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  1. #141
    Quote Originally Posted by MoeMm View Post
    I haven't really paid attention to minmaxin and "fixing dps" lately but I got a couple tips you may or may not find useful.

    Depending on your situation with money I think you should get the best enchants and gems for at least the BiS gear you got (cloak, 50crit -> 65crit enchant and 40str -> 50str gem). Sounds like a small upgrade but it adds up. If you got the justice points you should get Gauntlets of the Molten Giant for 2p set bonus which is a nice dps boost. Then get +50 str enchant on them.

    Best enchants and gems for at least the best items does wonders.

    Also, try macroing Inner Rage with your Heroic Strike and you should get a hang of it. Something like
    #showtooltip ((Inner Rage or Heroic Stike))
    /cast Inner Rage
    /cast Heroic Strike

    I'm not sure how that works as I don't usually create my macros myself :P

    Hope this helped?
    Yeah, I got the gloves for the 2pt now, but I'm only using it for pot/shout pre-pull. Do you think it's best to just equip it all the fight?
    Will try getting the 65 crit, but right now red epic gems on my realm run for 3~5k, kinda expensive for me right now.

    Thanks for your help!

  2. #142
    The Patient Sikkbass's Avatar
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    Starting to slowly get a hold of arms now, anyone care to comment on anything I may not be doing

    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/h...=17030&e=17786

  3. #143
    http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...erstyle/simple

    What should my DPS be with current gear, or even, what should I fix to improve dps?
    Had 34-35k on Ultraxion 25LFR, without clicking heroic will.

    edit:
    Just noticed the spec, don't care about it, it's not what I use normally.
    Last edited by nagina; 2012-01-16 at 09:46 AM.

  4. #144
    Hi Wondering if anyone could point me in the right direction. I have been building a fury spec and slowly progressing through dungs now getting the gear i require however,i still only manage to pull of 10-15k dps (top end with cd's) which i feel i should be pulling alot more.

    Heres my link; http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...asmundo/simple

    besides the obvious missing enchants and lame gear here and there, what do you guys think?

    ----------Mozzage - Laughing Skull EU - Symbiosis----------

  5. #145
    Quote Originally Posted by Mozza View Post
    Hi Wondering if anyone could point me in the right direction. I have been building a fury spec and slowly progressing through dungs now getting the gear i require however,i still only manage to pull of 10-15k dps (top end with cd's) which i feel i should be pulling alot more.

    Heres my link; http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...asmundo/simple

    besides the obvious missing enchants and lame gear here and there, what do you guys think?
    Well besides the lame gear and lack of enchants, which is the biggest issue, your hit is pretty low and you have 4 expertise too much. Get hit up to 12% at least, jp trinket comes to mind, fix enchants on the 378 stuff you have and get a better weapon. Until you get a new weapon and fix some stuff you will hit like a wet noodle.

    I feel arms is better this patch so you might want to try that out, but just fix the gear first it really helps

  6. #146
    I) Can someone explain me one thing that bothers me for a month already. How is it possible to deal less damage in higher gear on certain boss? It drives me mad.

    22-12 ~44.8k (~389 ilvl, 2t13_384)

    /reports/rt-b3bpn2zdim0ji7wp/sum/damageDone/?s=13245&e=13597#Аргентум

    16-01 ~40.4k (395 ilvl 4t13_397/384) < /wow/en/character/thermaplugg/Аргентум/advanced

    /reports/rt-yesvuwqtt6ik43ct/sum/damageDone/?s=2451&e=2755#Аргентум

    Since 22/12/2011 (after those 44.8k) I saw a huge drop (39k) and very slowly over weeks managed to pull up to 40.4k.

    I seriously doubt that overall fight duration reduce is the problem. Boss dies faster = higher Bloodlust uptime.
    (2nd recklessness and Deadly Calm also should not result in minus 7k dps pre-execute phase).

