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  1. #1

    Ghostcrawler's Thoughts on the state of Holy

    Quote Originally Posted by Ghostcrawler
    We were seeing too many situations where a raid wanted one or even two Disc priests at the expense of a Holy priest. We think part of the problem was Holy’s lack of a strong raid cooldown, so we replaced the State of Mind talent (which was fairly weak ever since Chakra had an unlimited duration) with Heavenly Voice that boosts the healing of Divine Hymn to make it more competitive with Power Word: Barrier. We also increased the number of targets of Divine Hymn from three to five.

    We also reduced the mana cost of Power Word: Sanctuary. We think Holy has sufficient AE throughput, but this spell in particular was very expensive.

    We wanted to change the Glyph of Circle of Healing to make it less of a no-brainer as I explained above under Wild Growth. In the case of the Holy priest, we thought the healing done by CoH was appropriate (which was not the case for the druid) so we had the glyph increase the mana cost instead. Relying too much on Circle of Healing in inappropriate situations (such as when only a few characters are injured) risks hurting the priest’s efficiency with this glyph.

    We rebuilt Spirit of Redemption in a different way. We aren’t trying to change the power of the talent at all, but we did want to make it feel more responsive (less lag between death and Spirit) as well as clean up a few bugs.

    Oh yes, thank Elune!

  2. #2
    Strange that just a month or so ago they said holy was fine and didn't need a raid CD...
    Quote Originally Posted by Precursor View Post
    "Fall of therzane....." ....um what? if that woman fell , god help us it will be the second cataclysm
    Words that lots of people don't seem to know the definition of:
    "Troll", "Rehash", "Casual", "Dead", "Dying", "Exploit".

  3. #3
    Stood in the Fire
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    Holy could still do with some buffs. Either reducing the reliance on spirit stacking, so we can pick up more secondary stats for throughput, or straight up buffing Spiritual Healing for more throughput.

  4. #4
    It's a slap chop fix, and doesn't actually solve our real problem, while at the same time making it so our numbers can be higher. Holy's effic/throughput figures are still wierd and bipolar.

    I vented pretty extensively in the other thread, so maybe leave it there for this one.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by zakaluka View Post
    It's a slap chop fix, and doesn't actually solve our real problem, while at the same time making it so our numbers can be higher. Holy's effic/throughput figures are still wierd and bipolar.

    I vented pretty extensively in the other thread, so maybe leave it there for this one.
    I have to agree with you, Zakaluka, to an extent. I am very excited about the change to Divine Hymn, and also excited that it is a change for Holy and not for Discipline (as, in my opinion, Disc is strong enough already), but the other changes seem to be the equivalent of putting a bandaid on a gaping wound. I will reserve judgement until I see these changes in action, though.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Tihr View Post
    Holy could still do with some buffs. Either reducing the reliance on spirit stacking, so we can pick up more secondary stats for throughput, or straight up buffing Spiritual Healing for more throughput.
    They just made Paladins relying on Spirit Stacking, and dropped Wild Growth by 20%. I think they're trying to bash it into people's heads that Spirit is the mana stat. Now if only to get it to work for Discipline....

    Turn Rapture into the new Judgement of the Pure effect? Breaking a shield is an increase to spirit regen by X% for Y seconds?
    ~Former Priest/Guild Wars 2 Moderator~
    Now TESTING: ArcheAge (Alpha)
    Now PLAYING: MonoRed Burn (MtG Standard)
    Twitter: @KelestiMMO come say hi!
    ~When you speak, I hear silence. Every word a defiance~

  7. #7
    Expecting more than bandaid fixes mid expansion is asking for too much, the devs have made it clear they won't make sweeping changes given the choice. Holy's changes fix the tree enough for the rest of the expac, imo. Our raid healing mana expenditures were tweaked a bit (Sanctuary/CoH) and we have a raid cooldown. Our tank healing ability has always been fine this expac, it's just not popular.

    Overall, holy will be fine for 4.3. Anyone who went Disc just for Barrier and prefers Holy can merrily go back now.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Themos View Post

    Anyone who went Disc just for Barrier and prefers Holy can merrily go back now.

    this is the best news of all. now i wont feel like a prick for insisting on staying holy....................................granted i haven't raided in months but considering coming back to kill deathwing
    Quote Originally Posted by adam86shadow View Post
    I hear people say bring War back to World of Warcraft, well how about bringing World back to World of Warcraft

  9. #9
    I switched to Disc because I felt like I was being coerced into doing so. So I will be happy to switch back to Holy again.

