[Moonkin] Guide :: 5.4 Edition

[Juvencus]

How should we gem? When is it worth it to gem something else than crit? The bonus is usually 60 intellect which is quite a lot

90% of the time you will want to get the socket bonus, because this time it is really a bonus with hybrid gems having double secondary stats as well.

Crit in yellows, Intel+Crit in reds, Intel+Hit/Spirit or Crit+Spirit/Hit in blues will be the default (not counting encounters and haste breakpoints) choices.

[Sunfyre]

A few things I still need to determine. Is it worth putting up the non-Eclipsed DoT each rotation? I've heard reports single DoT is giving better DPS. Is there a crit level where it's not worth it (because there's not enough SS procs)?

Also, trying to figure out 5man heroic rotation. There really isn't enough mobs to just Hurricane, but single target also is really weak as well. There's gotta be a good combination to do competitive DPS here.

[Pascal]

A few things I still need to determine. Is it worth putting up the non-Eclipsed DoT each rotation? I've heard reports single DoT is giving better DPS. Is there a crit level where it's not worth it (because there's not enough SS procs)?

Also, trying to figure out 5man heroic rotation. There really isn't enough mobs to just Hurricane, but single target also is really weak as well. There's gotta be a good combination to do competitive DPS here.

I'm having the same issues in 5 mans. I'm not very math savvy so I've just been going off of what I see and do and the results of each pull. When there are not very many mobs (three or four), I tend to multidot only the eclipsed dot and then single target. I've tried multidotting and then using hurricane for small amounts of mobs, but they die too quickly in that there are already one or two dead before hurricane is half over and then end the pull with pet-level dps.

If there are more than four mobs, trying to multidot them leaves me at absolutely pitiful damage. Using mushrooms after the pull has already started leaves me miles behind and the damage they give if I can get them down before a pull starts seems entirely negligible. Unfortunately, the only thing that really works for bigger groups is straight up using hurricane immediately, which still gets left in the dust by mages and death knights particularly. Solar eclipse hurricane on one pull in particular did 200,000 less damage than a mage's swirly frost ball set-and-forget thing(800,000 vs 1,000,000). That's what makes me think there has to be something more to it as I just can't accept that we would straight up just have incredibly weak aoe at the moment, but who knows, maybe its not our fault.

[Clevername]

I'm relieved / disturbed to see others having the same issues as me. I keep attributing it to low gear level or something but I'm lining up C/D's correctly and still seeing subpar aoe / single target / multi target dps.... I just can't get the right mix of multidotting / aoe abilities. Is there something we missed from beta testing? I work my ass off to pull mid 30k's while I watch war's hover in the 50k range.

[Sunfyre]

I'm relieved / disturbed to see others having the same issues as me. I keep attributing it to low gear level or something but I'm lining up C/D's correctly and still seeing subpar aoe / single target / multi target dps.... I just can't get the right mix of multidotting / aoe abilities. Is there something we missed from beta testing? I work my ass off to pull mid 30k's while I watch war's hover in the 50k range.

My burst damage is great on a boss, but then everyone else catches up a minute or two into a fight. I'm hoping better gear will help us scale better.

[Deleted]

I'm having the same issues in 5 mans. I'm not very math savvy so I've just been going off of what I see and do and the results of each pull. When there are not very many mobs (three or four), I tend to multidot only the eclipsed dot and then single target. I've tried multidotting and then using hurricane for small amounts of mobs, but they die too quickly in that there are already one or two dead before hurricane is half over and then end the pull with pet-level dps.

If there are more than four mobs, trying to multidot them leaves me at absolutely pitiful damage. Using mushrooms after the pull has already started leaves me miles behind and the damage they give if I can get them down before a pull starts seems entirely negligible. Unfortunately, the only thing that really works for bigger groups is straight up using hurricane immediately, which still gets left in the dust by mages and death knights particularly. Solar eclipse hurricane on one pull in particular did 200,000 less damage than a mage's swirly frost ball set-and-forget thing(800,000 vs 1,000,000). That's what makes me think there has to be something more to it as I just can't accept that we would straight up just have incredibly weak aoe at the moment, but who knows, maybe its not our fault.

For me it is exactly the same and I would very much like to get some insight on why this is the case. t11-t13 I just go to one eclipse and just multidotting 3+ mobs definitely pushed me up a lot on dps meters. Now I feel my dps even FALLS below single target damage when I try to do this. Even eclipsed shrooms seem to not do what they used to. I am going a little bit crazy about this right now. Also I experience what sunfyre said, good burst at the start and only mediocre dps at the end of the fight.

[Marcadius]

I leveled on the first day and then spammed heroics right away.
In the beginning I was sad at both my aoe and single target dps.
After trying different things, this is what's working with my guild groups.
On mobs of 3-4 just don't bother you won't do any decent damage.
4+ prep pant shrooms to get the 8%magicbenefit pop starfall and hurricane your heart out (be in solar)
With this I'm able to keep up with most of the classes or fall only few % behind.
Single target with my groups we burn through everything too fast so I pop EVERYTHING at the beginning of fight so that's berserk,ce,sof,ca,engi gloves,trinket and just go balls to the wall and I have been able to keep up with almost every class.

Note: some encounters Cleve spec will just rape same on some movement etc.
I noticed a bug with hurricane where a guildie who has my mirror stats does way more less damage with his hurricane then I do with mine.
Hope this helps a bit

---------- Post added 2012-09-30 at 02:41 PM ----------

Also I usually don't refresh dots if they fall down till I hit eclipse which my crits have helped a lot keep at least one dot up till eclipse procs

[Sunfyre]

For me it is exactly the same and I would very much like to get some insight on why this is the case. t11-t13 I just go to one eclipse and just multidotting 3+ mobs definitely pushed me up a lot on dps meters. Now I feel my dps even FALLS below single target damage when I try to do this. Even eclipsed shrooms seem to not do what they used to. I am going a little bit crazy about this right now. Also I experience what sunfyre said, good burst at the start and only mediocre dps at the end of the fight.

