Thread: NDA and EA

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  1. #1

    NDA and EA

    I know I might get flamed for this by some people but I have concerns about the game. It's first off an Electronic Arts game which we all know the crap they've pulled over the years. Does anyone else think it's a bit shady that with almost 2 months away from release the NDA still hasn't been dropped? Generally, when a game this big, with this much cost spent in development is close to being released there should be tons of content out there to build hype. They have quite a bit but I'm talking about from players, more than just the shows they've been at. I know they have the name recognition alone but being an old school player I'm hoping this isn't like Galaxies all over again.

    I love Bioware and kotor, I already preordered the special edition digital copy and I'm looking forward to trying it out. I'm not happy with the graphics for a new mmo coming out and it does seem to me they set the bar at WoW and that's about it. I think the companion system is brilliant though and is going to bring something new to the genre. I just can't help in the back of my mind be worried this could end up being a huge letdown.

    Does anyone else feel the same here? I know there's a massive following for the game and there will be many that blindly defend it but I can't be the only one thinking this.

  2. #2
    Scarab Lord Trollsbane's Avatar
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    I can understand some concern, but I'll continue to trust Bioware (not EA) to make the right choices.

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  3. #3
    If you're so worried about what horrible shit the NDA is hiding, then just go to a site/forum that are freely talking about the game, NDA or not, and see for yourself.

    It's not a giant cover up conspiracy with EA in their meeting room in dim lights saying "2 more months, keep the NDA up so that those people will still buy our game before they realize how horrible it is mwahahahaha." They're inviting random people by the hundreds to beta.
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  4. #4
    the casual player judges games on graphics alone most of the time.

    they are worried about sales being turned away for that reason,but honestly if you judge a game on graphics alone then you are missing out. enjoy your yearly release of Call of Dollar$: Bro ops 9

    Truthfully for a mmo this game looks amazing, i hope people arn't expecting it to be looking like BF3. MMOs by nature need to be a little behind. You need a player base for a mmo to succeed, and if you need a 2000 dollar computer which, casuals do not own, to play it, you will not have players and a dead game.
    Last edited by Tiffaa; 2011-10-10 at 03:17 AM.

  5. #5
    High Overlord Zachyveng's Avatar
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    I think one of the main reasons the NDA is still in place is because it IS a story driven MMO, Bioware is known for telling badass stories. They don't want to spoil the story experience that would come about by getting rid of the NDA. All the big facts are out there. They've shown us Flashpoints, PvP, Operations, Low level origin worlds, we know it's a hot key style MMO, we know it's got the trinity. That's really all we need to know before it starts to get into spoilers etc.
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  6. #6
    Fluffy Kitten conscript's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ashgar View Post
    Does anyone else feel the same here? I know there's a massive following for the game and there will be many that blindly defend it but I can't be the only one thinking this.
    I think you are assuming EA has far more influence on this game than they really do. from everything I have seen EA looks like nothing more than the money man and distributor. They seem to have very, very little influence on the game itself. The continued NDA is concerning, but just because it keeps people from learning about the game, not necessarily because it keep them from seeing that the game is terrible. I'm not sure what they hope to gain by continuing to carry the NDA, except to protect the story, but I could see where it has people concerned.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Tiffaa View Post
    the casual player judges games on graphics alone most of the time.

    they are worried about sales being turned away for that reason,but honestly if you judge a game on graphics alone then you are missing out. enjoy your yearly release of Call of Dollar$: Bro ops 9

    Truthfully for a mmo this game looks amazing, i hope people arn't expecting it to be looking like BF3. MMOs by nature need to be a little behind. You need a player base for a mmo to succeed, and if you need a 2000 dollar computer which, casuals do not own, to play it, you will not have players and a dead game.
    I find it rather strange that you think the NDA is up because Bioware is afraid the graphics are going to turn people off.

