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  1. #41
    High Overlord Zachyveng's Avatar
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    I think one thing people are getting confused about is the "light side"/ "dark side" points. Now I'm not in the Beta but from what the developers have hinted at it's really not light and dark points like in the force. By this I mean the "light side" option for a Sith wouldn't be to help the Jedi council or something like that but would be to benefit the Empire above yourself.

    For example (and I'm totally pulling this out of my head, nothing NDA breaking unless I'm just damn good at hypothetical situations) you're a Sith. You go into a moff's territory and discover that he is running a highly illegal fighting arena between peasants. If what I understand is right the "light side" option would be to turn him over to the authorities and the "dark side" Option would be to accept his bribe and get a cut of the profits. I think the names "light side" and "dark side" in the game are just an easy way to refer to it. Think paragon and renegade if you have to.

    Personally I intend to make my decisions the same way I do in Mass Effect, I'm going to base it off what I feel the character would do in the situation to serve him best. I mean I'm not going to go with the "slaughter 90 babies b/c that dude sneezed" option, but I would definitely go for the slaughter 50 guards so you can gain access to a rare lightsaber crystal option. One is "evil for being evil" the other is "evil to gain something". Sith to me aren't about being evil just so they can go "muahahaha I'm one evil bastard" as in the Sith code located on Page 2 shows it's all about gaining personal power and accepting your emotions.
    Krael, Sith Council of Untold Prophecy

  2. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by Klur View Post
    As for the example you use, from a gameplay perspective, yes, it would be ridiculous if one act just suddenly turned you evil, but it should still be easier to stray to the Dark than to go from dark to light. What I don't agree with is Sith force user's being "light side." It goes against the very essence of the Sith. The Sith value one thing more than all else, personal power, and they stop at no nothing in their quest for more of it.
    Mindlessly killing every single person you see doesn't make you more powerful. You gained nothing from burning down that orphanage on the way to some ancient artifact. The Light/Dark meter is morality, not force powers. A "dark side" Sith is one the actively goes out of their way to cause harm to everything. You'll be on your way to find some super-weapon and actually take time away just to torture a man to death. I don't want to break NDA, but I'll just say that a "light side" Sith Warrior won't be doing "good" in the way you think they will.

  3. #43
    Mechagnome
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    I would figure that the idea behind "light side" Sith is to kill only when you have to, not when you feel like it, and to spare people who might potentially be useful to you. If you give them their lives, they may well give you their service. Something like that.

    Honestly...I plan to experiment. My first character - an Inquisitor-Sorcerer - will be a complete sadistic asshole, heh. My next - I dunno if I will end up going Warrior, or Inquisitor-Assassin, just to test it (seeing as I don't think you can dual-spec) - will probably be a little more...thoughtful about the people he kills, heh.
    Originally Posted by Fargo (Blue Tracker / Official Forums)
    The primordial soup that creates heroes never tastes of rainbows -- it’s a lumpy gumbo of suffering and evil.

  4. #44
    Scarab Lord Buckwald's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Klur View Post
    100%. This is why "light side" Sith is a ridiculous concept.
    I think you miss the point of a "light side" Sith. As DE stated a LS Sith isn't all rainbow and flowers, but they might help out a fellow Sith if needed. Example, during a quest you come across a wounded Sith Warrior NPC needing help killing a beast, you accept and help him kill it and you gain LS points. Or you let the beast kill him and you gain DS points.

  5. #45
    Well from my experiences with how it works via KoToR and the concept of the system with Mass Effect, here's the basis I'm running off of: Sith Inquisitor born and raised in the mantra of the Sith, knows nothing else but how to be Sith. With time, age, and experience starts thinking for themselves, and doesn't necessarily blindly believe in the cause anymore. I intend to make choices based on the situation, if I particularly dislike the NPC I'm dealing with and I have the option to murder them for any reason at all I fully intend to. However on the flip side should a situation arise where I have the choice of a "no witnesses" or sparing the wide eyed kid staring at me... Who knows, maybe I let him walk away and never tell anybody.

