Dragonflight Class Tuning Incoming - February 28

Originally Posted by Vyache

Nerfed 90%, up 35%, Blizzard style, relative to Enh shamans. Where is the survivability tuning?

I believe i saw patch notes stating that our defensives are being buffed as well.

Originally Posted by talmir

Lol, wtf is with your thing about betting on this. As if me not taking a random bet with some opinionated rando on a game related forum proves anything to you? No, I wont take part in a bet with your weirdo ass.

Top "5" is way small a section to make any kind of statistical sense. You're cherry picking your data and you are assuming the reasonings behind people playing warriors, or pally's for that matter. You have no clue what happens after .7, neither do I. You are assuming shit because you are emotionally invested in that whatever blizzard are doing is bad. Sure, we dont NEED buffs, but here we are. I'm sure you'll find something else to whine about when guardian druids get buffed. Whatever dude. You are cherry picking data, putting words in my mouth, making assumptions about what hasnt happened yet and use shit like "why are you not taking this bet" as a way to worm yourself to some way to mentally masturbate yourself with some weird tiny victory. I dont much enjoy talking to a brick, and you are a brick. We're done here, and no, you did not "win" this discussion, you weird little internet person.

Mhm, so if I don't know, why I can simply say that 10.0.7 will be dominated by paladin tanks right now? Oh btw this is not only my opinion just so you know, this is a very common opinion on top players and paladin players included. Only reason I even bringed up that top 5 is that is where the cutting edge is. You don't become the top tank in the world if your spec is not the best spec for the said content.

This is before the buffs even. What makes that part even more scary is that people who mained warrior and pushed and geared the said warriors relentlessly, and still only after a small tuning pass pala tanks took over them. there is 8 more paladin tanks in top 50 compared to last 2 weeks . That is absolutely bonkers when you stop and think it happened after 1 small damage tuning pass. And after the second one and a huge talent rework, you really think that you will not be the top dog by a large margin?

And you call me a brick, that is actually ironic.

Originally Posted by Thalrend

bullshit bullshit bullshit

Pala is not a #1 fotm spec lol - only has stepped in S tier and for the pull size - fucking lol. Being paladin doesn't suddenly enable impossible pulls.

This bullshiter talking about next patch like the tuning is final for it. You sound like you really know fuck all about how pala works and what talent changes have been made, yes, overall that will turn out as a buff on current tuning, but not as massive as you pretend it will be.
I wonder how you didn't also mention Brew, VDH and BDK in your resume, which is completely accurate I am sure. Also druid is in dire need of fixing, no one is arguing that, what else, will you say it's easier to time keys on your shadow priest than on your survival hunter? Some specs being shit doesn't make it right not to fix stronger spec issues.

I wishi liked playing prot paladin still. Thematically, it is my favorite tank. To me it isn't smooth, it's got like 15 cool down buttons and it isn't fun any more. I haven't enjoyed prot paladin since wod. Rip.

Originally Posted by joxur

"most dominant tanks" doing a lot of heavy lifting here

yeah, looking at +25 and up: 44% warriors, 26.5% paladins - dude is terrible at numbers, probably has something to do with that aneurysm he is having over ST buff for paladins

+20 and up bracket still below by over 10% under warriors - overall fairly healthy balance if druids got some love.

Originally Posted by erifwodahs

yeah, looking at +25 and up: 44% warriors, 26.5% paladins - dude is terrible at numbers, probably has something to do with that aneurysm he is having over ST buff for paladins

+20 and up bracket still below by over 10% under warriors - overall fairly healthy balance if druids got some love.

Yeah I am so terrible at the numbers that the paladin numbers nearly doubled in 2 weeks in+25 keys and considering with this ST buff and the upcoming change which is a net buff all around those numbers are not going to go up.

