Upcoming Shards of Domination Set Bonus Buffs, Spit Emote Removed on TBC Classic PTR

Originally Posted by EyelessCrow

Personally I don't think WoW is ever going to recover. It's a game by pussies for pussies at this point. Which I find funny considering they want to put kid gloves and foam padding on every corner for said weaklings to feel safe in, meanwhile mass murder is committed on a regular basis as a plot point.

It is hilarious that people keep trying to claim that because the story has murder they should be allowed to be toxic to follow players.

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Originally Posted by Delever

It is assholish behaviour but how are you actually being harassed? What is actually being done to you? How are your feelings getting hurt by a /spit emote from an anonymus orc?

So targeted harassment is not bad? If it is a fake online world why are you getting so worked up over an emote being removed? You are the one that keeps downplaying harassment because you think harassment can't happen online. You keep victim shaming. Remember when you said you were not yet now you are setting arbitrary limits on who can be a victim and who can't be.

How do you think it would make actual victims feel to say that abuse isn't abuse if it doesn't meet a threshold you personally agree with? All because you can't accept that harassment can occur in a video game. Lol.

Originally Posted by rhorle

It is hilarious that people keep trying to claim that because the story has murder they should be allowed to be toxic to follow players.

Oh no! Not following players, that's too much.

Jesus. At some point you guys are gonna break under the simple pressure of existance.

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Originally Posted by rhorle

If it is a fake online world why are you getting so worked up over an emote being removed?

And again with the bad faith.
Pick a position: either the emote is nothing and thus both sides should ignore whether it exists or not, or the emote carries serious consequences and thus both usage and removal are important.

You can't tip-toe constantly between one or the other when it suits you.

Originally Posted by Nimin

Pick a position: either the emote is nothing and thus both sides should ignore whether it exists or not, or the emote carries serious consequences and thus both usage and removal are important.

You can't tip-toe constantly between one or the other when it suits you.

Thats a really stupid argument, You can think the emote is stupid and removing it is a good thing, but also admit at the same time that most of the time the emote is basically meaningless. The community is the ones that weaponized it (and Asmonshitface egged it on), blame them if you are attached to your emote.

I think it's grand that with everything going on that players can come together to explain why it's breaking their hearts that they can't spam /spit on people til it fills up chat screens.

Originally Posted by Nimin

Oh no! Not following players, that's too much. Jesus. At some point you guys are gonna break under the simple pressure of existance.

Says the person that is getting upset because players can't be toxic to fellow players. Weird right?

And again with the bad faith.Pick a position: either the emote is nothing and thus both sides should ignore whether it exists or not, or the emote carries serious consequences and thus both usage and removal are important.You can't tip-toe constantly between one or the other when it suits you.

It isn't about the emote. Why do you still not understand that? It was about the specific emote being used as a tool for harassment. Removing it puts a temporary stop to the harassment. The emote itself has little value to the game so there is little reason to save it. You keep projecting about bad faith discussion.

Originally Posted by rhorle

Says the person that is getting upset because players can't be toxic to fellow players. Weird right?



It isn't about the emote. Why do you still not understand that? It was about the specific emote being used as a tool for harassment. Removing it puts a temporary stop to the harassment. The emote itself has little value to the game so there is little reason to save it. You keep projecting about bad faith discussion.

You have the nerve to talk about projection when in the post above you started once again arguing in absolutes, claiming that somehow I think harassment in video games cannot happen at all which is not what I said.
Harassment in video games can absolutely happen when people message you hurtful things like racist or homophobic remarks and when people actively prevent you from playing like camping your corpse or trying to cover an npc with a mount.
To equate these with the use of an emote is ridiculous and all you are doing is validating a hypersensitive reaction that only gives room for fake victimhood to escalate, further invalidating actual abuse victims.

Originally Posted by Nimin

Oh no! Not following players, that's too much.

Jesus. At some point you guys are gonna break under the simple pressure of existance.