    *Firstly, the "graphics" of the game has been showcased as many times as the game itself, they aren't embarrassed of their graphics.
    *Secondly, the graphics are excellent. Just because it doesn't follow the realistic Asian uncanny valley approach that everyone seems to have a hard on for some reason doesn't mean that it's bad.
    Last edited by vizzle; 2011-10-10 at 03:41 AM.
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  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Tiffaa View Post
    the casual player judges games on graphics alone most of the time.

    they are worried about sales being turned away for that reason,but honestly if you judge a game on graphics alone then you are missing out. enjoy your yearly release of Call of Dollar$: Bro ops 9

    Truthfully for a mmo this game looks amazing, i hope people arn't expecting it to be looking like BF3. MMOs by nature need to be a little behind. You need a player base for a mmo to succeed, and if you need a 2000 dollar computer which, casuals do not own, to play it, you will not have players and a dead game.
    I'm not a casual gamer, I played WoW for 6 years, DAoC and EQ before that for 3 more. I was a guild/raid leader in multiple top end guilds in WoW. Graphics was more of a sidebar concern. I'd like a game to look good is all, especially for the money spent in production value it's disappointing to see something that looks like it could have came out a decade ago.

    When you have played several mmo's you look to a new one to break the mold like WoW did when it came out. It definitely wasn't original then as it stole a lot from EQ before it. Many big names in video game, movie and music industry have pulled shit where they didn't let a wide number of people play/watch/listen to something new to hide any negative comments. Star Wars Galaxies was a huge letdown for it's time as there was a ridiculous amount of hype then when it came out and it never achieved to great success.

    I know it's different with the current generation and because WoW opened up so many into the MMO's, I just want this to be a great game is all. No offense to anyone, just had some concerns was all.

  9. #9
    Bioware has a good record of making money and that is why EA probably bought them. To that end, I bet EA doesn't want to screw anything up by interfering with something as costly(time and money) as SWTOR. Also, by staying tight lipped as long as possible it gives their launch a bigger bang.

    SWTOR is something I will buy even if I don't play it long because I'm a fan of MMO's and I will always support quality products. In case that is confusing, what I mean is, I don't have the time I once did to put into video games but when a good product comes out I will usually buy it anyway in support of the rank and file men and women who poured countless hours into building it.
    Last edited by FlooPowder; 2011-10-10 at 03:54 AM.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by conscript View Post
    I think you are assuming EA has far more influence on this game than they really do. from everything I have seen EA looks like nothing more than the money man and distributor. They seem to have very, very little influence on the game itself. The continued NDA is concerning, but just because it keeps people from learning about the game, not necessarily because it keep them from seeing that the game is terrible. I'm not sure what they hope to gain by continuing to carry the NDA, except to protect the story, but I could see where it has people concerned.
    I know Bioware has the freedom to run with this game but being under EA still has some influence by them. Same for Activision with WoW where they will try to push them to release something sooner than later. Sony did the same with Verant back with Galaxies that hurt it a great deal. Given EA's track record I wouldn't doubt if they were pressuring this to be released sooner than Bioware wanted.

    It's a good point though about them wanting to keep the NDA up because it is a story driven game. I didn't think about that.

  11. #11
    yeah I believe they keep the NDA up for the story partly too, so people don't just read it online then go ingame and skip the cutscenes to rush to end game to get shiny loot instead of enjoying the game.

    Also its probably because they are constantly tuning and adding stuff still, and don't want people to hear about unfinished parts and not want to buy the game. If you ever spent time on the official forums, people through a shitstorm over ANYTHING, like the inquisiter getting beaten by a smuggler in one shot in the smuggler's AC vid. They get rabid over, jumping to conclusions with no info. If you watch the dev tracker, at least twice a week you see someone spouting something as pure hard fact, and a dev goes in there and tells them they have it opposite or their idea is completely absurd.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Ashgar View Post
    I know I might get flamed for this by some people but I have concerns about the game. It's first off an Electronic Arts game which we all know the crap they've pulled over the years. Does anyone else think it's a bit shady that with almost 2 months away from release the NDA still hasn't been dropped? Generally, when a game this big, with this much cost spent in development is close to being released there should be tons of content out there to build hype. They have quite a bit but I'm talking about from players, more than just the shows they've been at. I know they have the name recognition alone but being an old school player I'm hoping this isn't like Galaxies all over again.

