1. #1
    Stood in the Fire TheThirteenthWorstGamer's Avatar
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    Do runes really matter?

    I've just hit 30 and have been playing mostly AD champs since I started playing last year, I bought runes as I went because that's what I thought you needed to do to play/be better but apparently they just raise your ELO (idk if that is true or not). My question is that at level 30 do I really need them to play better in game? I have most tier 3 runes for AD needs so I can use them when playing an AD but I have 7k ip stored up to buy a champ/s and I was wondering if I was to get an AP champ if not having runes would damage my performance all that much?
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  2. #2
    Elemental Lord Duilliath's Avatar
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    Let's put it this way: Would you like to start the game with a free B.F. Sword?

    Because, essentially, that's the equivalent in stats you're giving up if you don't use Runes.

  3. #3
    If you are playing ranked, and you are bronze level, runes aren't going to make much of a difference. Bronze players "generally" don't have a wide selection of champs and they don't have many/if any rune pages. So you won't notice. But once you get to mid-Silver and higher, you have to have runes to compete. Runes mostly impact early game trades. Late game full builds you won't really notice a difference unless you are running like CDR runes.

    Unless you really outplay your opponent or are hard countering your lane, runes are a must.

    I just purchased my final champ a couple weeks ago and I had 2 rune pages. I had an AD page and an AP page. Basically AP/AD quints with armor and scaling MR + penetration marks. That is really all you need to start out. I wouldn't heavily invest in runes unless you like to play multiple lanes and multiple types of champs. You can get away with less than 5 rune pages early on. Once you start playing jungle though, that is when you really notice a difference in rune pages. Like flat CDR runes vs scaling cdr, attack speed, health, armor. There are so many viable combinations that depend on playstyle and champion, and even how you build that champion.

    TLDR - Runes are important.

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Stylepoints View Post
    If you are playing ranked, and you are bronze level, runes aren't going to make much of a difference. Bronze players "generally" don't have a wide selection of champs and they don't have many/if any rune pages. So you won't notice. But once you get to mid-Silver and higher, you have to have runes to compete. Runes mostly impact early game trades. Late game full builds you won't really notice a difference unless you are running like CDR runes.

    Unless you really outplay your opponent or are hard countering your lane, runes are a must.

    I just purchased my final champ a couple weeks ago and I had 2 rune pages. I had an AD page and an AP page. Basically AP/AD quints with armor and scaling MR + penetration marks. That is really all you need to start out. I wouldn't heavily invest in runes unless you like to play multiple lanes and multiple types of champs. You can get away with less than 5 rune pages early on. Once you start playing jungle though, that is when you really notice a difference in rune pages. Like flat CDR runes vs scaling cdr, attack speed, health, armor. There are so many viable combinations that depend on playstyle and champion, and even how you build that champion.

    TLDR - Runes are important.
    To give an example for AP-Mid (my runes)
    Dorans (15 AP) + Runes (26AP flat) = 41 AP on lvl 1
    Armor and Magic pen flat
    Just as Stylepoints said
    Runes are boosting ur early or in point of CDR / Lifesteal and such ur whole game

  5. #5
    Moderator Alarinth's Avatar
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    on sort of the same topic, what kind of runes have the biggest effect at low level (2-4)?

    I have always ran magPen + flat AP on my AP toons, but recently tried swapping out 7 of the flat AP runes for MagPen glyphs. The effect might've been sort of placebo, but it did indeed look like that did more damage than I am used to by the time I got to L3.
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  6. #6
    Elemental Lord Duilliath's Avatar
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    +atk dmg, +armour

    Minions actually do a fuckton of damage to you without defensive masteries and some runes. +atk dmg helps with last hitting and harass.

    MPen does pretty much bugger all vs minions. It's mostly to counter the magic resist champions have.

  7. #7
    Moderator Alarinth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Duilliath View Post
    MPen does pretty much bugger all vs minions. It's mostly to counter the magic resist champions have.
    Oh yes, that was my point. An AP caster with MPen seems to do much more damage at low level than the same with AP runes (against champions). This could probably be very wrong though, but this is anecdotal. Was just wondering if other people experienced the same. I guess this is unique to champions who doesn't scale very well with AP, like Kog'Maw.
    Last edited by Alarinth; 2015-07-22 at 09:41 AM.
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  8. #8
    Elemental Lord Duilliath's Avatar
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    Erm... Kog'maw scales insanely well with everything. Possibly other than Health and even that's debatable.

    Anyway, AP makes your abilities do more damage. MPen makes resistances less good. At some point there's a cut off where the one is better than the other.

  9. #9
    Moderator Alarinth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Duilliath View Post
    Erm... Kog'maw scales insanely well with everything. Possibly other than Health and even that's debatable.
    He really does not, though. Let me quote from his ult, Living Artillery;

    MAGIC DAMAGE: 80 / 120 / 160 (+ 30% AP) (+ 50% Bonus AD)
    MAGIC DAMAGE TO CHAMPIONS: 160 / 240 / 320 (+ 30% AP) (+ 50% Bonus AD)
    If we compare that to, say, Ekko, he scales a lot better;

    MAGIC DAMAGE: 200 / 350 / 500 (+ 130% AP)
    HEAL: 100 / 150 / 200 (+ 20 / 25 / 30% 「 (+ 1% per 30 AP) 」 of damage taken).
    Might be that we are talking about different concepts here, but my understanding is that as Kog'Maws benefit from AP is only 30%, he'd much rather focus on MPen instead of AP, as that is a much higher benefit per point of Mpen compared to per point of AP.

    Do not that I am NOT saying Kog'Maw does not scale well (I know he scales like a beast), but AP isn't what makes him scale well, which is why I brought up the ap vs Mpen discussion
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  10. #10
    Elemental Lord Duilliath's Avatar
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    And what exactly is the cooldown on Kog'maw's ult vs Ekko's ult?

    Additionally, Kog's E has a 70% AP scaling, his Q has another 50% AP scaling. His W also scales with AP (1% per 100 AP).

    Being selective in your arguments does not help your case. I could just point at Ekko's 20% AP scaling on his E and make much the same statement. However, I'd be wrong.

  11. #11
    They matter alot, I'd actually like to see them removed.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by zuze View Post
    They matter alot, I'd actually like to see them removed.
    That would be stupid. Sure it can be a pain to farm the IP for it, but they allow for different set-ups and tactics. Removing them is simply dumbing down the game Blizzard style.

  13. #13
    I agree with both of you, they shouldn't remove runes but the ip cost is stupid. Either reduce or remove the IP cost let there still be the planning pages but make it so new players aren't completely fucked over without spending money for all the good champs in order to not be at a disadvantage due to no runes.
    Quote Originally Posted by Slowpoke is a Gamer View Post
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