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And again with the bad faith.
Pick a position: either the emote is nothing and thus both sides should ignore whether it exists or not, or the emote carries serious consequences and thus both usage and removal are important.

You can't tip-toe constantly between one or the other when it suits you.

Yknow there's a third option

People spamming /spit is annoying as fuck and people don't want to be annoyed 24/7. It's why you can /ignore people. Your right to be an annoying shit doesn't mean everyone needs to be forced to experience it, whether it's harassment or just plain aggravation.

Furthermore if you think you can fix problems with game design by spitting on players but wont bother messaging executives(not devs cuz they dont decide on microtransactions they just follow orders) you're either dimwitted and think you're having an effect, or you know you're not affecting actual change and you just want an excuse to be an annoying shit. You can pick your lane.

If you really care about blizz and the soul destroying rot that's apparently been a feature in the company I don't know why "I have a neeeeeeed to spit on players constantly" is the hill you want to die on. Especially when all it does is give a shining beacon to the people that say "It's not just blizzard corporate, their players are assholes too"

But for sure, go back and forth again with the "if they can't ignore constantly being spit on it's their fault and I'm a hero for doing it" narrative. Solid work.

"Hey look over here! You subscribers are the real problem! Not our ENTIRE CULTURE OF TOXICITY within our own company! Let's give you guys some slap on the wrist so you get distracted from demanding we fix the sh** affecting our actual staff!" - this move by Blizz.

Originally Posted by Delever

You have the nerve to talk about projection when in the post above you started once again arguing in absolutes, claiming that somehow I think harassment in video games cannot happen at all which is not what I said.

So then people can be harassed by an emote, right? Even though you keep saying it isn't "real" harassment? It isn't projection when you literally are making that argument. Calling targeted harassment "hypersensitive reaction" indicates that you don't think harassment can occur in video games. This isn't fake victim hood. Stop blaming the victims because other players got triggered over a mount being bought and decided to harass the players who bought it.

The only one invalidating actual abuse victims is yourself who is gate keeping what is abuse based on your personal views. Anything can be used for harassment. It doesn't require racial slurs, homophobic remarks, or anything else you use to gate keep harassment. Repeating something over and over and over is a form of harassment. Doing it just because someone bought a mount is harassment.

Who cares if there is targeted harassment. It's a game ffs. People can /ignore and move on with their lives. Oh no a person is spitting in a game of war where genocide happens almost daily *shocked pikachu face*.

Originally Posted by rhorle

So then people can be harassed by an emote, right? Even though you keep saying it isn't "real" harassment? It isn't projection when you literally are making that argument. Calling targeted harassment "hypersensitive reaction" indicates that you don't think harassment can occur in video games. This isn't fake victim hood. Stop blaming the victims because other players got triggered over a mount being bought and decided to harass the players who bought it.

The only one invalidating actual abuse victims is yourself who is gate keeping what is abuse based on your personal views. Anything can be used for harassment. It doesn't require racial slurs, homophobic remarks, or anything else you use to gate keep harassment. Repeating something over and over and over is a form of harassment. Doing it just because someone bought a mount is harassment.

Pretty sure your financial support to sexual predators is doing way more to hurt victims. If you wanna take it to ad hominem and argue in extremes and absolutes two can play at that game.

Originally Posted by rhorle

Removing it puts a temporary stop to the harassment.

Does it though? It seems negligible and more of a virtue signal to remove ONE emote (and not even in it's entirety as you can still do /e Spits at you).

A better method would be to have a toggle to "Allow emotes only from friends/NPCs"

That still doesn't stop players from typing "Ew, store mount" or something in public chat to share their opinion.

Originally Posted by Delever

Pretty sure your financial support to sexual predators is doing way more to hurt victims. If you wanna take it to ad hominem and argue in extremes and absolutes two can play at that game.