    I love Bioware and kotor, I already preordered the special edition digital copy and I'm looking forward to trying it out. I'm not happy with the graphics for a new mmo coming out and it does seem to me they set the bar at WoW and that's about it. I think the companion system is brilliant though and is going to bring something new to the genre. I just can't help in the back of my mind be worried this could end up being a huge letdown.

    Does anyone else feel the same here? I know there's a massive following for the game and there will be many that blindly defend it but I can't be the only one thinking this.
    I almost completely agree.

    The NDA is rediculous it's hard to weed out what is fanboy spewing and what are legitimate good features.

    Without being lucky enough to ever get in a beta I am so far still going blind on how the game will actually be because NDA stops any legitimate gripes or compliments to be backed up by anything real.

    I'm still looking forward to the game but with a restrictive NDA any information I do hear leaked or is granted to us always has a heavy bias. Of coarse the company is not gonna down-talk their own game and people who made 10000 accounts to get in beta are pretty set in their opinion.

    I wish Bioware would actually just let people know about the game rather then the random few they granted the gift of beta to.
    Last edited by Argroth; 2011-10-10 at 04:37 AM.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Ashgar View Post
    I know I might get flamed for this by some people but I have concerns about the game. It's first off an Electronic Arts game which we all know the crap they've pulled over the years. Does anyone else think it's a bit shady that with almost 2 months away from release the NDA still hasn't been dropped? Generally, when a game this big, with this much cost spent in development is close to being released there should be tons of content out there to build hype. They have quite a bit but I'm talking about from players, more than just the shows they've been at. I know they have the name recognition alone but being an old school player I'm hoping this isn't like Galaxies all over again.

    I love Bioware and kotor, I already preordered the special edition digital copy and I'm looking forward to trying it out. I'm not happy with the graphics for a new mmo coming out and it does seem to me they set the bar at WoW and that's about it. I think the companion system is brilliant though and is going to bring something new to the genre. I just can't help in the back of my mind be worried this could end up being a huge letdown.

    Does anyone else feel the same here? I know there's a massive following for the game and there will be many that blindly defend it but I can't be the only one thinking this.
    the graphics were done so any computer can run it. I ran it on my brothers computer who has a 9800 pro video card and it ran very smooth. I think for the years put into this game it's a pretty big disappointment. with buddies it'll be fun though

  14. #14
    As a personal gripe with this ongoing NDA

    As a personal example: very little info has been said about how companion customization will work. Giving them old gear is fairly self explanatory for the most part but what about companions that don't wear gear like Bowdaar or Blizz? Then what about the appearance kits that are typically mentioned in passing? How many do you start with? will you be restricted with a blue Vette until level 45 then all of a sudden I will get the choice of red after most of the story has passed? or will I have red from the start? what about green? Not exactly game breaking stuff but its something restricted by NDA but would influence my opinion on the game greatly.

    With a lot of the info leaked (still not easy to find or weed out BS) and a large chunk unimportant to protect so close to release the NDA just gets more ridiculous and frankly insulting by the day. Going into the game blind or deluded by company promises and fanboy hype is not advisable but they are not giving much at this time.

  15. #15
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    What I am concerned about is that while in the case of WoW, Blizzard has buckets of experience in the multi-player realm thanks to battle.net and the fact most Blizzard games since Warcraft 2 had multiplayer in it, Bioware has 0 of this.

    Almost all their games have no multiplayer aspect whatsoever. This tells me they do not have a great experience in anything multi-player related like network technologies, balancing classes etc. They can leverage on the experience of Mythic but saying that EA has no effect on Bioware is wishful thinking: They have! Or did you miss the fact that "Bioware" in EA is also the name for the whole RPG section, so including Mythic entertainment for one and the remnant of Origin?