  10. #10
    I don't see the point to the glyph change, yea sure its a mindless spell but adding a 20% increased mana cost with a new Tier meaning higher spirit and better mana regain from Tier pieces (if they ever fix it) means this change basically did nothing.
    Pokemon FC: 4425-2708-3610

    I received a day one ORAS demo code. I am a chosen one.

  11. #11
    I switch back and forth many times daily (coming close to 50k spent on respecs). This buff to DH is very nice, and making holy viable again really doesn't help me choose an offspec. I think it's all going to come down to how awesome DA bubbles look :P
    Redsparowe#2548 <Crayola Inc>, Lightbringer EU

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by zito View Post
    I don't see the point to the glyph change, yea sure its a mindless spell but adding a 20% increased mana cost with a new Tier meaning higher spirit and better mana regain from Tier pieces (if they ever fix it) means this change basically did nothing.
    Honestly, I think that specific change to our glyph was to cushion the blow to the Wild Growth nerf Resto Druids got hit by.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Themos View Post
    Honestly, I think that specific change to our glyph was to cushion the blow to the Wild Growth nerf Resto Druids got hit by.
    Even though, with the nerf to the mana cost of Sanctuary, it means we will be using this spell on cooldown, so the increased cost of Circle really doesn't mean that much.
    ~Former Priest/Guild Wars 2 Moderator~
    Now TESTING: ArcheAge (Alpha)
    Now PLAYING: MonoRed Burn (MtG Standard)
    Twitter: @KelestiMMO come say hi!
    ~When you speak, I hear silence. Every word a defiance~

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Kelesti View Post
    Even though, with the nerf to the mana cost of Sanctuary, it means we will be using this spell on cooldown, so the increased cost of Circle really doesn't mean that much.
    For 25 mans, most certainly. But there isn't all that much Sanc being tossed around on 10 man, even without the mana efficiency restraint.

  15. #15
    Power Word: Sanctuary? Get it right foolcrawler.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Themos View Post
    For 25 mans, most certainly. But there isn't all that much Sanc being tossed around on 10 man, even without the mana efficiency restraint.
    But in 10 man, you can now ask yourself if you really really need the glyph for Circle!

    ---------- Post added 2011-09-27 at 11:10 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Xelaeno View Post
    Power Word: Sanctuary? Get it right foolcrawler.
    I'm just grateful he remembered the name of the middle spec, this time around.
    ~Former Priest/Guild Wars 2 Moderator~
    Now TESTING: ArcheAge (Alpha)
    Now PLAYING: MonoRed Burn (MtG Standard)
    Twitter: @KelestiMMO come say hi!
    ~When you speak, I hear silence. Every word a defiance~

  17. #17
    At the rate of his brain's degradation I reckon it won't be long before he call us resto priest.

  18. #18
    It feels like alot of the class changes this patch are just band-aid fixes. It's a pretty poor effort on Blizz's part but at the same time I can see a bit of where they are coming from. I like the changes as they stand for Holy, but wish the buff to Divine Hymn applied to all specs, so it was more on par with Resto Druids and that bloody Tranq.

    I think Holy is now going to be in more demand than Disc in 4.3, or at least in groups with a Blood DK that has 4piece bonus. With a resto druid, holy priest and hpally you could just hit Vampiric Blood on CD, buffing the raid healing by a lot, while rotating the healers aoe heals (Divine Hymn, Tranq and Holy Radiance) since I believe all will be on a 3 min cd at that point. OP as hell but I have the sneaking suspision we might just need all that healing.

  19. #19
    First: Divine Hymn isn't needed by Discipline. It has Power Infusion, Archangel, and Power Word: Barrier. Secondly: Holy Radiance is a Prayer of Healing type spell, not a Tranquility.
    ~Former Priest/Guild Wars 2 Moderator~
    Now TESTING: ArcheAge (Alpha)
    Now PLAYING: MonoRed Burn (MtG Standard)
    Twitter: @KelestiMMO come say hi!
    ~When you speak, I hear silence. Every word a defiance~

  20. #20
    Sucks to be a pally then. And Shadow. Gotta love how Balance Druids can actually have a stronger Tranq than Resto though.

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