  6. #46
    Honestly not sure at the moment...my main will be a Sith juggernaut..so im not sure if ill go light or just pure evil...knocking down doors screaming something like im the juggernaut bitch and move on.
    Quote Originally Posted by Standsinfire View Post
    Me: whyumad* fixed. Seriously though, it's only because they rapin' eveerbody in here and I don't want you to be snatched out yo' windows.
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    If that were my dog, I'd Hulk Smash the fuck out of that raccoon.
    Or I'd shit my pants.

  7. #47
    Now this is just my opinion, but after all we are talking about a videogame which is supposed to make money, with players who are real human beings and not fictional charachters. If the only choice for a sith would be something we would call a sadistic psychopath, I doubt all that many players in the end would choose to play a sith. Judging from this thread, most players play sith because they want to be free to do what they want and what benefits them most without societal rules. Which is also probably an important explanation as to why videogames are popular in the first place. Most people don't want to play a charachter who's a sadistic murder, because we have an inherent sense of a conscience which even applies to things that don't exist in reality (not that I'm saying those who do like killing imaginary charachters for fun have psychological issues). The point is, this absolute good / absolute evil format fits poorly to the morality of real people. I'd wager most of us are sort of light side sith or dark side jedi anyways, abiding by the rules most of the time but still doing what benefits ourselves, and being nice to others when we feel like it.

    MainTankasin - Consular/Inquisitor Tanking

  8. #48
    Quote Originally Posted by Sighz View Post
    I'll do everything that'll benefit me. If that takes me down the DS path or LS path I don't really care. I'll grind out DS points at 50.
    Pretty much this, when im 50 ill go as dark as possible >
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  9. #49
    Quote Originally Posted by vizzle View Post
    If you're born in Germany in the early 20th century and you're forced to go to war and be a part of the Nazis, does that make you as bad as Hitler?

    Did you ever stop and think that people (yes even in the Star Wars universe) aren't all black and white?
    For the Sith, yes. It's more akin to being born and raised solely in the Hitler Youth. If you are force capable and raised/ join the Sith Empire you are raised/taught that gaining more personal power is what matters most. Bare in mind this is solely for Force users, other members of the Empire (bounty hunters, troops, ect.) aren't exactly Sith.

    To others: I never suggested that Sith should always have to take the "murderous, rampaging egotist" route. In fact, I criticized Bioware for taking the lazy way out in their previous KotOR game by making the only quest dialog options that were dark side the most ridiculously 2d type. For example: A quest giver asks you to get a item for him that may be a powerful force item. Bioware's typical choices were Light Side: Sure I'll help you mister!, Neutral: Maybe, do I get something in return, and Dark Side: Screw you! If you're too weak to get it then why should I help, jerkface? These option are usually very forced. Realistically, a Sith would probably help the man, and then if the item proved powerful either take it by force or threat of force.

    Now if what Zachyveng is true, then the whole light points/ dark points is just a misleading sounding name and has nothing to do with your force alignment, and ,using the Sith side as an example, instead is more like if you behave like Count Dooku or Darth maul, (I guess Yoda/Obi-wan or Mace Windu for republic)
    And again, as Zachyveng pointed out, the most ideal way to describe the Sith is not "evil for the sake of being evil", but "evil to gain something."

  10. #50
    Quote Originally Posted by Deadlycaster View Post
    Pretty much this, when im 50 ill go as dark as possible >

    It just does just start at lvl 50. it starts with the every mission you do. By moving your mouse over each option as choice for a response, will either give you light or dark points. so you can be as dark as you want by the time you get to lvl 50. I think I know some ppl were lvl 6 Dark by the time they got to lvl45 on the july testing phase.


  11. #51
    Quote Originally Posted by Bob from Accounting View Post
    All that nonsense to be only as strong as a jedi, only with twisted mind and physical scars as side effects of the corruption of the dark side.
    In-game maybe, but canon wise, the dark side is normally much much stronger than the light side due to there being no restrictions. Except when there are thousands of Sith. Rule of Two is the best.
    I'm actually looking for money, work is just an unwanted side effect.

  12. #52
    Quote Originally Posted by Gallahadd View Post
    the way I see it being a Sith is about Freedom and power, not being a murderous moron.
    This is true. However, when I play Empire, I'm going to play a murderous, destructive moron who lets my good buddy Khem Val eat whoever he wants, whether they're important to the Empire or not.