    The NDA being still in effect is quite shocking to be honest. I know they are not Blizzard (WoW NDA fell off 6 months before release. Diablo 3 NDA is already gone, even if the game has just been delayed to next year) but if there is one other company I trust to do things right is Bioware. So benefits of the doubt, they do have, but my concern on EA, Origin and other corporate shenanigans is still present.

  16. #16
    I'm glad the NDA is still up. Don't have to worry about random story spoilers.

    SO, yeah.. Keep it up until the end. What's been released officially is more than enough for people to know if they want to try it or not.

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by lcarnegie View Post
    the graphics were done so any computer can run it. I ran it on my brothers computer who has a 9800 pro video card and it ran very smooth. I think for the years put into this game it's a pretty big disappointment. with buddies it'll be fun though
    I understand that, Blizzard has always done that so it caters to most anyone with a computer 6 years old to one brand spanking new. When you look at games like Guild Wars 2, Tera Online though these games blow ToR's graphics away and will also be able to be scaled down to run on older computers. As I said the graphics is more of a sidebar issue with me as I like to have a game that just blows me away with more than just gameplay. It's not too much to ask with a AAA game like ToR to have put more work into it. It seems like they settled on the engine several years ago in development and it's disappointing when you look at other MMO's coming out in the near future.

    I'll be more than happy to eat my words if the gameplay is just amazing. I'll be very content but it's just wishful thinking is all.

  18. #18
    Mechagnome Gritalian's Avatar
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    They are entering a market that has basically been dominated by one developer... I mean, we're talking Michael Jordan domination. How many games have we seen come out with even a relative amount of hype and get its subscriptions cut drastically after the free month ended? Hell, I'll just name the one's I've quit: SWG, Lotro, City of Heroes/Villains, Age of Conan, Eve, Aion, Warhammer Online, Rift, Forsaken World, and there is probably more that I can't even remember.

    So why would Bioware decide to keep an NDA at this point?
    For one, the limit news in itself creates hype when news is eventually released.
    Second, it's Star Wars... it already has its own enormous fan base.
    Third, it's Bioware, which many people who play games consider being one of the gold standards as far as story, character development, relationships... three things that mean a lot in the world of mmos.
    Fourth, most people who gravitate towards playing MMOs purchase every "big" MMO, any way

    So they have these four things going for them, among many others... why exactly would they show their cards when releasing a product that rivals a game that has probably the biggest video game population there is? They are going to get their sales, it's pretty much given based on the number of preorders they projected. Those who don't buy it right on release will have friends who do buy it, word of mouth is likely to be high. Realistically, the people who don't buy this game (our of the WoW population) are going to be the ones who can't afford two $15 monthly subscriptions, or those who just don't have enough time in their week to work on two different characters in two different games aka the people who raid/pvp casually on the weekend and are currently 4/7 regular. Nothing against those people, but more than likely they don't have the time resource to manage playing two MMOs.

    The possible gain due from releasing mass amounts of news content now is probably too small in terms of affecting sales and would only give the edge to their well established competitor (Blizzard) who has been known to do things like releasing patches during other games release dates or sending out mass amounts of beta invites during early access for preorders (like they did with the WOTLK Beta when Warhammer Online early access went live).

  19. #19
    The Lightbringer Istaril's Avatar
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    When you have played several mmo's you look to a new one to break the mold like WoW did when it came out
    What?

    WoW wasn't unique or innovative in any bloody way. WoW is to Everquest, what Rift is to WoW. A copy in a different universe, with very minor changes.

  20. #20
    If you have questions, just go to. No one there cares about the NDA.

    Ya but we do, so please do not post any NDA breaking information or NDA breaking websites.
    Last edited by conscript; 2011-10-10 at 01:45 PM.

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