People don't stop playing their time invested characters unless there is a very obvious difference in general, at this very moment paladin tanks are better albeit very comparable to warriors, so most warriors did not rerolled. However, the best tanks are the paladin tanks, because the best tank is the paladin at this very moment. You don't become the number 1 tank rio wise if you spec is not capable of doing so, all those players are amazing players and better than you and me, so when there is 3 paladins in top 5, with a paladin tank being the number 1, buffing the spec 3 times in a row makes no sense, 1 buff 2 weeks ago, 1 buff now, 1 big buff in 2 weeks or so.

So please do tell me, you really think paladins will not be better than warriors in next pacth? I get it, you are a paladin main, you probably need the buffs to be good considering how defensive you are about the buffs, but common sense is important. As soon as 10.0.7 hits, first 100 will be mainly paladins, you might even get nuked because whenever blizzard buffs a class to high heaven with this kind of shit, they also have a tendency to nuke them back to oblivion.

Where you guys are at is amazing, you are on par if not better than warriors, why would you need any fucking buffs on top of this is beyond me. It makes no sense balancing wise and never will.

Originally Posted by Thalrend

Where you guys are at is amazing, you are on par if not better than warriors, why would you need any fucking buffs on top of this is beyond me. It makes no sense balancing wise and never will.

Spec underperforms at something - gets buffed in that particular area. You "why is this happening omg" instead of going to forums and advocating changes to weak specs. Druid tank overall needs an overhaul much more than pala needs because it straight up sucks from gameplay and performance perspective. Prot pala "rework" is a collateral and wouldn't have happened if ret was not being reworked.

Same as saying that a spec which does amazing in AoE shouldn't have at least decent ST "oh you have it good already" - no it's cringe. There should be options. Fuck all these players who instead of advocating their own class are QQing about something which isn't even out of line but is just good. If for some reason pala tank became unkillable beast doing most dmg out of all tanks - sure, call it out, but this isn't the case - they were having ST dmg issues and are overall just good - not even close to S3 BDK/Surv/Destro memes or DF S1 first few months of a warrior levels of crap - warriors have been nerfed and only now paladins are arguably at a similar to them.

Me getting my moment in the sun does not hurt you nor your class in any way.

Well it kinda does though, if they buff every tank except Bear I'll be happy for other tank players but it will still hurt my spec since it means we'll be even worse than other tanks and less likely to do harder content / get invited in PUGs.

Originally Posted by erifwodahs

Spec underperforms at something - gets buffed in that particular area. You "why is this happening omg" instead of going to forums and advocating changes to weak specs. Druid tank overall needs an overhaul much more than pala needs because it straight up sucks from gameplay and performance perspective. Prot pala "rework" is a collateral and wouldn't have happened if ret was not being reworked.

Same as saying that a spec which does amazing in AoE shouldn't have at least decent ST "oh you have it good already" - no it's cringe. There should be options. Fuck all these players who instead of advocating their own class are QQing about something which isn't even out of line but is just good. If for some reason pala tank became unkillable beast doing most dmg out of all tanks - sure, call it out, but this isn't the case - they were having ST dmg issues and are overall just good - not even close to S3 BDK/Surv/Destro memes or DF S1 first few months of a warrior levels of crap - warriors have been nerfed and only now paladins are arguably at a similar to them.

My dude, if everything of your spec is good, there is NO REASON to invite anybody else. If you got the best aoe in the game, you shouldnt have the best single target in the game at the SAME time. you can have okay single and strong aoe, you can have amazing single and DECENT aoe, but you cannot have it all.

Prot at the moment has amazing utility, yes the interrupts doesnt let you do impossible pulls, but it makes pulls much safer, so right there is a amazing pug tank since pugs are garbage at interrupts at all stages of the game, and in group content it lets you get away with bigger pulls in some situations. This is not arguable, it simply allows some pulls that is not feasible with other tanks, blood dks also lets you do that so I will give you that much.

You also have very good survival, your aoe damage is not bad by any means, your single target is the only meh thing. Why does it need a buff? You got self healing, your group healing is not bad if you can spare your holy powers to do so, you have bubble taunt, you have freedom, you got amazing interrupts. Literally the only weakness if you can even call it that apart from you have to stay in your consecration, and somehow it warrants a buff?

