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  1. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by traen View Post
    There is no such problem as room full of monsters and mob immunity in 8ppl party. You don't need any survivability in party. All you need is pure damage to kill monsters as fast as possible.

    You main target is to level up faster, not to take or mitigate damage
    In party the one who does most damage is the most valuable member. 10x dps difference is too much for simple survivability.
    OP and you look like talking about WoW.
    There was never a rush for levels in Diablo, you get your minimum needed just by slashing way through. Rush for levels/"burn through game content asap" themselves are some sickness on their own, which I didn't see anywhere else as much as in WoW (and it's clones).
    Also I don't see much sense in having 8 people in D3 party except on very very rare occassion. Why 8, even 3 people is too much to play with regularly.

    In D3, the one who kills mobs/boss and doesn't die - wins. Take WoW (though innately such numbers aren't possible, just example), you can have 100k dps, but if you are 1-shottable, even Problim with a bit over 400k health will have enough time to kill you. In extremity, you can have 1 mil dps, but 1k health, I guarrantee - you wouldn't be valued in any raid, as you'd be aoe'able by everything. In WoW your survival depends from other people, not you (assuming you avoid bad stuff), in D3 survival depends only from you.

    Having said this, some kind of ingame recount would be nice just for theorycrafting reasons (to see actual distribution of some proc, amount of avoided attacks, how much Rage you got in duration of fight thanks to new talent on practice etc., not just pure dps meter).
    Last edited by Ferocity; 2012-05-06 at 04:10 AM.

  2. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by Youarefired View Post
    That world of logs website already needs to go to hell. Who cares about your dps, hps, tps and whateverPS.

    Bringing this stupid addon into an awesome game would just bring the annoying players from WoW as well.

    Diablo is about DESTRUCTION! Not "WAHHH DPS! REALMFIRSTOMG!"
    A lot of people care how you are actually performing during a raid in certain encounter.
    Which one you would pick? A guy with near best in slot gear who does X ammount of dps on boss Y or a guy who does 0.95X dps on a Y boss with a lot worse gear?
    Gear doesn't mean you are good, gear doesn't mean you are bad either. What matters is the results and WoL website offers a lot of information about someone who is applying for a raid group spot.

    OT
    I would love a recount in D3, not to brag but to improve myself.
    Damage done in D3 isn't same as in wow, but overall/or spesific damage done can tell you a lot of details.
    A "recount" in D3 could only show your own damage done/damage taken stats. I would be really happy with that. It could show me that I am doing really badly if I compare it to my friends stats. It also could show that we are doing quite equal ammount of damage and thus we would need a diffrent approach on the boss we are having trouble with.

    Recount is a valuable tool in WoW. Similar UI element could be a nice thing to D3 IF it would be compleatly private. A tool that you could use to analyze your and only your performance. You could share your data with friends through chat, voip or in real life or you just could forget about it if you are playing in pug.
    Oh sure, join a game, a player asks you "you xxxxDPS on Z boss!?!!?" go ahead and lie "sure, I can do that". Or if you wipe, talk with the guys about having a diffrent approach or leave the game and join the next one. If you succeed, enjoy the loot springing out of the dead boss.

    Anyways, I think I have derailed from my original train of thought a bit but that's what drinking can do for you.
    What I tried to say is that private damage meter / log could be useful, although never ever really needed.

  3. #43
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    Don't need it. You are on use dead. So most of the skilled players leave then re-enter combat making them have really low DPS.
    Quote Originally Posted by qu1rex View Post
    Across the pond, we stereotype the average US citizen as being quite dim-witted, albeit due to the poor education standards subject to them by their curriculum.
    Sad to know people think I am stupid.

  4. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by Youarefired View Post
    That world of logs website already needs to go to hell. Who cares about your dps, hps, tps and whateverPS.

    Bringing this stupid addon into an awesome game would just bring the annoying players from WoW as well.

    Diablo is about DESTRUCTION! Not "WAHHH DPS! REALMFIRSTOMG!"
    WOL website is a tool, same as skada/recount etc.

    You dont like the way some people use the tools.

    However they can also be very useful for the raid leader/player to understand what they're doing wrong or right.

    I would personally like to see some form of combat log in D3, not for epeen but to understand character builds better.

    That said I would tremendously dislike the ability to link them in chat.

