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  1. #1421
    Quote Originally Posted by Monkerxx View Post
    Sorry,that was taken in the wrong way. I meant, at what point in the opener do you cast them? Just as soon as you pop CA? and then when do you pop them again in the rotation? I know the solar opener is the go to but I just wasn't sure about where FoN fit into that point in the rotation, that's all.
    You will usually get all procs up on the pull, the only thing that can slack a bit for me is Bindings, so just blow all 3 treants when the procs come up. You wanna use them during either an SS or DoT GCD, so for example when you apply your first dots with CA you can FoN 3 times in that global.

  2. #1422
    Quote Originally Posted by Monkerxx View Post
    Sorry,that was taken in the wrong way. I meant, at what point in the opener do you cast them? Just as soon as you pop CA? and then when do you pop them again in the rotation? I know the solar opener is the go to but I just wasn't sure about where FoN fit into that point in the rotation, that's all.
    Start with SS and Wrath (shouldn't take more than 2-3 total casts) until trinkets proc and then proc CA followed by 3xTreants.

  3. #1423
    Quote Originally Posted by Monkerxx View Post
    Sorry,that was taken in the wrong way. I meant, at what point in the opener do you cast them? Just as soon as you pop CA? and then when do you pop them again in the rotation? I know the solar opener is the go to but I just wasn't sure about where FoN fit into that point in the rotation, that's all.
    When you have as many procs as you can get. They scale with anything that affects your charsheet stats except mastery, but nothing else.

  4. #1424
    Quote Originally Posted by Whitestrife View Post
    I did 335k with 550 ilvl so I don't know what you're trying to show.

  5. #1425
    Quote Originally Posted by Glurp View Post
    I did 335k with 550 ilvl so I don't know what you're trying to show.
    25 numbers are a lot higher.

  6. #1426
    Quote Originally Posted by Glurp View Post
    I did 335k with 550 ilvl so I don't know what you're trying to show.
    I want to show that haste is fully viable in hc and fun to play too :-) But thats my opinion, i was hoping someone makes the same exp ;-)

  7. #1427
    Quote Originally Posted by Whitestrife View Post
    I want to show that haste is fully viable in hc and fun to play too :-) But thats my opinion, i was hoping someone makes the same exp ;-)
    I personally could never play it.. Love my Starsurges and big crits too much.

  8. #1428
    Quote Originally Posted by Whitestrife View Post
    I want to show that haste is fully viable in hc and fun to play too :-) But thats my opinion, i was hoping someone makes the same exp ;-)
    But it's not a matter of opinion. Haste is the weakest out of the three secondary stats post-10296 GCD cap so there is absolutely no reason why you would stack it over Crit or Mastery.

    Quote Originally Posted by Juvencus View Post
    Start with SS and Wrath (shouldn't take more than 2-3 total casts) until trinkets proc and then proc CA followed by 3xTreants.
    I don't think that doing that is a DPS gain. Most of your procs should be up on the pull. By delaying your cooldowns, you're not going to have pre-pot up synched with them as well as it would have been if you just used them at the start. And if you're unlucky and one of your trinkets takes longer to proc, that's your whole opener screwed.

    Oh and you want to put DoTs up before popping trees.
    Last edited by Mutheru; 2013-10-17 at 04:19 AM.
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  9. #1429
    Quote Originally Posted by Mutheru View Post
    I don't think that doing that is a DPS gain. Most of your procs should be up on the pull. By waiting, you're not going to have pre-pot up synched with your cooldowns as well as it would have been if you just used them at the start. And if you're unlucky and one of your trinkets takes longer to proc, that's your whole opener screwed.
    I open with SS and 1 Wrath, and got rank 4 on malkorok heroic tonight, whattup

  10. #1430
    Doing two casts on pull is fine. Casting until everything perfectly aligns itself (which is never guaranteed and might not happen), not so much. ;P
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  11. #1431
    Field Marshal Bizley's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Whitestrife View Post
    I want to show that haste is fully viable in hc and fun to play too :-) But thats my opinion, i was hoping someone makes the same exp ;-)
    I've tried full haste yesterday and it was merely good... Nothing special, switching back to crit.

  12. #1432
    Quote Originally Posted by durrtygoodz View Post
    25 numbers are a lot higher.
    The only thing that makes DPS generally higher in 25man is the gear differences because of Warforged drops or if there are extra targets to DoT. There aren't any extra targets for Protectors and my ilvl was lower in this case.

