Court of Stars Timewalking Disabled, Jan 27 Hotfixes, 10.0.7 Ret Paladin Design

As many have pointed out blade of justice should have never been added, and exorcism should have been used to fill that void. Crusader strike should proc from autoattacks via a new seal. Some utility that does not require targeting friendlies should replace part of the single target nightmare. Interesting aura-related abilities should replace signle target utility. Fun new ability to improve mobility or force opponents to move is needed. To help organization, the spec could be split into auramaster, exorcist, or sealmastery flavors.

Originally Posted by Doffen

Their DHs and DK play a lot better than the others there though. Look at the ranks.

Or what was the point of the list you linked?

I think he's trying to say that DHs are broken. And to extent, he's right. DH kit is really good on that fight, why not stack them? But there's also the fact that a lot of those grey parsers also died before P3 or something. Like most things on this forum it's numbers without context being used to provide context to a foregone conclusion which isn't necessarily earned. /shrug

I find it odd they used rogues as the peak of mobility reference and not like Dh, Evoker, or druid...

Originally Posted by Vyache

If the Ret Paladin has a poor survival rate with his bunch of saves, then what happens to the Enh shaman who has one save. To feel the full picture of the bottom, go to the soloq rating table and look at the number of gladiators 218 gladiators Ret Paladins and 42 Enh shamans, Frost Dk is even smaller lol, have you definitely decided to improve Paladins, while at least 2 specks are much worse?!

That's not how they look at it. They look at it and see that Death Knights have Unholy spec while Shamans have Elemental. So they have two other dps specs that they can swap to. Paladin has the one. Classes that have only one dps spec will get tuned quicker than one who has multiple options. Does it suck that some other specs like Frost DK / Enhance Shaman could use work too? Yeah, but as long as they have viable (other dps specs) options to swap to they get a lower priority focus until say an expansion.

I miss the days of a couple of offensive buttons to click while having blessings to buff players. Judge, CS, Divine storm/Single target finisher and one more ability. Frankly, its enough.

Its fun popping all CDs and go balls, but it doesnt last.

Then again, when have Blizzard done ret right?

I'd like to see some sort of proper gap closer for ret. Then just have blessing for freedom for a defensive movement boost (remove the pony). Would be totally up for losing some of the ranged attacks in return for those things.

Good to see ret getting some love, enhancement has a shit ton of button bloat that I would like to see pruned as well

Originally Posted by Ravenyx

I'd like to see some sort of proper gap closer for ret. Then just have blessing for freedom for a defensive movement boost (remove the pony). Would be totally up for losing some of the ranged attacks in return for those things.

They used to have, ages back, something like monk's Tiger's Lust but with holy effect to it for literally one beta cycle which lasted maaaybee a week or so.
They ditched it in favor of Steed, saying it was "immersion breaking"....

I wonder will we ever see it back...

Originally Posted by Relapses

I think he's trying to say that DHs are broken. And to extent, he's right. DH kit is really good on that fight, why not stack them? But there's also the fact that a lot of those grey parsers also died before P3 or something. Like most things on this forum it's numbers without context being used to provide context to a foregone conclusion which isn't necessarily earned. /shrug

Yeah, thats what I mean. I checked it out. Even if DH is good to stack, the actual overall stats on that fight is not making them overpowered on that fight. But I am not that into that stuff anymore so maybe there is something I don't see.

Either way, just linking something with having the numbers being skewed, its hardly any evidence.

Originally Posted by Palapop

This is the dumbest statement I've heard.

I dont care what looks "cool". Steed that pops out of nowhere def doesn't look cool. Nor do I care about spell animation.

"Forced consecration even more". Can you force something a little or too much? It's not forced. It's rewarded. And it's 1 of core paladin abilities from day 1. I'm glad its back. It just has to be rewarding.

Read again what I said about ret aura.

I'm trying to make changes which would make ret fun to play again. And not to have 1 strict way of gameplay where you have to press 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9 buttons and then you do "some dmg".


Quality > quantity/looks.

Rewarding something is prioritizing it, if it grants HP then you cast it on CD instead of just for upkeep, it turns it from a dot to a rotational ability, thats awful design, and more HP isnt even necessarily better gameplay. If it needs to be rewarded more up damage, but that will also feel like too much damage comes from enemies standing in the bad.

You dont need to compromize looks for quality thats a stupid assessment. You wanted to take the good stuff from the cool ability and give it to the ugly ability and delete the cool one, just add the good stuff to the cool one.

Magic steed does look cool your wrong.

you want ret aura giving a stronger ability than it does now, Id hate for that to be calculated into rets power budget.

If you want less buttons and more damage try consolidate damage into fewer abilities, if you throw HP onto every ability blizz has to nerf the spenders. They could do something mechanically with concecration but its fine as a pbaoe dot imo. Id hate to see it added into the rotation, id rather have another ability passively apply it to smooth things out a little.