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  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Redsparrow View Post
    meh if he's spamming shields and not going oom then mastery is his best stat /shrug

    starting using other heals or struggle with mana and int will very quickly overtake though

    for spamming gheal or PoH haste is your best throughput secondary stat, crit is your best secondary overall stat for spamming gheal or PoH given a finite mana pool and spamming over a length of time that will make you oom at any point
    He's not going oom, but his healing/absorb output is doodoo compared to that of the druid and paladin.

    Also, I have no logs, as we're not in the same guild and all that jazz. I've never messed with logs, so I couldn't tell you.

    I'm 7/7 (tank), the druid healer and hpal are also 7/7. The group isn't the best, but we're trying to work with them to better themselves and the raid group. With him being so stubborn about the way he's gemming, and people providing maths toward why he's incorrect, he's being very counterproductive.

    Also, I don't know why he feels the need to heal the raid. We have a bomb-ass resto druid as raid heals. I can understand him shielding to help out, but I'm trying to get him to stop gemming and reforging as if that's his only priority.

  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by theCOLORtwelve View Post
    He keeps telling me that he HAS to heal the raid, too. We run Resto Druid, Hpal, Disc Priest. I'm sorry, but shouldn't raid healing be done by some shields from the priest and the rdruid, while the tanks are taken care of by direct heals from the hpal, disc priest, and if we're lucky some float heals from the rdruid? He says that if he doesn't have a shield on the tanks, the tanks will die/he'll have to spam flash heal on them. I'll attach some screenshots of what he's saying.

    http://i55.tinypic.com/29dy25e.jpg
    http://i55.tinypic.com/n53iwp.jpg
    http://i55.tinypic.com/2iuu9p5.jpg
    http://i56.tinypic.com/ws738g.jpg


    Seriously, entire posts in size 1 text are not cool. -Arlee
    He's got some of those special characters in his name, so you might want to explain it to him in little words (sorry not trying to insult, just something I've observed with ASCII lettered people <a lot of players with those types of names tend to be not very good>). Basically, I'd tell him if he doesn't start gemming correctly he can easily be replaced. Tell him that he's hurting the raid by not gemming correctly. If needs be send him to the wow priest forums, the forums here and on EJ (they all say the same things about gems).

    Also remind him: mastery is a throughput stat. That's it. You get the best bonuses from gemming intellect. If he still refuses, replace him for someone better.
    Last edited by taheen74; 2011-09-26 at 05:04 PM.

  3. #23
    His gemming is wrong. He should go for more INT (int/hst or int/mst, int/spi).
    He should drop SPIRIT too. 2730 seems way too much IMO. 2200 should be fine since he has the DMC and the 2 points in SF.
    INT on bracers too.

    I personnally wouldn't reforge out of haste in 10 man.

  4. #24
    In that last screen shot, I didn't think Disc priests spammed flash heal anymore.

    Yea, it sounds like he refuses to listen to advice. I'd find another healer to be honest.
    Last edited by taheen74; 2011-09-26 at 05:08 PM.

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Th3D0n View Post
    Disc stats prio stats are Int>haste>mastery>crit
    why would you ever go haste over mastery as disc... did you even think about what that means or are you just saying random things? is this say random shit day or something?

  6. #26
    The Patient Madam's Avatar
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    Before this turn into a secondary stat rant (we have many here to view already) Int is king, that is a given.

    What is your Disc Priests role in raid? Tank healing, raid Healing or for lack of better wording, spot healer?

    Just guessing that your Pally is mainly on tank and Druid is mainly on raid? Does the Disc Priest feel the need to overheal to keep up?

    Before tossing this healer to the wind, find out why he feels that Mastery trumps Int. His/Her answer may help your raid succeed.

    Healing is not a meter race, but by analyzing overheals or lack of heals, you may be able to find out what is wrong.

  7. #27
    Every thread isn't really the proper place to spread the unstoppable secondary stat debate to.

    There is no correct answer.