Shrooms are meant to be a preplanned thing now. You should be using hurricane for most of your AoE.

---------- Post added 2012-09-30 at 04:21 PM ----------

I leveled on the first day and then spammed heroics right away.
In the beginning I was sad at both my aoe and single target dps.
After trying different things, this is what's working with my guild groups.
On mobs of 3-4 just don't bother you won't do any decent damage.
4+ prep pant shrooms to get the 8%magicbenefit

Earth and moon doesn't exist in MoP, so shrooms aren't applying that for you.

[draykorinee]

Glad I came here, I read I was suppose to multi dot but found myself just doing terrible dps, I used hurricane but never really took off, forgot about shrooms. Totally new to moonkin and although I enjoy boss fights finding lagging dps wise in aoe a pain.

[Sunfyre]

I've found a way to (usually) be decently competitive in 5man trash DPS, but it takes a lot of work.

Either Eclipse tends to work okay for this, and obviously if there's a LOT of adds (more than 4), I'd want to be in Solar.

There's generally three types of adds I've found:

Large Mobs :: These usually come in packs of two
Quad Mobs :: Usually four mobs together in a pack
Small Trash :: Usually AoE fodder, sometimes they're with quad/large mobs.

For large mob packs, since they won't die for awhile, I double DoT both mobs then single target cast on them. Each eclipse, I refresh double DoTs.

For Quad Mobs, since they die a bit faster, I only empowered DoT them then single target.

For trash, I AoE while in Solar. Sometimes I'll DoT a few before hand to pick up some Shooting Stars procs.

The key is to utilize Astral Communion whenever you're between trash packs to keep yourself ALWAYS in an Eclipse.

For bosses, I always make sure to start in Lunar Eclipse. I usually start one AC tick/Wrath away, so I make sure I get the entirety of Nature's Grace.

Once I hit Lunar, I pop Incarnation, nuke. At 0 energy, I pop CA and continue nuking with Starfire.

I can pull huge numbers with this for burst, but my damage levels off after that and other classes can often catch up. For heroics, I'm pondering Nature's Vigil over HotW just for the extra burst right off the bat. For a sustained raid scenario, I'm pretty sure I'll still want HotW.

If anyone has any other suggestions/etc please let me know. If not, I'll begin updating the guide to reflect this type of rotation.

[mikoslav]

I d like to point out that we can use starfall 3 times in a row now.
in late solar, or pre lunar you cast starfall, then you get lunar and starfall ready again, then when you come out of lunar you use CA and 3rd time you can starfall, it works perfectly for any huge amount of mobs, or boss with adds, in between you can just astral storm if many mobs, if less you just multi dot plus starsurge.

if you have starfall off CD before going into lunar you should always cast it, before you go into lunar. It will be instantly ready when you hit lunar and you can wait until it expires and instantly reapply it.

Considering that, it s not a bad idea to prepare for a pull with astral communion and setting your eclipse bar just a little prelunar. Then with pull you starfall and hit 1 wrath and have starfall ready again.

[Sunfyre]

Alright, all of the (easy) stuff of the guide has been updated. I now have the profession/enchanting/jewelcrafting section updated. I also clarified the stat priorities/etc to include the haste cap of being the preferred way to go (if you can get there).

I think I've just got about a handle on 5man DPS. I want to play around a bit more in a 25man setting before I feel totally comfortable writing up the rotation. I expect to have it done by this weekend.

[ctpitcock]

i love this!! Helps so much!

[xrayEU]

Looks like Balance somewhat struggling this first week of raiding according to worldoflogs :[

[Lilija]

Looks like Balance somewhat struggling this first week of raiding according to worldoflogs :[

Unless I screw up something, I don't really feel like struggling ^^ (If not for 2 phase logs on 3rd raid boss, I would have 3rd moonkin dps in the world with 61300). Tho I gues few other classes, might be have bigger error tolerance.

[Alzu]

I think that is a result of not knowing how to play the class well. I had no issues dealing competitive dps against other really good players.

[xrayEU]

I'm glad to hear that we still can compete in raids with other classes, it's our first raid tonight so I guess I'll find out myself how balance are doing in raids instead of just looking at numbers ^^

[Shotsi]

I didn't hear about the big haste breakpoint until today, so my gear is crit heavy. Is it worth getting the breakpoint at all costs?

For me to get the haste breakpoint I would have to reforge all crit to haste (after getting hit) and replace nearly all gems with haste gems.

http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...hotsi/advanced

[Lilija]

I didn't hear about the big haste breakpoint until today, so my gear is crit heavy. Is it worth getting the breakpoint at all costs?

For me to get the haste breakpoint I would have to reforge all crit to haste (after getting hit) and replace nearly all gems with haste gems.

http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...hotsi/advanced

In my oppinion it's not worth to sacrifise crit for haste unless you are very close to a breakpoint. I know we are not used to it, but crit is really worth it. Value of crit and haste are similar but unless you are close to a breakpoint, crit will be worth slightly more.

P.S. Starsurge machine gun is really sweet

[Shotsi]

In my oppinion it's not worth to sacrifise crit for haste unless you are very close to a breakpoint. I know we are not used to it, but crit is really worth it. Value of crit and haste are similar but unless you are close to a breakpoint, crit will be worth slightly more.

P.S. Starsurge machine gun is really sweet

However, the fights in Mogushan is really multidot oriented which should make the breakpoint a lot more worth it?