Patch 9.2 - Class Tier Set Bonuses

Originally Posted by Ryzeth

The Vengeance one is definitely good, but I never said they weren't. I said they were lackluster. As in, boring and dull. Compared to like... The spriest one, or all the warlock ones, which sound super fun.

Combining Vengeance 4-set with the Growing Inferno conduit you get to try to keep your immo aura going infinitely for torghast-level damage, but...Fracture alone (2 fragments every 4 seconds) could be enough to generate enough fragments? Will Vengeance just have permanent immolation aura with growing infero stacks capped?

Could be a fun little challenge to make sure immo never falls off.

Looking at the Mage sets, Frost feels underwhelming af, although it also has the only useful covenant legendary out of all Mage specs, so maybe it's a balance thing. Arcane looks quite decent more burst kek. And well Fire seems broken af. So normal stuff.

Affliction 2 piece bonus seems OP in AoE/Cleave (and boring in ST), especially when combined with the 4 piece bonus. ST you will basically do nothing else than cast SB and keep up your DoTs (except talent ones) via Malefic casts and procs. AoE you'll probably do the same, but do way more damage than you should.

Originally Posted by LordVargK

Affliction 2 piece bonus seems OP in AoE/Cleave (and boring in ST), especially when combined with the 4 piece bonus. ST you will basically do nothing else than cast SB and keep up your DoTs (except talent ones) via Malefic casts and procs. AoE you'll probably do the same, but do way more damage than you should.

issue is
malefic rapture +2 seconds
shaodwbolt proc 20% chance, so 5 shadowbolts

So you aint really gunna be able to keep up.

It's mind boggling that everyone complaining about the Shaman set bonuses are failing to stop and realize that they might be doing some actual class balancing to incorporate these set bonus affixes too..... We get it, chain heal CURRENTLY sucks. That doesn't mean changes aren't in the pipeline that will make this perfectly fun and usable. The whole point of set bonuses has always been to change up rotations a bit. Wait to see where things actually fall before condemning anything you don't like/clearly don't have all the info to understand.

Originally Posted by paxen

Combining Vengeance 4-set with the Growing Inferno conduit you get to try to keep your immo aura going infinitely for torghast-level damage, but...Fracture alone (2 fragments every 4 seconds) could be enough to generate enough fragments? Will Vengeance just have permanent immolation aura with growing infero stacks capped?

Could be a fun little challenge to make sure immo never falls off.

Yeah, I agree Vengeance's one is pretty good (if a bit bland, and going to probably need nerfing) ... Havoc's one just feels very tacked-on and not well thought out. I'd prefer something centered around Eye Beam / Metamorphosis since that's havoc's entire shtick.

Originally Posted by Ryzeth

Yeah, I agree Vengeance's one is pretty good (if a bit bland, and going to need tuning) ... Havoc's one just feels very tacked-on and not well thought out. I'd prefer something centered around Eye Beam / Metamorphosis since that's havoc's entire shtick.

But isn't half the point of tier bonuses to shake up the rotation? In that case 9.2 Havoc would feature Blade Dance. (Hmm, would this lineup so that you can trigger the extra Blade Dances during the Demonic window, which would bring Eyebeam into it again.)

For Windwalker the 40% bonus might be enough to move Fists of Fury to the top of the rotation, changing the WW experience just by applying a 'boring' flat damage bonus. (If the bonus isn't enough to get WWs to use FoF as much as possible it would be a failure and would need an even larger bonus.)

Originally Posted by FelPlague

issue is
malefic rapture +2 seconds
shaodwbolt proc 20% chance, so 5 shadowbolts

So you aint really gunna be able to keep up.

You forget to account for the other means of shard generation affli has already. Especially in AoE scenarios where you have multiple agonies rolling, this has a snowball effect.

Also you already have darkglare as a means to extend your DoTs every 120 seconds.

Originally Posted by paxen

But isn't half the point of tier bonuses to shake up the rotation? In that case 9.2 Havoc would feature Blade Dance. (Hmm, would this lineup so that you can trigger the extra Blade Dances during the Demonic window, which would bring Eyebeam into it again.)

For Windwalker the 40% bonus might be enough to move Fists of Fury to the top of the rotation, changing the WW experience just by applying a 'boring' flat damage bonus. (If the bonus isn't enough to get WWs to use FoF as much as possible it would be a failure and would need an even larger bonus.)

I mean no? Virtually the entire history of tier sets has been complementing the rotation, not trying to work random shit into it (eta: GENERALLY, I know this isn't ALWAYS the case in a few outlying instances). Check the list, and you'll see they almost all function this way in 9.2 lol. No rotation is gonna significantly change with their bonuses.

Like I said, I'm remaining optimistic but currently it's a worthless set bonus. I'm guessing they're either going to change the set bonus at some point, or buff Blade Dance baseline in some way. Either one will be nice, I actually like the Blade Dance build more.

Frost and Arcane are both mostly useless as Frost is the old Comet storm legendary nobody used and Arcane does dmg around CDs, not outside.

Fire looks good as they try to bring back the old Lucid mage, but then you remember Ignite doesnt spread automatically anymore.