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by digitalghost View Post
    why would you ever go haste over mastery as disc... did you even think about what that means or are you just saying random things? is this say random shit day or something?
    Why wouldn't you? I'm fairly sure the answer is the same to both questions.
    Redsparowe#2548 <Crayola Inc>, Lightbringer EU

  9. #29
    First up to everyone quoting stat weights as said before it doesn't matter what your secondary stats are as everyone here will most likely have their own opinion on that subject but for the most part we can all agree that Intellect is first.

    As far as I can tell this guy is one of a kind with Mastery being his primary stat and Spirit second with Intellect either next or below crit so for the most part his stats are wrong vs 99% of disc priests.

    I think the Priests main issue is that he doesn't trust the other healers or tanks to manage their health without his assistance and he also doesn't under stand current healing mechanics i.e tanks hardly get one shot and never usually require your fastest heal to recover, plus he is one of those poor disc priest who believe disc healing is 90% absorbs 10% healing when in reality even for mastery stacked priests its closer to 50 / 50 which makes him basically 0.5 of a healer.

  10. #30
    stepping out of 10 man and into 25 man made me realize just how situational secondary stat 'weights' are. Where in 10 man I had a very efficiency centered build, in 25 man I seem to need haste much more. In 10 man I was making atonement work extremely well, in 25 man I'm not so sure it's possible.

    In 25 I'm being demolished on the logs by a mastery stacking disc priest. Is it the comp or is my execution off? I'm willing to say execution counts for 90% of the current problem I'm having. Basically, hst > mst=crit is still viable even though it isn't working for me right now. My execution is off. So, until I manage to work out my comfort level in 25, it's back to haste stacking or mastery stacking.

    Moral of the story: finding your 'best' stats is an iterative process, and depends on what role you fill as a healer. The question to begin with 'what should my stat priority be?' - This question misses the whole point. What spells are you casting most? How good is your execution? What other healers do you have in the group, and what spells are they casting most? It depends on all this stuff.

  11. #31
    in above posts you say you have a paladin and a druid plus the disc priest... so i'm assuming you're in 10 man raids.
    with the paladin healing tanks and the druid hotting up the raid, i don't see why a disc priest wouldn't want to just shield and let hots heal them up. he/she is not atonement specced.
    while its true that Int is the stat you should be gemming/enchanted for, unless the bonus is greater than +20 int, then you should do orange int/other stat, or purple int/other stat, gems.
    If he/she is not going OOM while keeping other raid members alive, and you guys down bosses, then let them play how they want to.

  12. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Alenoria View Post
    If he/she is not going OOM while keeping other raid members alive, and you guys down bosses, then let them play how they want to.
    That's not really fair to say. If the person isn't carrying their own weight, the other two healers will have to do it. There is no excuse for being bad, you listen to advice, you research, you improve, that's how you handle most other things in life, why not WoW?
    Tenser @ EU-Auchindoun
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  13. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by Alenoria View Post
    If he/she is not going OOM while keeping other raid members alive, and you guys down bosses, then let them play how they want to.
    if you are able to push other members and down the boss, take the underperforming player with you and let him/her continue underperforming.
    that sounds nice but not really fair.

    @theCOLORtwelve
    everyone here can smell something isnt ok, but you wont get proper help without the logs. not being in one guild with people you raid with doesnt mean much, you still can make your own account on wol and load logs from your raids.

    from what i see atm your priest already went for int geming, even to the point where he ignores +20int bonus on chest, nothing really wrong with that.
    nothing wrong, as gems or one bonus really dont matter *that* much. if healing is low, then changing 3-4 gems will not suddenly increase output by a lot.

  14. #34
    This may fall under naming and shaming though

  15. #35
    Stood in the Fire Koilie's Avatar
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    This thread is just full of mis-information. It looks like he re-gemmed before I go to this post so you must have convinced him.

    As far as stat priorities go, there is not THIS IS BEST THATS FINAL setup. It is very dependent on your play style and your raid size/role in the raid.