Why play other specs then man? When a spec is better than other spec, there is not a single reason to invite the other spec. So yeah you guys being the s tier tank does affects other specs, hence why balance is important. Vice versa applies also, if druid was this bonkers while paladin was garbage tier I would say the same thing. Because I also love playing with my alts, and if my druid is the only tank i get invited I would be annoyed with it also.

Maybe you only play one class, which might explain why you are so defensive about this, but because you are meh in one area doesnt mean your spec is broken, and it doesnt mean it needs a fixing. world highest rio tank is a paladin, and if you damage was that low that wouldnt be the case, you can say whatever you want, but unless the spec is literally good in every regard, you simply cannot do 26-27 keys.

And paladins in this position before 2 upcoming buffs, it would only open the gap even further after this. It simply makes no sense and its absurd. If this was another spec that you didn't play you would find this confusing also.

Originally Posted by Thalrend

My dude, if everything of your spec is good, there is NO REASON to invite anybody else.

And every spec should be like that. You shouldn't care if you invite a a wl a priest or a mage. Bring the player, not the class.

Originally Posted by Thalrend

You also have very good survival, your aoe damage is not bad by any means, your single target is the only meh thing. Why does it need a buff? You got self healing, your group healing is not bad if you can spare your holy powers to do so, you have bubble taunt, you have freedom, you got amazing interrupts. Literally the only weakness if you can even call it that apart from you have to stay in your consecration, and somehow it warrants a buff?

AoE dmg is probably the best of all tanks. Why it needs ST buff? Because ST is dogshit, that's literally it. Btw, bubble taunt is "bugged" it has like 20% chance to kill your melee because taunt comes after the bubble by a 100ms and if there is auto qued - they are fucked, also it doesn't work with z axis very well so it's not as perfect as it seems and if you have played pala - you 100% know.

Why play other specs? Because they are also not trash? Only bears are in the shitter now and I am all for the buffs and potential rework so I wouldn't fall asleep every time I log on my bear. It's not like prot paladins are BDKs of S3 in SL where it was probably even more broken than Warriors in first two months of DF.

I play DPS and several tank specs, pala is my main go-to because I love it thematically, but I was never for other tanks to be nerfed (except DF war S1 because shit was crazy and blanket nerf to all tanks was just a joke) I always advocate other tanks to be brought in line.

Thanks for the PvE Fury buffs

Originally Posted by erifwodahs

And every spec should be like that. You shouldn't care if you invite a a wl a priest or a mage. Bring the player, not the class.



AoE dmg is probably the best of all tanks. Why it needs ST buff? Because ST is dogshit, that's literally it. Btw, bubble taunt is "bugged" it has like 20% chance to kill your melee because taunt comes after the bubble by a 100ms and if there is auto qued - they are fucked, also it doesn't work with z axis very well so it's not as perfect as it seems and if you have played pala - you 100% know.

Why play other specs? Because they are also not trash? Only bears are in the shitter now and I am all for the buffs and potential rework so I wouldn't fall asleep every time I log on my bear. It's not like prot paladins are BDKs of S3 in SL where it was probably even more broken than Warriors in first two months of DF.

I play DPS and several tank specs, pala is my main go-to because I love it thematically, but I was never for other tanks to be nerfed (except DF war S1 because shit was crazy and blanket nerf to all tanks was just a joke) I always advocate other tanks to be brought in line.

Then your aoe needs to be toned downed a bit. Like you can't have it all man. No spec/class should have it all, I will say this, and will say it again, an S tier tank is getting 3 buffs in a row, first buff they were not s tier, so that is fine, but this one and the rework is simply to much. Balance wise makes no sense, and we know that blizzard will not bring other tanks to line period. Not in a healthy time frame. Right now this buffs will simply repeat the fact that the paladins becoming the top fucking dog and any other tank other than warrior being dogshit compared to them.

