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  1. #21
    Epic! Demetrion's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by T Man View Post
    Thanks for the reply, The only point I did need help on was haste cap and then to mastery.

    Get 17% hit >> 2589 haste >> Mastery

    http://elitistjerks.com/f77/t124358-...e_4_2_updated/
    Taken from EJ
    Vampiric Touch
    Without Dark Intent
    With Dark Intent

    Extra Ticks % Rating Goblin Extra Ticks % Rating Goblin
    1 1.7% 218 90 1 0% 0 0
    2 20.2% 2589 2437 2 16.7% 2141 1993
    3 38.7% 4951 4776 3 34.6% 4431 4264
    4 57.2% 7326 7127 4 52.6% 6740 6546
    5 75.7% 9698 9476 5 70.6% 9043 8827
    Devouring Plague
    Without Dark Intent
    With Dark Intent

    Extra Ticks % Rating Goblin Extra Ticks % Rating Goblin
    1 0% 0 0 1 0% 0 0
    2 9.8% 1255 1115 2 6.6% 845 710
    3 21.4% 2737 2583 3 17.8% 2284 2135
    4 32.9% 4220 4051 4 29.1% 3724 3560
    5 44.4% 5691 5508 5 40.2% 5152 4975
    6 56.1% 7179 6981 6 51.5% 6597 6405

    What is the benefit from stacking more haste after 2589 if you can not reach 2737? Or should you reforge that extra haste into mastery until you can get to 2737?

    Thanks again for the advice, I think my biggest problem was casting MF after the 3rd tick and not the 2nd.
    I'm not having any difficulties with my DPS, but was wondering the same. I'm currently sitting at 2867 haste rating (which brings me to 32%+ in shadow form without DI), and was wondering should I drop some haste and stack more mastery (got 722 mastery rating).

    Thanks in advance.

  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Beavers View Post
    Hey Ariadne mind checking over a few things with me.

    Do you believe MB on cd ignoring how many orbs you have is the best dps, and also what do you believe the best opener to be atm with 4set ofc.

    Thanks
    With 4t12, yes, without a doubt. Hit cap + 4t12 + MB on CD is the way to go.

    I'm using this opener ATM, prepot -> vt/swp/dp, mf x2(to procc shit and get stacks up), fiend, AA, MB, fill with flay until you need to refresh VT(usually two flays), 1-2 flay before refreshing DP(with my current HST this lines up perfectly before prepot wears off.
    Tenser @ EU-Auchindoun
    Officer of <WTFlux> 2-day-weekend-raiding-guild, T14: 8/16HC, T15: 2/13H
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  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Beavers View Post
    Hey again T Man haste is your best stat after the extra VT tick up untill about 3k haste its in a clear lead.
    That's not quite true. If you get DI Haste always stays above Mastery, if you don't shortly after you cross the VT thresholds Haste dips below Mastery a little. In honest truth though, stacking mastery at that point or haste won't make a huge difference. The people who support haste (even without DI) do it because every bit of haste you add makes your ticks happen slightly faster. The only real reason for staying closer to the haste thresholds is that with VT at full duration it makes the refreshing of DoTs and casting of MB not clash as much (meaning fewer times where you have to decide between casting MB or refreshing a DoT and possibly having it fall off).

    Either way, it's probably pretty moot there T Man. Doing one or the other depends on the person and neither method results in a significant dps increase. As long as you remember that 4.3 is coming "soon" and at that point more than likely it will be back to stacking haste full force. The FAQ section of Kilee's Guide goes into a lot of detail about haste vs mastery, so there is not much in continuing that here.

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Beavers View Post
    Hey Ariadne mind checking over a few things with me.

    Do you believe MB on cd ignoring how many orbs you have is the best dps, and also what do you believe the best opener to be atm with 4set ofc.

    Thanks
    Yes, Mind Blasting on cooldown is what I do. I hardly ever lose ES and if I do, it isn't for long. I don't know which the best opener is but the most safe and the one I use is:

    Pre pot -> VT -> SW: P -> DP -> Mind Flay until orb -> Mind Blast -> Refresh DoTs before trinkets expire -> Archangel.

  5. #25
    Epic! Demetrion's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ariadne View Post
    Yes, Mind Blasting on cooldown is what I do. I hardly ever lose ES and if I do, it isn't for long. I don't know which the best opener is but the most safe and the one I use is:

    Pre pot -> VT -> SW: P -> DP -> Mind Flay until orb -> Mind Blast -> Refresh DoTs before trinkets expire -> Archangel.
    Hmm... my rotation is a bit different

    Pre pot > SWP > VT > DP > Mind blast > Mindflay > Archangel > Mindflay (till now I should have orb procced) > mindblast > refresh dots before pot, trinkets expire.