    Haste and crit scale far better with all spells with the exception being PW:S. If your logs show your with a very high PW:S usage then mastery isn't bad. If you are doing mixed Tank and raid heals in a 10 man environment then it's fairly powerful.

    In a 25 man environment you can see better results with PoH post damage than you will with PW:S Pre damage. While mastery will give you larger DAs when you proc them high haste and crit values will give you more DAs on direct heals and crits on PoH of course give larger DAs than the non crit providing an overall increase in your DA output compared to mastery.

    Just thought I would add a little clarity here before any poor new discs ran off with a head full of confusing do this, no do that mumbo jumbo.

    Edit* Forgot to add Disc's best friend. Ingela's Rapture

  16. #36
    As others have said, int is king and you should get as much of it as you possibly can.


    As for stats, just play aroudn with it and find what suits you. I'm healing 10mans myself, with a druid and pally. My roles varies depending on the fight, so i do both tank and raid heals as necessary. I've also got a hybrid AA/A spec with 1/2 SoS and 2/2 ToT etc.

    My haste/crit/mastery ratio is roughly 1.5 haste : 1 crit : 1 mastery.

  17. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by Th3D0n View Post
    Disc stats prio stats are Int>haste>mastery>crit
    That's a bit wrong atm, Haste cap is around 15% atm and that should be obtained or being close with the current gear sets and raid buffs even if you reforge away haste as ive done. And duo to 4.2 critt is infact a viable stat now seeing as it shields for an larger amount and mastery is always important since it's just great..If your running 10 mens id suggest you gem with 40 int for reds, 20 int + 20 mastery for yellow and 20 int 20 spirit for blues. And try to even out crit and mastery and completly ignore haste

    Edit: Also borrowed time even tips ya over the cap when you shield people so if you feel that you want a fast spell throw out a shield on a dps you know would take dmg
    Last edited by Gzus; 2011-09-27 at 02:11 PM.

  18. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by Gzus View Post
    Edit: Also borrowed time even tips ya over the cap when you shield people so if you feel that you want a fast spell throw out a shield on a dps you know would take dmg
    This still gets me when I see it. Exactly how do you count BT into the haste equation for the spell you "need" haste on when you must use a GCD to gain the buff?

    1. Oh crap I need haste on Spell1
    2. Cast PW:S
    3. Cast BT hasted Spell1

    Unless Spell1 is, like, a 20sec cast, casting PW:S to gain BT to cast a hasted spell is slower than actually casting the spell with zero haste.

  19. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by [-Spiritus-] View Post
    This still gets me when I see it. Exactly how do you count BT into the haste equation for the spell you "need" haste on when you must use a GCD to gain the buff?

    1. Oh crap I need haste on Spell1
    2. Cast PW:S
    3. Cast BT hasted Spell1

    Unless Spell1 is, like, a 20sec cast, casting PW:S to gain BT to cast a hasted spell is slower than actually casting the spell with zero haste.

    I suppose priest use this tactic the same way Shaman's use Riptide, which if you dont know increases the cast time of their next two spells.
    Or similarly the way a druid would use regrowth if properly speced into Natures grace which grants 15% spell haste for 15 seconds with a 1 minute ICD.

  20. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by Gzus View Post
    That's a bit wrong atm, Haste cap is around 15% atm and that should be obtained or being close with the current gear sets and raid buffs even if you reforge away haste as ive done. And duo to 4.2 critt is infact a viable stat now seeing as it shields for an larger amount and mastery is always important since it's just great..If your running 10 mens id suggest you gem with 40 int for reds, 20 int + 20 mastery for yellow and 20 int 20 spirit for blues. And try to even out crit and mastery and completly ignore haste

    Edit: Also borrowed time even tips ya over the cap when you shield people so if you feel that you want a fast spell throw out a shield on a dps you know would take dmg
    The fuck are you talking about? Did I miss something in 4.2? Crit is still worse than MST > HST, HST > MST, HST = MST. Why are you telling people to ignore haste? The best throughput that after int? I hope you're joking.
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