Wrath Classic WoW Token Now Available

Originally Posted by korijenkins

Well, that's the end of Wrath Classic's legitimacy. Now just another p2w shitfest. What an embarrassment of a company.

Classic is pretty much a private server now. A private server that you have to pay 15/mo for

what a joke lmfao, absolute clownworld going on at blizz

Originally Posted by tikcol

Don't ban gold sellers/buyers, normalize gold selling/buying. Give official way to buy/sell gold. Profit.

#Blizzard

Yes, because they know that if they banned gold selling/buying then they would lose out many customers (speaking of the buyers) since the game would not be enjoyable for them anymore and those who don't buy gold would then call WoW a dead game with nobody to play with.

Originally Posted by Gunmetal-Kitten

Blizzard can't ban a bot unless the bot does bot things, and by then it's basically just clean up because the transactions have been done. How else would they even know to ban them?

it's not hard to do "/who black temple" and see thousands of unguilded players with names like Xkwndsejtn farming there 24 hours a day for weeks on end

Originally Posted by anon5123

Classic is pretty much a private server now. A private server that you have to pay 15/mo for

what a joke lmfao, absolute clownworld going on at blizz

Your post must be a joke. Especially considering the Wrath private servers, all of them are P2W af, as in, you could purchase the very best gear directly, almost all of them have a short lifespan where one day your characters are just gone, bad server stability, half of the stuff does not work etc. The most popular server even fakes their population numbers and puts up an artificial queue so that they make you buy a queue skip lol.

Some private servers (all of the popular vanilla private servers we had) who don't have a shop have also cooperated in secret with the gold sellers and all of the known server admins used to be botters, sellers etc. too in the past (or still are).

Originally Posted by Yakut

The moment you believed it was a "your kind" vs a "their kind" is the moment you lost the argument. Blizzard took this action not because of corporate greed. Yes, Blizzard is a for profit company. No, that's not a crime. If they didn't make money to pay for the infrastructure, staff, or work behind this game, you wouldn't be enjoying it in any format. So that argument is in and of itself hypocritical.

You say it's BOT because of corporate greed, but don't provide an alternative, and instead go on to defend the corporate greed. Amazing argument.

It's what I don't like about the Classics being remade
Retail has changed so much that the entire feel of the game from 10+ years ago has changed
If people want to buy tokens it's flying in the face of those round table debates about how they wanted players to experience older expansions.
Maybe they need to rethink if these remakes are a good idea. Nostalgia blurs things a bit when you've been so used to making gold then back to an expansion that made you work harder for it. It's now a classic expansion with current retail elements pointing towards the game maybe not doing that well?

oof i dont play classic @bloodwulf i wsant aware what a shame well now its getting even more big i guess

Originally Posted by Ealyssa

If you think classic players weren't already buying tons of gold you're either naive or dishonest...

This was bound to happen.
Now give LFD and stop the posturing.

Originally Posted by anon5123

it's not hard to do "/who black temple" and see thousands of unguilded players with names like Xkwndsejtn farming there 24 hours a day for weeks on end

Chasing symptoms. There's a reason you wave ban, it's the same reason why you wait on drug busts to instead raid and attempt to put down an entire distribution network at once.

Banning a few dozen accounts that are in BT one afternoon just alerts the thousands of other bots that that farming location is hot and they move back to other less trackable methods. So instead you hold off on banning, gather a bunch of data for the accounts used, who they are selling to, the signatures for the programs they are running, and then mass ban thousands of them at once.

Botting, like drugs, is an endless endeavor. There is no "lol just fix it dummy xD". Banning one method, or one account, or one program, is just going to lead to two other accounts and two other methods and two other program versions. There are always going to be more botters than devs working to solve it, because one generates money and the other costs money. There is only attempting to minimize the issue. And tokens are a good step towards that. They cut hard into the marketability of the gold selling, because most players would rather acquire the gold through straight-forward means and legitimate sources that they're not going to get banned for.

They also allow players who have less money a way to continue to play the game by just playing.

Reminder to not discuss private servers on this forum.

There's a topic adjacency here, and we understand that, but discussing names, or particulars about Private Servers is not okay. Stay clear of that.