  13. #53
    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

    This. Winning.

    Infracted. Please read the guidelines. "This" posts have never been allowed.
    Last edited by Elysia; 2011-10-13 at 08:47 AM.

  14. #54
    Quote Originally Posted by Buckwald View Post
    I think you miss the point of a "light side" Sith. As DE stated a LS Sith isn't all rainbow and flowers, but they might help out a fellow Sith if needed. Example, during a quest you come across a wounded Sith Warrior NPC needing help killing a beast, you accept and help him kill it and you gain LS points. Or you let the beast kill him and you gain DS points.
    You're forgetting the true darkside option:

    Kill the weakling as they clearly aren't capable of killing you AND the beast and then go about slaughtering the beast to thoroughly assert your authority within the area.

    ---------- Post added 2011-10-13 at 08:15 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Merrena View Post
    In-game maybe, but canon wise, the dark side is normally much much stronger than the light side due to there being no restrictions. Except when there are thousands of Sith. Rule of Two is the best.
    The dark side is always stronger because they're fed.

    They rush in at double the level of nice friendly guys, and rape face... complete a random objective and run off for 80% of the movie doing random cameo's and death threats while the protagonists farm xp like mad trying to barely catch up. If Jedi followed a rule of two, then those would be a pair of bad ass Jedi.

  15. #55
    Dreadlord Adeodatus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zachyveng View Post
    I think one thing people are getting confused about is the "light side"/ "dark side" points. Now I'm not in the Beta but from what the developers have hinted at it's really not light and dark points like in the force. By this I mean the "light side" option for a Sith wouldn't be to help the Jedi council or something like that but would be to benefit the Empire above yourself.

    For example (and I'm totally pulling this out of my head, nothing NDA breaking unless I'm just damn good at hypothetical situations) you're a Sith. You go into a moff's territory and discover that he is running a highly illegal fighting arena between peasants. If what I understand is right the "light side" option would be to turn him over to the authorities and the "dark side" Option would be to accept his bribe and get a cut of the profits. I think the names "light side" and "dark side" in the game are just an easy way to refer to it. Think paragon and renegade if you have to.

    Personally I intend to make my decisions the same way I do in Mass Effect, I'm going to base it off what I feel the character would do in the situation to serve him best. I mean I'm not going to go with the "slaughter 90 babies b/c that dude sneezed" option, but I would definitely go for the slaughter 50 guards so you can gain access to a rare lightsaber crystal option. One is "evil for being evil" the other is "evil to gain something". Sith to me aren't about being evil just so they can go "muahahaha I'm one evil bastard" as in the Sith code located on Page 2 shows it's all about gaining personal power and accepting your emotions.

    This makes alot of sense for, and I hope its true because then I won't be walking around as a Darkpoints Jedi.
    "I'll tell you something, my Tenchi, you know the carnival comes and goes. But if you wait for a while, it'll always come back to you, Tenchi."~Ryoko TENCHIxRYOKO FTW!

    "The crystal is the heart of the blade. The heart is the crystal of the Jedi. The Jedi is the crystal of the Force.
    The Force is the blade of the heart. All are intertwined. The crystal, the blade, the Jedi. You are one.

  16. #56
    Quote Originally Posted by Adeodatus View Post
    This makes alot of sense for, and I hope its true because then I won't be walking around as a Darkpoints Jedi.
    I agree. Makes a lot of sense and fixes up some confusion that some people may have been having. However, The Empire is... Well, Ill just say itll be hard trying -not- to do the dark side things lol.

  17. #57
    Wow, the majority of the posts totally miss the point of the Sith and the Dark Side. The Jedi see the force as power that must be controlled, and eschew all emotion to maintain control of the force. The Sith on the other hand see the force not as something that must be controlled, but as the mechanism for freedom.

    The Sith motto says it best:

    Peace is a lie; there is only passion.
    Through passion, I gain strength.
    Through strength, I gain power.
    Through power, I gain victory.
    Through victory, my chains are broken.
    The Force shall set me free.