Why would you ever invite a x tank when you can invite a paladin after the rework. Single target? They will have this now, AOE? they are amazing? Utility? only blood dk compete, and that is a hard maybe. Survival? Healing?

When you make something that is good even better you simply make other specs worse. Because people compare and look for the amazing specs, leaving the fucking underperforming specs in a even worse position. Notice I didnt ask for nerfs. I simply stated that buffing prot at this time is ABSURD.

If this pacth notes include other tanks buffs and 10.0.7 include other tank buffs, not fucking %20 more armor kekw buffs but actual buffs, sure man. But right now an S tier tank is just getting buffed again and again and again. You either play a paladin or simply cannot pug keys. We will simply repeat start of DF only warriors apply bullshit but the warrior now be pink instead of brown.

Originally Posted by Thalrend

Lets goooo, buff the prot pallies more, they are totally not the most dominant tank with warrior at the moment and might even say BETTER than them. Lets go blizzard, buff them to the high seas, because Fuck guardian druids amirite? Because death knights and prot pallies were the struggling tanks, and prot pallies are TOTALLY not also going to get even better with the upcoming paladin change, so they desperately needed this damage buff.

Holy shit what did I just read man. Who is balancing this game, what is this?

How about you ask for buffs for your class and stop crying and btchng about a class you don't play. You don't seem to understand the changes either. What good does it do you to complain about one non meta tank? How does it affect your druid and its non meta position.

- - - Updated - - -

Originally Posted by Thalrend

And since you assumed what i mained when i typed in my reply what I played, I have a 2950 rio guardian, a 2900 rio paladin tank and a 2800 rio warrior tank. My 2900 rio paladin tank has MUCH MUCH MUUUUUUCH easier time on keys than my druid, even though there is a 7 i lvl difference between them.

Why is your score so similar then if it's such an OP tank? And si dominant, which means ppl invite them first, right? If you play a pala, how are you complaining about a 20% buff to smthing that does 5% of your dmg?
Pala is amazing because of utility, if your grp sucks you shine. For example, if you pull 20 mobs and your grp is retarded, they dont interrupt. If you are in guardian, oh well. If you are on pala, you interrupt. It's not pala damage that makes it shine. Do you know why warrs dominate? You say you play one so you should know, right?

And btw, there are also raids. IKR, hard to think other ppl play other stuff aside from what you play. Single target is low compared to warr for example, needed buffing.

Originally Posted by Loveliest

How about you ask for buffs for your class and stop crying and btchng about a class you don't play. You don't seem to understand the changes either. What good does it do you to complain about one non meta tank? How does it affect your druid and its non meta position.

- - - Updated - - -



Why is your score so similar then if it's such an OP tank? And si dominant, which means ppl invite them first, right? If you play a pala, how are you complaining about a 20% buff to smthing that does 5% of your dmg?
Pala is amazing because of utility, if your grp sucks you shine. For example, if you pull 20 mobs and your grp is retarded, they dont interrupt. If you are in guardian, oh well. If you are on pala, you interrupt. It's not pala damage that makes it shine. Do you know why warrs dominate? You say you play one so you should know, right?

And btw, there are also raids. IKR, hard to think other ppl play other stuff aside from what you play. Single target is low compared to warr for example, needed buffing.

Dude, if there is a dominant tank that has everything covered, people invite the said tank and only look for that tank because people want to most success in their run. So yeah if you continously buff the said op tank, the other tanks becomes less desired and IT DOES affect their chances of getting in to group, because why would you want a pile of shit when you can have a prot pala.

My score is similar because I dont actually try to push with my other tanks, they don't have good gear AND still i have easier time whenever i try to up my rio score because it is so much better than the said druid, even though i have better gear and probably play better with the said druid.

You call people clueless but considering how defensive about your "buffs" that your spec dont need one bit, maybe you are the clueless one if you think the prot pala need the said buffs for your ass to perform in a decent level eh?

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