    II) What also bothers me is LFR Ultraxion. DPS variety is crazy, from 42k w/o golem's blood/Flask/Food to 38k with everything. (all raid buffs are present).

    III) And third - any ideas about heroic strikes as 2nd/3rd ranked damage ability in most top logs?

    /reports/rt-1n979gtk4omtdsi1/sum/damageDone/?s=6725&e=7004

    for example. All my attempts to fit 4 heroics in one CS (2t13 obv) only results in rage starvation. (Maybe excluding 5+ minute of Ultraxions Twilight Instability).

    p.s. If anyone will show me how to auto-translate uploaded WoL log to English (to show English ability's name in WoL Damage Done tab) I will appreciate that.
    p.s.s. Rotation used in December log: MS > CS > (S/OP - S/OP - MS ... ) -- clipping MS all the way.
    Rotation used in Last log: MS > 0.5s > CS > (S/OP - MS - S/OP ... ) -- no clipping MS.
    Last edited by Arqentum; 2012-01-21 at 10:04 AM.

  7. #147
    Fluffy Kitten Lohe's Avatar
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    Going to try to cover everything on this page that wasn't answered yet.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sikkbass View Post
    Starting to slowly get a hold of arms now, anyone care to comment on anything I may not be doing

    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/h...=17030&e=17786
    Madness is not really an ideal fight to analyze in terms of dos and don'ts but I'll do what I can.
    Sweeping Strikes can be put to much better use imo. While it is a good idea to use it for the blood on the early platforms it is just really a convenience, with that setup you should have absolutely no problem to kill the bloods without using SS. Because of that I suggest that you use it while killing Blistering Tentacles once the red platform has been dealt with. While you can't AoE the blisters you can still use Sweeping Strikes to hit the arm/wing while killing the blisters.

    Cleaving two targets is typically not worth it, at least not if specced for 3/3 incite and/or you have the 2t13 bonus.

    I am 95% sure that you could have used Colossus Smash a lot more than you did.

    Berserker Rage use looks pretty good, could see slight improvement. Inner Rage could be used a lot more.

    While you clearly use your Blood Fury and Deadly Calm together your Synapse Springs doesn't really line up with anything (not even the first time you pop CDs) so try to get something going there.

    Again, hard to analyze based on this type of fight but if you have something that is more of a "stand still and nuke with no target swaps" kind of logs I can have a go at that instead, Ultraxion or Normal mode Zon'ozz would be the best candidates, or Baleroc if you still do FL.

    Quote Originally Posted by nagina View Post
    http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...erstyle/simple

    What should my DPS be with current gear, or even, what should I fix to improve dps?
    Had 34-35k on Ultraxion 25LFR, without clicking heroic will.
    35k (36k in theory) is about what you should be doing assuming you do not stance dance.
    If you normally have a spec with Tactical Mastery and utilize stance dance then 37.8k is the theoretical average.
    This is without external rage regen, on Ultraxion it should be higher, especially since you're not using Heroic Will.
    Regarding your glyphs, if you want to use the Bladestorm glyph replace Slam, not OP.
    Things that can be done to improve dps includes fixing a proper shoulder enchant and using 3 JC gems instead of 2.
    Reforges can be very slightly improved, have a look at http://wowreforge.com

    Quote Originally Posted by Arqentum View Post
    I) Can someone explain me one thing that bothers me for a month already. How is it possible to deal less damage in higher gear on certain boss? It drives me mad.
    One thing that people seem to forget is that simply because Arms has a very stable rotation with little randomness to it that doesn't mean that the spec itself is not subject to big swings in dps because of rng, especially considering gurthalak and the 4p bonus. In fact, in your gear, the difference between the highest simmed dps value and the lowest simmed dps value is 11k dps, that's a lot.

    It is fairly difficult for me to do a good log analysis when it's all in russian unless I hover the name of each ability. Keep in mind that it could just be RNG swing but the first thing to do is to make sure you have the same buffs and debuffs available in both these fights. Don't assume that because X class/spec is there the buff/debuff is provided, make SURE it is.