    Tne only way I can see a haste build being viable is if you went for the 10779 breakpoint for +15 ticks with Lust, Meta and Berserking and +10 ticks with Meta and Berserking. Even then the risk/reward tradeoff isn't going to be worth it unless the fight is like 1 minute long.
    Last edited by Glurp; 2013-10-17 at 07:17 AM.

  13. #1433
    Quote Originally Posted by Mutheru View Post
    I don't think that doing that is a DPS gain. Most of your procs should be up on the pull. By delaying your cooldowns, you're not going to have pre-pot up synched with them as well as it would have been if you just used them at the start. And if you're unlucky and one of your trinkets takes longer to proc, that's your whole opener screwed.

    Oh and you want to put DoTs up before popping trees.
    Why would I waste 2 globals to put dots up when 2 casts later I will be casting a CA-buffed dot? Waiting for the Amp trinket to proc is worth it. 14k Intel isn't exactly nothing you know.

    We are talking FoN+HotW here.

  14. #1434
    Herald of the Titans Lilija's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by durrtygoodz View Post
    I open with SS and 1 Wrath, and got rank 4 on malkorok heroic tonight, whattup
    I really doubts it's the only reason :P Moonkins mostly lose dps there due to movement. If you are lucky and don't have to move much you will be higher. Also, being thrown in the air during the opener makes rather significant difference especially if SS doesn't proc at that point. Also the top 25man logs which are higher than 10man in general seem to have rather straight forward opener (with few exceptions)

    Anyway, one thing makes wonder - why INC parses so much better than FoN on Malkorok since it's a pure single target fight o.O

  15. #1435
    Quote Originally Posted by Lilija View Post
    Anyway, one thing makes wonder - why INC parses so much better than FoN on Malkorok since it's a pure single target fight o.O
    It isnt purely single target(on heroic atleast) if you are padding on adds and having inc up for starfall hitting them could maybe push it ahead on logs? especially since there are some right off the start thats the only thing i can think of atm

  16. #1436
    Quote Originally Posted by Lilija View Post
    Anyway, one thing makes wonder - why INC parses so much better than FoN on Malkorok since it's a pure single target fight o.O
    If I remember correctly, Wrathcalcs (which is usually used to base our claims on Fon > Inc on single target) doesn't take cooldown stacking into account making Inc more valuable that it shows on Wrathcalcs.

    Also trinkets and other procs can sway one's dps so heavily in one way or other that it might be just due to small sample size why it seems better.

  17. #1437
    Herald of the Titans Lilija's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by alany View Post
    It isnt purely single target(on heroic atleast) if you are padding on adds and having inc up for starfall hitting them could maybe push it ahead on logs? especially since there are some right off the start thats the only thing i can think of atm
    Trying to even touch those adds as a caster dps is a bad idea because if they aggro on you (and they will if you start dpsing them - even Starfall is enough to aggro few of them for far too long) they will give you debuff that will lower your casting speed and movement drasticly.

  18. #1438
    Quote Originally Posted by Lilija View Post
    Anyway, one thing makes wonder - why INC parses so much better than FoN on Malkorok since it's a pure single target fight o.O
    Things change as gear progresses. Incarnation is going to be a lot stronger than FoN as people get more geared as our opener becomes stronger and stronger from trinket procs.

  19. #1439
    so over treants atm, awlays incsistencys with the calculetions idk.. Incaration doing way more for me even long fihgt. meybe if u still have 2 throne trinekt??

  20. #1440
    Quote Originally Posted by fappasaurus View Post
    is kind of silly argue it since it can be small difference i just make a coment back there it'd be ideal to have it seperate binds rather than always use a macro. Just want to make sure u say it always same to us e it togetr or no?

    idk ur saying stament about lunar or solar openiong is varied on encounter irregardless idk but if ur always solar. ur not amp trinket on armory so it's different see what i saying?

    going to very on the gear and the fight and procs coming or not can't always be the same cd usage. amp for exageration is icd doesnt proc on pull well then gg all ur CA no proc

    durty is make the point to about the gcd cap and another reason to stager at a lust time so so u keep up the qucik cast after meta is off... no body predidicating things maybe i am seeing difference b/c of different gear and things idk
    If you delay Berserk for proccs, why wouldnt you delay CA as well? Because its a dps loss... oh wait.

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