Originally Posted by Kralljin

I'd be surprised to learn that you could get a refund on a WoW Token.
The second you buy them and put them on the AH, they're gone within minutes and you receive ingame gold.

Different countries and different credit card companies have different rules.

Originally Posted by Kralljin

That is an overly pro Blizzard view.

Blizzard isn't doing this pro bono, they're taking a sizeable cut of this, purchasing a WoW Token vs. Gametime is like how much more expensive, 33%?
Nevermind that this is also likely done with the intent that they can then cut back on costs to combat botting, as it's supposed to decline with the WoW Token (whether that actually happens, is another debate).

I don't think it's "Pro" Blizzard any more than it is "Against" Blizzard. Those are the rules when dealing with corporations. Just because they take money doesn't mean they're evil. Having worked for a few non-profits, I guarantee you they're not saints either. Taking money isn't the problem. It doesn't even matter how much of a profit they do or do not make on gold sales. That does not matter ultimately.

I know, it's a radical idea, but the concept of supply and demand is a basic staple of economics. If there was not a demand for it, they would not provide it. I guarantee you there's demand for it, even if a few forum goers would have you think otherwise. The moment it stops making a profit, Blizzard will stop doing it because there's no more demand. Until that day, it seems a futile argument to be "Pro" or "Against" Blizzard for using a basic staple of economics.

People vote with their wallet. If it's not valuable, they stop paying for it. Blizzard stops supplying it. And, yet, since introduction, people pay for it because they want it. So.. eh. Pro-economics certainly.

On top of that, thinking that without the WoW Token Blizzard couldn't support (or develop) the game is also a massive stretch, because it means that Classic has been somehow losing them money over the past years, which is just straight up false as they wouldn't have launched TBC or Wotlk to begin with.

I never made that argument, so it's probably best not to include me in a rebuttal for something I wasn't arguing.

A big part of the issue was that Blizzard has been very lax on actually banning goldbuyers.

Actually, I've had quite a few banned and confirmation from both Blizzard and the sudden disappearance of the ones I reported... tends to make me think they're not as lax as you suggest.

The rest is conjecture on your part, so I will skip the tit-for-tat.

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Originally Posted by arkanon

You say it's BOT because of corporate greed, but don't provide an alternative, and instead go on to defend the corporate greed. Amazing argument.

Repetition of a fallacy does not prove the fallacy true. I'm am not defending corporate greed because it isn't, in fact, corporate greed. People will only pay for something they want. Your argument presupposes greed because a company wants money. Well, literally every company that isn't non-profit on Earth wants money, so the argument falls at face value.

Players want the tokens, so they buy them. Blizzard supplies because players want. So.. are you proposing Blizzard should NOT provide players what they want? Or are you arguing that they shouldn't provide what players want because YOU don't want them to do so? That's pretty interesting a position you're taking there.

Originally Posted by Ssateneth

have you tried running with a guild?

I do run with a guild for my main but my guild runs its own GDKP to gear their alts and make gold at the same time. I have no need to even do GDKP runs because im a 1 spec andy. its a literal non-issue for me. But to pretend "get a guild" is a viable solution is a joke.

Most other #SomeChanges to classic have had some kind of public discussion beforehand. Nothing on this - almost as if they knew the players didn't want it.

Originally Posted by JacobMarley

Most other #SomeChanges to classic have had some kind of public discussion beforehand. Nothing on this - almost as if they knew the players didn't want it.

The players do want it though. The gold of the token wouldn't change if people didn't. Stop confusing what you want with what others want.

Originally Posted by Hitei

Is this the part where we pretend that the pre-downsized company was handling bots? What grace are you talking about here? The era where BGs were 75% bots? Legion's rampant herb botting problem? The atrocious botting issues pre-Cata?

Yeah I guess you're right there's always been a bot problem. And i'm sure there still be a bot problem on classic as retail is still full of bots to this day. So my point remains - hire some damn QA staff to monitor live servers and don't use bots as an excuse to make the game openly p2w.

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Originally Posted by munkeyinorbit

The players do want it though. The gold of the token wouldn't change if people didn't. Stop confusing what you want with what others want.