    Second, I'm just doing a very brief check now but crit% is a lot different in the two logs. In the first your Slam crit is ~35%, Op crit is 82%, execute is 41%. In the second log the crit for Slam is 24%, Op crit is 68%, execute is 36%. Just there is a huge difference. (MS/HS crit was equal in case you were wondering)

    In the first log your Colossus Smash uptime is 46%, in the second the uptime is 35% (and that's with the 4p bonus).

    Quote Originally Posted by Arqentum View Post
    II) What also bothers me is LFR Ultraxion. DPS variety is crazy, from 42k w/o golem's blood/Flask/Food to 38k with everything. (all raid buffs are present).
    Rng is a fickle creature, without more to go on that's really all I can say here.

    Quote Originally Posted by Arqentum View Post
    III) And third - any ideas about heroic strikes as 2nd/3rd ranked damage ability in most top logs?
    Sometimes it is because that's just how their rage played out that time. Sometimes it is because people mistakenly think that it is a good idea to prioritize HS over Slam just because Inner Rage is active. This is wrong, although the loss is very small in terms of dps it changes the damage breakdown a lot. You use HS as much as your rage allows, don't rage starve yourself trying to reach some arbitrary amount of uses

    Quote Originally Posted by Arqentum View Post
    p.s. If anyone will show me how to auto-translate uploaded WoL log to English (to show English ability's name in WoL Damage Done tab) I will appreciate that.
    I don't know how, or if it is even possible, but if you figure out an answer I'd love for you to share it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Arqentum View Post
    p.s.s. Rotation used in December log: MS > CS > (S/OP - S/OP - MS ... ) -- clipping MS all the way.
    Rotation used in Last log: MS > 0.5s > CS > (S/OP - MS - S/OP ... ) -- no clipping MS.
    Neither of these are a good idea. The first is just not good in anyway, I'm not sure what the benefit is supposed to be here. I understand the reasoning behind the second, and I looked into it a lot myself, but while it is a theoretical dps gain (at least without 4t13) it won't be a gain in practice, you just won't be able to pull it off good enough, no one can.

    Stick to MS > filler > filler, repeat.

    Hopefully this helps you somewhat, I would like to do more but the russian logs make more in-depth stuff difficult.

  8. #148
    Quote Originally Posted by Lohe View Post

    Thanks for reply.

    Neither of these are a good idea. The first is just not good in anyway, I'm not sure what the benefit is supposed to be here. I understand the reasoning behind the second, and I looked into it a lot myself, but while it is a theoretical dps gain (at least without 4t13) it won't be a gain in practice, you just won't be able to pull it off good enough, no one can.

    Stick to MS > filler > filler, repeat.
    If you saw Landsoul's Compendium Teaser - Fury Advanced Profile Execute Rotation

    /watch?feature=player_detailpage&list=UU76upl_3OnaZz3h4gxIXiSQ&v=6OWoxXTB7i4#t=179s

    Than you would probably know that it IS possible to fit 4 abilities in CS frame.

    This

    CS > (MS > filler > filler) > [0.5s MS cooldown] > MS

    And my

    MS > 0.5s > CS > ( Slam/OP > MS > Slam > OP) > 0.5s > MS

    is equal in terms of MS usage over time.
    Due to latency and human reaction I loose up to 0.4s (at maximum, usually 0.15s) of MS cooldown, compared to 1s MS clip with

    CS > ( Slam/OP > Slam/OP > MS > OP)

    Honestly this is one more question that drives me mad.

    IV) How is it possible to deal more damage with 3 abilities/CS vs. 4 abilities/CS?
    How CS refreshing (4t13 proc) in CS > (MS ...) scenario can be better than my rotation?