    Any thoughts?

  6. #26
    Demetrion, IMHO, your opening rotation is wrong because you're refreshing dots while you have Archangel up, which only buffs MF, MB and MS so you should refresh your dots right before you cast Archangel. So the Ariadne's the right opening rotation.

  7. #27
    Yes it's best to cast DP just prior to using AA, and ensure you have enough time for 1 and a bit MFs before you need to refresh VT inside an AA duration. To be honest I'm not sure the opening rotation is my strongest point. I usually do this: VT, DP, SWP, SF, MF until orb, MB, VT, DP, AA and away, but I see other shadow priests bounce to the top of Skada almost from the off. We generally level off and have pretty equal DPS unless only one of us has DI, but they seem to have a better opening. I should really ask what they do lol.
    Dragonslayer Hoddie - pretending to know what I'm doing!

  8. #28
    Pre pot -> VT -> SW: P -> DP -> Mind Flay until orb -> Mind Blast -> Refresh DoTs before trinkets expire -> Archangel.
    I'd say you should refresh dots asap so you could use archangel with the remaining time of your procs, don't you?

  9. #29
    I've been following what Kilee's guide suggests in terms of rotation (except for the timing of Shadowfiend): Pre-Pot, SWP, MFx1.2, MB, VT, DP, AA.

    Should I still be doing this? It seems like everyone else on here dots first, and then launches into the MF/MB thing. But it makes sense because you are (hopefully) getting orbs and stacking your Dark Evangelism buff before dotting, and then AAing. What do you guys think?

  10. #30
    I'll never open with SW:P unless i need to run into range, because it is instant. Better off timing your VT with the pull timer, then instant casting SW:P after.

    aside from this, I think Kilee's opener has the potential to do the most dps IF you get an early orb, but this rotation can also get fucked by bad procs.

    basically i do it this way...

    prepot (VT 1 second on pull timer) SWP, Shadowfiend, MF till orb, MB, VT, DP, AA

  11. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by Eldarc View Post
    I'd say you should refresh dots asap so you could use archangel with the remaining time of your procs, don't you?
    Yes, you could. I usually do that if I get an early orb. But it usually lines up in a way that my Mind Blast comes off cooldown when I have to refresh the orbs.

  12. #32
    I wouldn't cast shadowfiend until all my procs are up at the same time. I usually cast it right after refreshing my dots after getting ES and right before Dark Archangel.

  13. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by Ariadne View Post
    Yes, you could. I usually do that if I get an early orb. But it usually lines up in a way that my Mind Blast comes off cooldown when I have to refresh the orbs.
    Don't cast mind blast before you have atleast one orb in order not to waste AA time during your procs.
    Having to wait 5-6 secconds with AA because you had to wait on your MB cooldown during Power Torrent and esp. volcano should be a dps los and delay your ramp up time.

    ---------- Post added 2011-10-18 at 08:26 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Eldarc View Post
    I wouldn't cast shadowfiend until all my procs are up at the same time. I usually cast it right after refreshing my dots after getting ES and right before Dark Archangel.
    Your shadow fiends attack power is indeed increased by your spell power. However, nowdays his (her? :O) attack power is calculated after each swing and now at the cast. That means that he will still benefit from stuff like power torrent and such while he have allready been summoned. Delaying SF for procs can be a pretty big waste of dps.

    ---------- Post added 2011-10-18 at 08:28 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by hikamiro View Post
    I'll never open with SW:P unless i need to run into range, because it is instant. Better off timing your VT with the pull timer, then instant casting SW:P after.

    aside from this, I think Kilee's opener has the potential to do the most dps IF you get an early orb, but this rotation can also get fucked by bad procs.

    basically i do it this way...

    prepot (VT 1 second on pull timer) SWP, Shadowfiend, MF till orb, MB, VT, DP, AA
    Not casting Shadow Word: Pain is very stupid as that can delay the time in which you will get you first orb. It is though, as you do accepted to cast it as your seccond spell if you precast VT and is sure that it lands exactly when the tank attacks (I prefer to pre fade and be a bit earlier than the tank) to then cast SW: P.

  14. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by Leshya View Post
    I've been following what Kilee's guide suggests in terms of rotation (except for the timing of Shadowfiend): Pre-Pot, SWP, MFx1.2, MB, VT, DP, AA.

