill cap, so you might find that a high haste build or a low haste-high mst build is easier to learn with. Can't really max until you've got the hang of your playstyle.
yeah makes sence .. my desecion to add crit was i felt like i wasnt critting alot with just a haste mastry build and once i changed i noticed a big difference and i was critting quite nicely .. as for play style like you said it depends on what fight ur on and manna is certainly not an issue ive even gone to reforging out of spi below 2000 and i still have 50 % + manna after each fight ..and no im not slacking lol it might have gotten to a point were are healers are well geared enough to 2 man heal some fights ..
And as for Aa i cant comment on that yet ive only tryed that last night on 6 of the bosses in fl and i did like it alot gave me some thing extra to do lol
The reason you keep hearing / researching to find different answers is because there is no "wrong" answer. It's on play-style
^^ right on the money, its the funnest thing about the priest forums when disc topics pop up, no one agrees yet no one is wrong as disc is imo one of the few classes that can be played with any stat prio and play style and still be effective.
As for the OP I actually play kind of the same as your self with most of my healing being aoe rather then single target even though I am the main tank healer in our 10 man group.
My stat prios are from gear : int > crit > mastery = hst > > > > spirit, personally if I was forced to heal without at least 40% crit it would suck big time ( 23 static / 30 odd raid buffed / + 10 renewed hope ) as I would have to stop raid healing support and focus on spamming the tanks ( healing up tanks with no crits is painful ).
When fully raid buffed with the right group I end up with 35% crit / 20% haste / 14% mastery not including procs or abilities like BT or RH if we could keep a stable group with the buffs I need I would drop a few percent in both crit and haste to boost mastery a little but as it stands I can't afford to change anything.
As for caps on stats for my self it goes like this. for Crit min = 20% raid buffed, max = 35% raid buffed / haste min = not sure of the numbers but 2.2 second Gheal cast time, the best you should aim for is 2.0 second cast time without BT / mastery can be stacked after the other two stats are what you want them to be at.
For ten mans you can honestly just stack whatever feels right to you and fits your playstyle or you can balance them out. There really is no wrong way. If you rely heavily on PoH then Haste and crit will shit all over mastery. Mastery is the worst stat for PoH heavy play. Haste and crit are close in value. spirits value has vastly decreased with the insane amounts of int on current gear so you can get away with grabbing items with no spi in them and reforging Spi to other stats at your own discretion.