Originally Posted by Moobu

It's mind boggling that everyone complaining about the Shaman set bonuses are failing to stop and realize that they might be doing some actual class balancing to incorporate these set bonus affixes too..... We get it, chain heal CURRENTLY sucks. That doesn't mean changes aren't in the pipeline that will make this perfectly fun and usable. The whole point of set bonuses has always been to change up rotations a bit. Wait to see where things actually fall before condemning anything you don't like/clearly don't have all the info to understand.

If they make Chain Heal better and more mana efficient, it will be BfA all over again: High Tide + this set and just spam. SL resto healing is arguably better than BfA healing (tho to each their own I guess); and High Tide build is already very viable. What makes this set bonus bad is the fact that it won't work that well outside of HT build, but it's far from being unusable.

Wow those are some of the most boring and lame set bonuses ever... Some of them are really cool and interesting, but most of them - almost all - are like, super stupid.

Fairly certain ele is reused from somewhere else, either a legion tier or might be a leggo effect in legion.

Originally Posted by Breccia

At least I'll have my Boots of 8 Second Angel Rootspear, which I am unironically looking forward to.

Since I’m presently Venthyr I like the idea of extending a turbo charged Avatar with Condemn. Now if only Blizzard would make Condemn more interesting for Prot outside of Choreghast.

Glory also looks good but I haven’t really looked too closely at it. The Necrolords don’t serve tea.

Originally Posted by Ivanstone

Since I’m presently Venthyr I like the idea of extending a turbo charged Avatar with Condemn.

I saw that, I'm not leaving Kyrian but that does look like fun.

Originally Posted by Ryzeth

Yeah, I agree Vengeance's one is pretty good (if a bit bland, and going to probably need nerfing) ... Havoc's one just feels very tacked-on and not well thought out. I'd prefer something centered around Eye Beam / Metamorphosis since that's havoc's entire shtick.

And for any Havoc using Venthyr the set bonus is beyond useless as we will be trying to maintain 100% or close to it uptime of sinful brand using Chaos Strike to reduce eyebeam cooldown and have no room or place to bother with blade dance.

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Originally Posted by Ryzeth

In DH's current state, blade dance is only ever used in AoE at 3+ targets. The blade dance build isn't great, and these bonuses aren't really going to change that with just how good the non-BD build is. Unless they make Trail+First Blood better than Unbound Chaos, it's still not going to be used single target.

The Vengeance one is definitely good, but I never said they weren't. I said they were lackluster. As in, boring and dull. Compared to like... The spriest one, or all the warlock ones, which sound super fun.

I'll remain optimistic anyway, since we have like two months minimum before it even goes live.

I hate unbound chaos, and by extension Momentum, I always go Glaive Tempest. I dont want to use my mobility skill to do damage I want it for when I need to move. It would be like baking damage into Blur. Also it causes a lot of positioning issues if you slip up with it.

set bonus will be okay to use in M+ as well right?

Originally Posted by Biomega

I predict this will cause massive balance problems, and make people whine a WHOLE lot because their set bonuses aren't good enough, because they didn't get lucky with drops to get the set bonus immediately, or just because it's a Monday I guess.

I get why they're trying to bring back something from the olden days, but personally I think losing tier bonuses was a positive change, and this is a step backwards in a vain hope of appealing to people's nostalgia.

But I'm always happy to be proven wrong, of course. It won't bring me back to the game, but it might others. Who knows.

if they had been clever (which means „not lazy“) they had used that chance and had brought back tier sets, but with a more smart design. i.e. as special properties of items, for 8-10 slots. and each property brings linear power addition* till a maximum of 4. and when reaching the maximum (4 slots) you get a tiny (1-2%) passive dps bonus too, on top of it.

this would lead to following facts:

- you already get slight dps increase, before you get the full set.
- there is not that huge power difference between 4pc players and 1/2/3pc players.
- you progress steadily towards a goal.
- you have a free choice on 8-10 slots while only need 4. solves one of the classical tier set problems (fixed slots).
- its a steadily nice upgrade, wirhout being mandatory from day1.
- its capped, cause the raid loot is weekly cap. so its not a power progression system leading to grind.
- its easier to balance.

this design may have fail-design-aspects. but it has less, than original tier sets design. i pulled this out of my ass in 2minutes. think about, what blizz designers could do with brainstorming and a whole day or a whole week.

these ppl are that lazy, uninspired, careful, lame or conservative, that they are not even able to realize that big chance they have, when re introducing tier sets and the ease of coming up with a more modern, better design.

in short: these ppl are completely clueless, lazy, or stupid. i d k….

*wirh „linear power addition i mean: when the 4pc tier set bonus brings i.e a 10% flat dps increase or every 6th cast proc something special, every item adds a 2,5% chance (if wearing 4pc you have the full 10%) or every 24th (1pc), 18th (2pc), 12th (3pc) procs. etc.

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Originally Posted by sephrinx

Wow those are some of the most boring and lame set bonuses ever... Some of them are really cool and interesting, but most of them - almost all - are like, super stupid.

and thats the second problem. sadly.

Warlock set bonuses are so good

Sub rogue set bonuses are going to be insane

I'm liking Fury's a lot, if you ask me Raging Blow should have 3 charges baseline so we don't ever have to use WW on single-target anyway. Not as busted as some others but therefore less likely to be nerfed .

DK ones are also nice, the UH one is passive but the rest are cool beans.