    Should I still be doing this? It seems like everyone else on here dots first, and then launches into the MF/MB thing. But it makes sense because you are (hopefully) getting orbs and stacking your Dark Evangelism buff before dotting, and then AAing. What do you guys think?
    I also do this... it was difficult at first because I was so used to doing VT just as the pull was happening and stuff, but I find normally I get my first orb before I even finish the first cast of MF (which you should still finish to get the Evangelism stacks) and overall my opening dps seems higher and more consistent this way. DOing it the other way sure you are getting more DoTs rolling faster, but they are also weaker. It's doesn't really matter too much though, don't get overly hung up on opening the most important things you do are during the fight not in the first 30secs

  15. #35
    And on the subject on using MB off cooldown:
    This is what I do if you MB have a ~2 sec cooldown left:
    Look at the time left on your dots-
    DP is over about 8-9secs left? Don't refresh.
    VT have 9-10secs left? Don't refresh.
    If they have less time left than that, refresh them while you have your ES left and cast mind blast without any orb.

    Edit: Sorry for the tripple post above, they usually melt together to one, but not today :<

  16. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by eErike View Post
    Don't cast mind blast before you have atleast one orb in order not to waste AA time during your procs.
    Having to wait 5-6 secconds with AA because you had to wait on your MB cooldown during Power Torrent and esp. volcano should be a dps los and delay your ramp up time.[COLOR="red"]
    I don't. When did I say I cast Mind Blast without orb? I said that I usually get DoTs up, get ES up, refresh DoTs and then Archangel.
    Last edited by Ariadne; 2011-10-18 at 08:50 PM.

  17. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by Ariadne View Post
    I don't. When did I say I cast Mind Blast without orb? I said that I usually get DoTs up, get ES up, refresh DoTs and then Archangel.
    Missunderstood the "Yes, you could. I usually do that if I get an early orb. But it usually lines up in a way that my Mind Blast comes off cooldown when I have to refresh the orbs. " line with that you usually had MB on cooldown before you could refresh dots when trinkets procced, my bad.

  18. #38
    I have been experimenting with using mind blast on the pull then vt>dp>sw>mf>mf>aa>mf>mf(clipped) by refreshing dots once you have your 5 stack back up. I really like the burst at the start of the fight that this opener provides, the most damage you can throw out there at the start the better, Spriest allready kinda get boned compaired to other classes in the burst department. its not until 10-15 seconds into the fight where spriests start really really kicking ass

  19. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by Modernn View Post
    I have been experimenting with using mind blast on the pull then vt>dp>sw>mf>mf>aa>mf>mf(clipped) by refreshing dots once you have your 5 stack back up. I really like the burst at the start of the fight that this opener provides, the most damage you can throw out there at the start the better, Spriest allready kinda get boned compaired to other classes in the burst department. its not until 10-15 seconds into the fight where spriests start really really kicking ass
    Warning, following post is written by someone who is utterly confused by another persons choise and may sound a bit harsh and that is not intended, sorry if it looks like it though!

    There are absolutly no reason for you to start with mindblast. Not only do you with you opener delay the uptime of SW: P by one global + a VT cast (usually 1.3ish secs?) but you also delay your whole opener by throwing in a casttime spell that have no direct damage after the boss is engaged that can with huge benefits be thrown in before the fight even starts.
    Not to mention that this mindblast you cast won't benefit from the t12 4set bonus and is therefor considerably weaker that it could be if you delay it's cast to your first orb.

    Forgot:
    Nowhere in that opener do I see any "MB when orb comes up" or something saying that you activate the Empowered Shadow buff. As MF is considered a dot you basicly lost ~33% dps on those 3-4 last MFs.
    Last edited by eErike; 2011-10-19 at 08:25 PM.

  20. #40
    Item Level:380
    Expectations:Progress w/ group & melt face
    Armory Link:http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/stormscale/Voxi/simple
    Worldoflogs Link:http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/6vyb0e1wyfa1vzmf/

    Picked up 2 new rings last night. Baleroc fight I was lookin ugly, was a bit disoriented. ;P We're fairly casual. Not sure whether or not to pick up more spirit, but as it is, I find it comfortable. And we've only had the lock literally 3 times. So should I stay JUST above the +2 VT tick and stack mastery because of the unreliability on DI? Otherwise, what's the benefit of more haste?
    Last edited by Vawcks; 2011-10-20 at 03:58 AM.
    Voxi - 85 Shadow Priest [4/8 HM DS, 6/7 Heroic FL] Tsunari - 85 MM Huntard

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