  5. #45
    It's actually more about style/resource usage than damage. If blizzard's doing their job right, your overall dps shouldn't go up or down if you're using ray of frost or arcane blast; so long as you're using them in the right way (one being a single target beam of death, the other an aoe explosion of glorious purple goodness.)

    I say, use what feels good. worry about not getting killed.

  6. #46
    Don't need a recount.

    You see your DPS in your char info, you see when monsters die, you see when you die. Thats really enough.

    Sure, a "total damage done/received" for groups, or a "kill per minute" counter could tell you something, but it really isn't neccesary.

  7. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by Caiada View Post
    Most of the community doesn't really demand 'optimum play' (and neither does the game) and thus no need for damage meters. It also helps that a ton more people play with friends instead of randoms.
    Yep, and also the fact that survivibility means more in Diablo 3 than WoW and you can't measure that with meters.

  8. #48
    Quote Originally Posted by Cairhiin View Post
    Yep, and also the fact that survivibility means more in Diablo 3 than WoW and you can't measure that with meters.
    You can actually. Damage taken, damage reduced by stat x, damage avoided, deaths taken, unnecessary damage taken, health globes wasted, damage taken by mob x, cooldown timing.. You thought tanks in WoW did nothing to analyse their performance?

    Don't get me wrong I don't feel the dire need for addons and such in Diablo 3, but it might come in handy for Inferno and it might actually be fun to those who like to min-max. The main issue with people and damage meters is they think they're there solely for seeing their ''omg awesum dps'' numbers, when really that's pretty much the least important thing these addons record.

  9. #49
    Blizzard is smart enough to not allow recount or other stuff to spoil the fun in this game.

    I wouldn't like to feed the number of casual people that simply stopped playing Raids and even dungeons due to this "aiding tool".

    Some even use it to measure healing in WOW.

    And then people wonder why I stopped raiding ...

  10. #50
    Quote Originally Posted by BenBos View Post
    Blizzard is smart enough to not allow recount or other stuff to spoil the fun in this game.

    I wouldn't like to feed the number of casual people that simply stopped playing Raids and even dungeons due to this "aiding tool".

    Some even use it to measure healing in WOW.

    And then people wonder why I stopped raiding ...
    Like I said just before; that is a USER error with these addons. Addons like recount are not intended to show numbers just so people can boost about how your numbers are higher than mine or to measure dps/hps-peens. They're meant to help analyse your performance and help you improve where you can, find weak spots and help better understand your class/abilities. I'm sorry but saying people stopped playing because of these addons just tells me they had no clue what they were for, so good riddence to them.

  11. #51
    Quote Originally Posted by Reisori View Post
    A lot of people care how you are actually performing during a raid in certain encounter.
    Which one you would pick? A guy with near best in slot gear who does X ammount of dps on boss Y or a guy who does 0.95X dps on a Y boss with a lot worse gear?
    Gear doesn't mean you are good, gear doesn't mean you are bad either. What matters is the results and WoL website offers a lot of information about someone who is applying for a raid group spot.

    OT
    I would love a recount in D3, not to brag but to improve myself.
    Damage done in D3 isn't same as in wow, but overall/or spesific damage done can tell you a lot of details.
    A "recount" in D3 could only show your own damage done/damage taken stats. I would be really happy with that. It could show me that I am doing really badly if I compare it to my friends stats. It also could show that we are doing quite equal ammount of damage and thus we would need a diffrent approach on the boss we are having trouble with.

    Recount is a valuable tool in WoW. Similar UI element could be a nice thing to D3 IF it would be compleatly private. A tool that you could use to analyze your and only your performance. You could share your data with friends through chat, voip or in real life or you just could forget about it if you are playing in pug.
    Oh sure, join a game, a player asks you "you xxxxDPS on Z boss!?!!?" go ahead and lie "sure, I can do that". Or if you wipe, talk with the guys about having a diffrent approach or leave the game and join the next one. If you succeed, enjoy the loot springing out of the dead boss.

    Anyways, I think I have derailed from my original train of thought a bit but that's what drinking can do for you.
    What I tried to say is that private damage meter / log could be useful, although never ever really needed.
    Recount would only help you make choises for the wrong reasons.
    You need to understand that a Dungeon crawler is not WoW.
    MoP is awesome.