  9. #149
    Arqentum just looking at the graphs of the 44k and the 40k log. In the 44k log you spike upto 56k dps with your second deadlycalm+blood fury, your 40k log is missing a bloodfury and deadly calm there and even dropping to 24-25k dps. Aside from some lucky/unlucky rng I think that's the biggest issue. One other thing is stancedancing you're in battle stance most of the time missing ~3% from that.

    At first I also thought the second log was missing 10% CS uptime but WoL shows the 4p proc separately so its the same. Maybe if your combatlog was in English instead of Russian(in game setting maybe?) the WoL would be English as well just guessing here but it would make it a lot more readable.
    Last edited by bigbad; 2012-01-21 at 03:35 PM.

  10. #150
    Quote Originally Posted by bigbad View Post
    Arqentum just looking at the graphs of the 44k and the 40k log. In the 44k log you spike upto 56k dps with your second deadlycalm+blood fury, your 40k log is missing a bloodfury and deadly calm there and even dropping to 24-25k dps. Aside from some lucky/unlucky rng I think that's the biggest issue.
    Well ... maybe this is it. Thanks.

    Quote Originally Posted by bigbad View Post
    One other thing is stancedancing you're in battle stance most of the time missing ~3% from that.
    Due several circumstances I cannot proper stancedance (latency and fps).

    Quote Originally Posted by bigbad View Post
    English instead of Russian(in game setting maybe?) the WoL would be English as well just guessing here but it would make it a lot more readable.
    I Really would like it be a "in-game setting", seriously. I hate localization (and ru-realms to be honest as a whole).
    Sadly it is impossible to translate uploaded log neither (TBD feature) on-site
    (spell names are hard-coded (just taken from CombatLog.txt with propper ID))
    nor by client (blizzard doesnt want ruRU players playing with enGB client (racism as it is)).

    I will translate all future logs (and share script (just "Replace" russian name > english name) but it will work only with non-uploaded logs.

  11. #151
    Opening the gameclient then, before pressing play and entering your password, options>game preferences the language option is on the bottom left. Mine says English(eu) I guess yours is on Russian? Nvm think you tried that already reading the part of your post about the client.
    Last edited by bigbad; 2012-01-21 at 05:35 PM.

  12. #152
    Fluffy Kitten Lohe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arqentum View Post
    If you saw Landsoul's Compendium Teaser - Fury Advanced Profile Execute Rotation

    Than you would probably know that it IS possible to fit 4 abilities in CS frame.
    Ah, ok, in that case I see what it is you want to do. I thought you were talking about a general rotation, not specific to CS being up.
    I don't think you'd want to do it by just adding a gap between abilities though. In that case it would be better to do it like the first example, putting one extra ability between the two MSs so that it is off cooldown and allowed to be queued but still not losing any dps time. Are you sure you actually get the four abilities in the CS window though? Typically stance dancing requires low latency and if part of the reason you don't stance dance is because of that then it doesn't seem like you'd be able to do the CS thing either.

    Quote Originally Posted by Arqentum View Post
    IV) How is it possible to deal more damage with 3 abilities/CS vs. 4 abilities/CS?
    How CS refreshing (4t13 proc) in CS > (MS ...) scenario can be better than my rotation?
    If you're just looking at a particular CS window then obviously it would be better to fit 4 abilites per CS rather than 3 but the fight is also so much longer than that. Delaying MS has more implications than just a bit of damage right then and there since it also affects Enrage uptime as well as amount of 4t13 procs. Especially if your latency is not good enough to pull it off reliably, in that case you lost something without gaining anything.

    If you want to delay MS by one global because you know you will fit 4 abilities within one CS then go ahead and do that. Just don't delay MS more than that because 4t13 might proc, because most of the time it won't.

    Quote Originally Posted by bigbad View Post
    At first I also thought the second log was missing 10% CS uptime but WoL shows the 4p proc separately so its the same.
    You're right, that was my mistake. This is what I meant when I said that it is hard to do a good analysis when the log is in Russian, it is easy to miss things.