So then the emote being removed doesn't matter. Because the only way to use it is to financially support sexual predators right? Continuing to play the game does not mean you support sexual harassment. That reasoning is as dumb as you saying that harassment was not occurring with the emote. We have a streamer who called for that type of harassment as a protest. You can harass with any type of word or action. Saying that is not ad hominem, because it isn't direct at you the person but your argument. Saying that is not taking the discussion to extremes because it is literally what has happened.

Originally Posted by rhorle

It isn't about the emote. Why do you still not understand that? It was about the specific emote being used as a tool for harassment. Removing it puts a temporary stop to the harassment. The emote itself has little value to the game so there is little reason to save it. You keep projecting about bad faith discussion.

Right, because the solution to a tool being misused is removal of that tool for everyone.

Idiocracy, ladies and gentlemen.

Originally Posted by Nimin

Right, because the solution to a tool being misused is removal of that tool for everyone. Idiocracy, ladies and gentlemen.

If the value gained by simply removing the tool is greater then that of keeping it around. Sure. There is nothing wrong with the emote being removed. Could it have stayed? Sure. There is nothing wrong with keeping it around. You and others keep making a mountain out of a mole hill while blaming the targets of the harassment instead of being outraged at those who abused it and caused it to be removed. Weird right?

Originally Posted by rhorle

If the value gained by simply removing the tool is greater then that of keeping it around. Sure. There is nothing wrong with the emote being removed. Could it have stayed? Sure. There is nothing wrong with keeping it around. You and others keep making a mountain out of a mole hill while blaming the targets of the harassment instead of being outraged at those who abused it and caused it to be removed. Weird right?

The only thing weird here is your constantly ending posts with "weird, right?" as if you're suffering from a stroke.

Originally Posted by Hauzhi

Chill. Its not something in the game. He is getting a reaction in the game for something he did outside of the game.
So... Its harassment.

If its fair or not its a diferent discussion.

Then punish the harassers, not the innocent and guilty alike.
This snowflake culture they're fostering that always resorts to exclusion/censoring as the solution to anything offensive, that's what's damaging. Not nameless videogame chars using /spit.

The folks going "it's just an emote" either don't realize or pretend not to that it never stops there, they always go for more, more and more stuff to remove and sanitize, because it's the mentality behind it that's rotten.

Originally Posted by Nimin

The only thing weird here is your constantly ending posts with "weird, right?" as if you're suffering from a stroke.

So I can't ask if you find your behavior weird?

Then punish the harassers, not the innocent and guilty alike. This snowflake culture they're fostering that always resorts to exclusion/censoring as the solution to anything offensive, that's what's damaging. Not nameless videogame chars using /spit.

Who says they are not going to punish the harassers more? Who says they won't bring the emote back once things settle down? Snowflake culture goes both ways. You are throwing a fit over the emote being removed which makes you just as much of a snowflake as you accuse others of being. Punishing bad behavior is always exclusion or censoring. Lmao. What else would a punishment be?

If it never stops at an emote then why hasn't the entire game been censored? Weird right? You keep using what aboutisms to say why it is bad. If Blizzard, or any video game, takes it to far then complain then. Don't whine when it is a perfectly acceptable action given how things are currently happening in game. The mentality that is rotten is that nothing can be done to combat toxicity because snowflakes that are toxic can't handle it.

It is an emote and you are literally saying it is ruining video games by not being able to spit on people in a video game. Lmao.

Originally Posted by Delever

It is assholish behaviour but how are you actually being harassed? What is actually being done to you? How are your feelings getting hurt by a /spit emote from an anonymus orc?
Did you feelings also get hurt when during the end of the DK quesline NPCs were throwing rotten shit at you? Its a fake online world where you are role playing a character. Its immature behavior but equating it with actual harassment is immensely downplaying and insulting actual victims of harassment.
Imagine a therapy circle where people have gathered to share their experiences. Victim no1 shares they were sexually abused by her co workers causing her trauma. Victim no2 shares that they deveoped PTSD from a war. Victim no3 shares that they were doxxed by an organized cyber bullying where people created a fake profile of them on FB and proceeded to destroy their reputation through fake messages and pictures. Then victim no4 shares that they were afking on a warp stalker in shattrath and people passing by would use a /spit emote on them before leaving and forgetting about it.
How do you think this would make actual victims feel? Putting the label "victim" on these people over something so miniscule and equating their negligible experience to harassment and abuse does more harm than good.