  12. #52
    Quote Originally Posted by BenBos View Post
    Blizzard is smart enough to not allow recount or other stuff to spoil the fun in this game.

    I wouldn't like to feed the number of casual people that simply stopped playing Raids and even dungeons due to this "aiding tool".

    Some even use it to measure healing in WOW.

    And then people wonder why I stopped raiding ...

    you stopped raiding cause you played with idiots. Tools like recount but mostly WoL are really good when progressing on a fight to see what yu did wrong, where you took avoidable dmg, if you let dots drop off, etc.

    That being said I don't see the use for it in Diablo. I would like (personal) stats tho, like completed this act/quest in X time, did this much dmg, took this much dmg, looted X gold, used that ability the most, killed so many of these... but that's just because I really like stats ^^

  13. #53
    Quote Originally Posted by Rawrgrablle View Post
    You can actually. Damage taken, damage reduced by stat x, damage avoided, deaths taken, unnecessary damage taken, health globes wasted, damage taken by mob x, cooldown timing.. You thought tanks in WoW did nothing to analyse their performance?

    Don't get me wrong I don't feel the dire need for addons and such in Diablo 3, but it might come in handy for Inferno and it might actually be fun to those who like to min-max. The main issue with people and damage meters is they think they're there solely for seeing their ''omg awesum dps'' numbers, when really that's pretty much the least important thing these addons record.
    No that's not the point. You can't really measure survivibility in terms of DPS. A Diablo 3 character just can't stand there on nuke like in WoW. A Diablo 3 char needs mobility, survivibility, and damage. While you can measure damage taken etc it's not a complete picture of all the three stats involved. Furthermore, people in WoW have misinterpreted the results of a damage meter for 7 years, it would only get worse in Diablo 3 in that regard.

  14. #54
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    Can you imagine how absolutely ridiculous the thought of using Recount in Diablo 2 whilst killing Diablo or Baal or Mephisto would've been? What exactly has changed in Diablo 3 that would make it any less ridiculous?

    I mean damn...
    've is short for have. C/Sh/Would've or c/sh/would have. Not c/sh/would of.

  15. #55
    The Unstoppable Force N-aix's Avatar
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    Leave this monstrosity out of my Diablo, That's all I'm going to say.

  16. #56
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    To be fair, making the perfect group in Diablo 2 was something that happened. You always wanted a paladin or 2 for auras, a barbarion for shouts, a sorc to teleport and sometimes enchant, though to an extent all of those capabilities could be found via the absolute best gear, it was still better to use the class auras.

    Damage meters in WoW for me was nothing about seeing who was bad or who was doing wrong, It was simply "this addon shows how much damage you did" and I thought that was awesome, it was nothing about being elitist. Not saying its the right thing for Diablo 3, it would be kinda pointless since its a different kind of game, but If it did show up in some form then i'd probably use it. People theorycrafted quite heavily in Diablo 2, it isnt a "WoW" thing. If people could have had damage meters in D2 they would have taken them, the hardcore players anyway.

  17. #57
    Quote Originally Posted by Quakefan View Post
    As we know, there is so meny different ways to do DPS in Diablo 3. I guess we need a recount as we need it for a WoW, specially for a group run.
    you are walking a dangerous path...

  18. #58
    Quote Originally Posted by skylla05 View Post
    Survivability and proper skill swapping to accommodate immunities, etc is going to make or break you in areas of the game that matter (Inferno). Outside Inferno, running DPS meters would be like running DPS meters in Stockades (mostly pointless).
    Swapping skill won't be a good way to play this game because cd for swapping skill past normal will be really long,you will lose nephalem buff and you may lose your bonus from +skill affix too. There's no immune in D3 too.

  19. #59
    Quote Originally Posted by Youarefired View Post
    Diablo is about DESTRUCTION! Not "WAHHH DPS! REALMFIRSTOMG!"
    Necro'ing a thread so old I was still a mod when it was happening; just to complain about it? Come on, man.
    Win and live. Lose and die.
    Rule of life. No change rule.
    Running worse than losing.
    Random casual stuff now


  20. #60
    Quote Originally Posted by -Alcatraz- View Post
    Leave this monstrosity out of my Diablo, That's all I'm going to say.
    Agree with this guy ^

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