    Analyze the first line of the motto: First the Sith absolutely disagree that Peace of any kind can be achieved. The Jedi would disagree.

    There is only passion. The Sith believe that passion achieves goals, lack of passion achieves nothing. Drive, determination, self reliance, dedication are all traits that many people would find laudable goals. Few people, who achieved anything of note, lacked passion.

    Here's to the too long to read example: If a Sith were a movie producer/writer/director, a Sith would practice relentlessly and learn the movie making process, write a screen play or two, hire the best screen writers and maybe steal the best ideas. Ultimately they would subject himself to possible public humiliation (perform in public think American Graffiti), A Sith would build on the success, write another screen play, hire the best agent to get the best deal to get the movie produced. (Kill the agent if he cheats, and fire the agent once the deal is complete) A Sith would hire hookers for the studio executes, hire a private investigator to help black mail the executive and or his family, hit the big movie deal, buy the movie company or create his own. A Sith would create a graphic arts company to make the movies more successful, and do it better so that all successful movie thereafter would use the company or its concepts and technology. A Sith would ruthlessly license and market the characters and their likeness and create a generation of stalkers for the actors to ensure many of the actors never work successfully again. A Sith would sell the rights to the movie to large software companies to make an interactive experience to build on the 30 plus years of brand name recognition. Meanwhile the Sith would not necessarily seek the spot light. He would be quiet behind the scenes, in control but not out front.

    TLTR George Lucas is an example of a Sith. And he probably didn't kill anyone.

    So ask, how does my character become more powerful, how does my character gain more strength, how does my character achieve victory, and how does the force work to help me achieve my goals.

  18. #58
    Quote Originally Posted by Klur View Post
    I never got the whole "Light Side Sith/ Dark Side Jedi" thing. If there's one thing the movies were very clear on it's that the Dark side will consume anyone who dabbles in it.

    I've always kind of viewed it like an addiction. The first time or two that you use it might not be that bad, and you can just walk away never to do it again, but the more you use it the more powerful you become and the harder it becomes to stop.

    I've also never understood the Dark Side= Sith thing either. I get that all Sith are Dark Side users, but that doesn't mean all Dark Side users are SIth. For example, if a Jedi gives into his anger and emotions and starts down the Dark path that doesn't mean he automatically becomes Sith. He has never received the training that comes with joining the Sith. The fallen Jedi is at the whims of his emotions instead of using his anger to fuel his power like the Sith. So I guess it would be something like a Jedi that falls to the Dark Side is like a crack addict, who commits petty crimes to get his fix, while a Sith is more like a steroid user, using the drug to enhance himself. Btw, I'm not saying steroid user's are criminals, just that it's an easy example.

    All that being said, I plan on playing however it makes most sense for whatever class I'm playing. If I'm playing an inquisitor I'm not going to use the brute force options if I can avoid it. And if I play a warrior I'm not gonna be too subtle unless it seems to benefit me most.

    I just hope Bioware doesn't do like they did in KotOR and put in "evil for the sake of being evil" options. As other's have pointed out, playing Sith =/= being a jerk. I hate having to choose "I only help the strong" options when clearly helping the quest giver would benefit my character. And that doesn;t mean I can't do something more evil along the way, like finish the quest, but betray the quest giver at the end.
    When we say "Lightside sith" think starkiller.

    He's no jedi by any stretch of the word, he uses his colossal power to meet his own agenda, which just happens to be helping to save some lives.

  19. #59
    Want to be dark side so just gona think of the most evil things to do

  20. #60
    High Overlord Zachyveng's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anexis View Post
    Want to be dark side so just gona think of the most evil things to do
    A Quote from Darth Bane "As servants of the dark side we revel in the vanquishing of enemies. We draw power from their suffering, but we must balance this against greater gains. We must recognize that killing for sadistic pleasure - killing without reason, need, or purpose - is the act of a fool."

    Woeful basically hit the nail on the head. Sith aren't sadistic murderers killing everything in their path. Hell look at Palpatine, he took over an entire galaxy without having to lift his hand personally against almost anyone (minus 3 terrible Jedi and Mace Windu). That's a perfect example right there.
    Krael, Sith Council of Untold Prophecy

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