You know you’re example is the equivalent of person no4 having done nothing more than sit on a bench at a park and people walk by and spit on the ground in front of them, right? Or just minding your business at a restaurant and someone saying a derogatory word or phrase your way. Or, if you want to compare digital harassment to digital harassment, person no6 posts something on a social media platform just to be bombarded with hate comments from people they’ve never met and sit behind temp accounts.
None of these examples are less valid than your earlier examples, and they all are equivalent to your last example of something that is not an actual victim, simply because you don’t view people being harassed or bullied in a game as a real victim.

Originally Posted by rhorle

If the value gained by simply removing the tool is greater then that of keeping it around. Sure. There is nothing wrong with the emote being removed. Could it have stayed? Sure. There is nothing wrong with keeping it around. You and others keep making a mountain out of a mole hill while blaming the targets of the harassment instead of being outraged at those who abused it and caused it to be removed. Weird right?

People are obviously upset not at the removal of some trivial emote, but of what it represents. Because it *is* trivial. There's no reason to remove it, except as a symbol. A symbol for the increasing embrace of paternalism and infantilization of the audience. Everybody knows, all this does is turn everyone into princesses who can't sleep even when cushioned by a hundred mattresses, because they've been so coddled their whole life the slightest discomfort, the tiniest little pea, becomes an unbearable imposition. Same reason, you ban phrases like "GG EZ" or whatever, to reduce "toxicity", but people can still tell when a "GG" is disingenuous. Thus, the actual insult having been removed, contrast removed, compliments start feeling like insults. Then we remove the ability for compliments as well, because they start feeling bad to receive. Then we remove all ability for communication at all, the ultimate source of toxicity of course being players' ability to communicate with each other. Then we remove the score tracking - losing, of course, feeling bad because of the loss itself, not because of the insult. It's the ability to win/lose that's the real problem. Everyone is a winner just for participating. This all being stuff that people are already doing. It's the logical conclusion of this level of paternalism. The worst parts of helicopter parenting outsourced to states and corporations who have neither you nor your kids' interests at heart, who will happily destroy your mind and soul for short-term profit at the altar of Moloch. Whose mind is pure machinery. Whose breast is a cannibal dynamo. Whose eyes are a thousand black mirrors.

Originally Posted by rhorle

Who says they are not going to punish the harassers more? Who says they won't bring the emote back once things settle down? Snowflake culture goes both ways. You are throwing a fit over the emote being removed which makes you just as much of a snowflake as you accuse others of being. Punishing bad behavior is always exclusion or censoring. Lmao. What else would a punishment be?

"If YoU COmPlaIN ABoUT CeNSOrSHiP YoU'rE JuST aS BaD aS ThE CENsoR!!!11"

I didn't do any bad behaviour yet I'm getting punished. If you don't see the problem I don't know what to tell you.
Either you're trolling or a much worse options, you're actively defending the virtue signaling move of a company that routinely sexually harassed victims in real life, almost as if you side with them.
Not that weird.

Originally Posted by Simulacrum

People are obviously upset not at the removal of some trivial emote, but of what it represents. Because it *is* trivial. There's no reason to remove it, except as a symbol. A symbol for the increasing embrace of paternalism and infantilization of the audience. Everybody knows, all this does is turn everyone into princesses who can't sleep even when cushioned by a hundred mattresses, because they've been so coddled their whole life the slightest discomfort, the tiniest little pea, becomes an unbearable imposition.

I wouldn't bother, I doubt he can get the reference and the message it carries.