Players will always take the path of least resistance. 15 quid ($20 in US) is fuck all and a risk-free option to buy gold that you can spend to get boosted for gear is what many players will do given the option. Watch classic trade chat turn into the monstrosity that is retail trade chat. It actually got so bad blizzard had to make 2 versions of trade chat. I rest my case.

When I was still playing wrath the guild I was in ran multiple 3xSR MS/OS runs on top of our 'main group'. From these runs we geared up friends and alts and then a few of us ran GDKPs with the best of them as carries.

I can't speak for everyone, but most of the 'carrys' did not buy gold and if they did it was a once off purchase to quickly level proffs/epic flying early on. The buyers on the other hand... There's no way they weren't buying gold when even things like Grim Toll were selling for 10-15k. A Torch of Holy Fire sold one run for 30k. Last time I talked to them they were still doing this and a Comet had just gone for 200k. Their first Valanar sold for 265k.

Buying and selling gold was rampart from the get go, people running GDKPs were just cashing in on other people.

Originally Posted by Yakut

Repetition of a fallacy does not prove the fallacy true. I'm am not defending corporate greed because it isn't, in fact, corporate greed. People will only pay for something they want. Your argument presupposes greed because a company wants money. Well, literally every company that isn't non-profit on Earth wants money, so the argument falls at face value.

Players want the tokens, so they buy them. Blizzard supplies because players want. So.. are you proposing Blizzard should NOT provide players what they want? Or are you arguing that they shouldn't provide what players want because YOU don't want them to do so? That's pretty interesting a position you're taking there.

Players also DONT want the token - are you suggesting they should ignore those players? Your entire argument makes no sense at all. You say its not corporate greed, but then go on to say the main or only reason they are doing this is to make money...

You also say Blizzard SHOULD make the token because "players want it" but then acknowledge that there are players who DONT want it, but think its laughable that their opinion should be considered? If a bunch of people who play, lets say ele shaman say they want to be 20% stronger than any other spec, should they do that? I mean by your logic, there are players who want that, so why wouldnt they give the players what they want? To hell with the people who DONT want that, lets just give the players what they want!

And to be very clear, no, i do NOT think blizzard should just give the players everything they want - players can be and are very short sighted - and EXTREMELY selfish. Remember, there are players on this very forum advocating for BIS gear - as good or better than mythic raid gear, from a single world quest which only requires collecting a few flowers, repeatable daily until you have a full BIS gear set - players want it, do you support that idea? if not, why not?

Originally Posted by ZazuuPriest

I do run with a guild for my main but my guild runs its own GDKP to gear their alts and make gold at the same time. I have no need to even do GDKP runs because im a 1 spec andy. its a literal non-issue for me. But to pretend "get a guild" is a viable solution is a joke.

Soooooo... Getting a guild IS a viable solution as you have shown by your own example. Your post is confusing. Your tone is one of attack against the person you have quoted but the content of the attack is confirming the quote is true.

R u having a stroke? Call 911 (if in US).

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Originally Posted by JacobMarley

Yeah I guess you're right there's always been a bot problem. And i'm sure there still be a bot problem on classic as retail is still full of bots to this day. So my point remains - hire some damn QA staff to monitor live servers and don't use bots as an excuse to make the game openly p2w.

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Players will always take the path of least resistance. 15 quid ($20 in US) is fuck all and a risk-free option to buy gold that you can spend to get boosted for gear is what many players will do given the option. Watch classic trade chat turn into the monstrosity that is retail trade chat. It actually got so bad blizzard had to make 2 versions of trade chat. I rest my case.

Technically you are not resting your case. Your case was refuted and jn your reply you agreed with the conclusion that you were wrong. In reality you are actually changing your mind and agreeing with what I am saying. Spouting nonsense on what you think will happen now that we have a token is meaningless.

You stated people didn't want the token. I said they did and gave proof of why. With my strong argument I changed your mind and now you agreed with me.

You're Welcome.

Originally Posted by danki1337

Gold buying has been in the MMO scene ever since runescape and everquest

Before that even. I remember Dark Age of Camelot had gold traders. And then there was the early 2000s currency trades. Trading Neopoints from Neopets to GaiaOnline Gold and then to D&D Online was an easy way to make money.