  13. #153
    Quote Originally Posted by Lohe View Post
    If you want to delay MS by one global because you know you will fit 4 abilities within one CS then go ahead and do that. Just don't delay MS more than that because 4t13 might proc, because most of the time it won't.
    That's why I changed

    MS > CS > (S/OP > S/OP > MS > OP) to
    MS > 0.5 > (....)

    not to delay MS and gain more Enrage uptime, Battle Trance procs. (I really dont know about math behind it, as you said delaying MS is very tricky)

    Four abilities per CS in not always working but it works most of the time. For example I messed up only at very first CS:

    /watch?v=0fNDfhG5JoE&feature=player_detailpage#t=0s


    Quote Originally Posted by Lohe View Post
    Are you sure you actually get the four abilities in the CS window though? Typically stance dancing requires low latency and if part of the reason you don't stance dance is because of that then it doesn't seem like you'd be able to do the CS thing either.
    Especially if your latency is not good enough to pull it off reliably, in that case you lost something without gaining anything.
    Yes, this is it. Easy (somewhat) to fit four abilities, but terrible with stance dance. (Custom Lag Tolerance =\ )

  14. #154
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    Hey guys. Can you take a look at my fury warrior? Are there anything bad with the gemming / reforging?
    http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...atimo/advanced

    I know that I have 2 unenchanted items, but I working on that part.
    Anyway.. I feel my dps sucks with that gear. In a heroic group with guildies, (old heroics, without the pug buff) I have problem push 20k on bosses. usualy it stop at 17-19k dps. but in a pug group I can push over 30k in the "new" heroics

    My priority list is:
    BT - CS - Berserker rage if im not berserked - Raging Blow - Slam if Bloodsuge procs
    So rotation would be like this:
    BT-CS-BT - Berserker range - RB-BT-Slam if bloodsurge proc.

    And a question: What should I use if everything are on cd and bloodsuge wont proc? Wait for BT, or Heroic Strike? (Noob question yes, but I havnt taken this char seriously before now )[COLOR="red"]
    Last edited by Nazomi; 2012-01-23 at 09:36 AM.

  15. #155
    Quote Originally Posted by Nazomi View Post
    And a question: What should I use if everything are on cd and bloodsuge wont proc? Wait for BT, or Heroic Strike? (Noob question yes, but I havnt taken this char seriously before now )[COLOR="red"]
    Battleshout or wait for BT. I hope you know that heroic strike is not on the gcd and should be used to prevent capping rage it shouldn't be just used in the free gcd. Are you using deadwish & recklessness and getting 2 CSs inside a deadwish? Should be easy to get more then 20k dps on short bossfights.

  16. #156
    Quote Originally Posted by Nazomi View Post
    Hey guys. Can you take a look at my fury warrior? Are there anything bad with the gemming / reforging?
    http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...atimo/advanced

    I know that I have 2 unenchanted items, but I working on that part.
    Anyway.. I feel my dps sucks with that gear. In a heroic group with guildies, (old heroics, without the pug buff) I have problem push 20k on bosses. usualy it stop at 17-19k dps. but in a pug group I can push over 30k in the "new" heroics

    My priority list is:
    BT - CS - Berserker rage if im not berserked - Raging Blow - Slam if Bloodsuge procs
    So rotation would be like this:
    BT-CS-BT - Berserker range - RB-BT-Slam if bloodsurge proc.

    And a question: What should I use if everything are on cd and bloodsuge wont proc? Wait for BT, or Heroic Strike? (Noob question yes, but I havnt taken this char seriously before now )[COLOR="red"]
    1) You're missing one Major glyph I'd suggest using Heroic Throw to stack Sunders faster or Death Wish.
    2) You're reforging Hit which is a far more superior stat that mastery as a Fury Warrior for your the current gear you have.
    3) If that's your reforging for Arms your reforging is ok you still need to remove your reforge from your necklace to get Exp capped.

    If you are talking boss fights and assuming you are using Death Wish at start you don't need to use Berserker Rage unless you are not enraged. And you could use Heroic Strike if you have enough rage.

    That's all I can think of as far as reforging goes you currently have.
    Last edited by Kirinya; 2012-01-24 at 09:23 PM.

  17. #157
    High Overlord Hybridpsycho's Avatar
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    Okey, I am curious as to why this is happening for me. What I know and what I've read on here, if one can time double OP's properly without losing DPS on focusing on them it is a DPS increase.

    However, when I'm trying to learn how to get the double OP's off properly (the timer is basically automatic for me now and I know exactly when to do it) it always seems like Mortal Strike comes of Cooldown right when I'm suposed to pop the 2nd OP. Meaning I lose a GCD on Mortal Strike everytime resulting in an overall loss of DPS.

    Has anyone else encountered this before or could tell me what I'm possibly doing wrong, if logs are needed for it I guess I could post em later. Is it actually still worth doing Double OP's? The math makes sense, since it reduces the times I have to swap stance by half.

    Thanks in advance for any feedback/advice.
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  18. #158
    Fluffy Kitten Lohe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arqentum View Post
    That's why I changed

    MS > CS > (S/OP > S/OP > MS > OP) to
    MS > 0.5 > (....)

    not to delay MS and gain more Enrage uptime, Battle Trance procs. (I really dont know about math behind it, as you said delaying MS is very tricky)

    Four abilities per CS in not always working but it works most of the time. For example I messed up only at very first CS:
    I'm sorry I didn't respond earlier, I didn't want to make some half assed response here and I've been too busy to take the time needed.
    I can't sim this in simcraft because I don't know how or if it's even possible (don't think it is) so I had to do basic calculations myself instead.
    As far as I can tell the best choice is to do the one where you delay your actions a bit after MS, this results in a slight gain over the other two choices. With a 0.5 second delay you have to pull it off more than half the time which you clearly do. The gain gets bigger if you can delay MS less than 0.5 seconds and still pull it off.

    I'm clearly going to have to work on doing this myself now ^^

    Quote Originally Posted by Hybridpsycho View Post
    Okey, I am curious as to why this is happening for me. What I know and what I've read on here, if one can time double OP's properly without losing DPS on focusing on them it is a DPS increase.

    However, when I'm trying to learn how to get the double OP's off properly (the timer is basically automatic for me now and I know exactly when to do it) it always seems like Mortal Strike comes of Cooldown right when I'm suposed to pop the 2nd OP. Meaning I lose a GCD on Mortal Strike everytime resulting in an overall loss of DPS.

    Has anyone else encountered this before or could tell me what I'm possibly doing wrong, if logs are needed for it I guess I could post em later. Is it actually still worth doing Double OP's? The math makes sense, since it reduces the times I have to swap stance by half.

    Thanks in advance for any feedback/advice.
    You don't want to line up double OPs on purpose, just use them if it happens, there is no great advantage to them. In fact it can actually be a disadvantage because the longer you stay in Battle Stance the greater the chance that you get a melee swing during that time and that melee swing wouldn't benefit from being in Berserker Stance.

  19. #159
    High Overlord Hybridpsycho's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lohe View Post
    You don't want to line up double OPs on purpose, just use them if it happens, there is no great advantage to them. In fact it can actually be a disadvantage because the longer you stay in Battle Stance the greater the chance that you get a melee swing during that time and that melee swing wouldn't benefit from being in Berserker Stance.
    It does make sense and thanks for the response.
    Like dragons they fly, glory upon wings. Like dragons they savage, fearsome pretty things.

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  20. #160
    http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...onsmoke/simple

    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/r...um/damageDone/

    I usually open up with Battle Shout, Charge, Beserker Rage, and then Rend.

    Then it's CS > MS > OP > Slam when everything else is on CD.

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