Restriction on Purchase of WoW Token, WoW Hotfixes - November 17, 2023

Originally Posted by Kyanion

I haven't had to in 10 years due to D3's BMAH leaving me a tidy sum and it lasted until wow tokens. If I 'buy' a month of game time I don't think it would charge me until 2026 when my game time runs out. So I may have to contact Blizz on it, but I won't know until the 21st when this change goes live. I'm definitely in a minority of people that may run into something like this, so it's not a big deal but it does have me curious what will happen.

Don't quote me on that as I've read this a long time ago, but IIRC, game time bought with real money is processed immediately, ahead of any game time you may already have that you bought with gold.

If I find the original post, I'll update this post.

Originally Posted by Ielenia

Don't quote me on that as I've read this a long time ago, but IIRC, game time bought with real money is processed immediately, ahead of any game time you may already have that you bought with gold.

If I find the original post, I'll update this post.

Thanks that would be great if that is the case, worse case scenario I have to contact Blizz and find out what to do, but I don't expect too much trouble from it.

Originally Posted by Ielenia

You don't really understand what they mean, do you?

A veteran player most likely have spent real money to buy a month of game time at least once in seven years, so they're unaffected by this. And a new player will have to have paid real money to buy a month of game time because, as a new player, they wouldn't have the gold to buy tokens regularly.

So, what is your problem with this?

you answered you're own question. a veteran player most likely will not be affected. there are those people that have been able to afford wow just with gold since it's inception so now those people are forced into spending money for no reason when blizz is already making extra bank from their gold sub. i call things for what they are. the wow token is a stupid system that allows people to buy gear, achievements, and everything else which devalues everything in the game and even if this was to try and make the token not as used, this is only a drop in a bucket of what would need to be done and ultimately affects nothing.

dragonflight is a much better game than shadowlands but that doesn't mean i won't call out BS like this for what it is.

Originally Posted by aceperson

the wow token is a stupid system that allows people to buy gear, achievements, and everything else which devalues everything in the game

It also lets me play the game for free and buy every thing that hits the shop with my gold. I like that. Do I care if people go and buy achievements, gear and 'everything else'? Nope. Why does it matter so much? What is the difference in them just having earned millions of gold because they hit the correct lottery in the auction house or got early BoE drops and cashed in for millions and then turning around and getting gear, achievements and everything else that devalues the game? There is no difference, they are still using gold to get whatever they want. Do I know if a person earned their gold and used it or sold tokens? Nope.

All I know is I've saved like ~15 bucks a month for 6+ years, the cost of every expansion, any blizzard game/service I want which is a nice chunk of change over the years. So the token needs to stick around.

Originally Posted by aceperson

the wow token is a stupid system that allows people to buy gear, achievements, and everything else which devalues everything in the game

Yeah! Back before the token there was no way to buy gold with real money, right?!

Originally Posted by Ghostile

Yeah! Back before the token there was no way to buy gold with real money, right?!

There's a large difference between buying gold before and after the WoW token. The WoW token legitimized the practice of indirect RMT, providing a safe and easy method to do so... while allowing Blizz to get a cut of the profits, of course. Before the WoW token, it was always a risk doing RMT for gold, as you could risk your account and/or your financial information. Risk involved with such activities is actually a deterrent for many people; you'll always have people gamble the risk, but it will reduce how many people will attempt the illegal activity. Making a formerly bannable, risky offense into a safe and easy activity will just make it more rampant. In essence, they gave up trying to solve a problem while simulatenously trying monetize the problem for themselves, consequences of doing so be damned.

Originally Posted by exochaft

There's a large difference between buying gold before and after the WoW token. The WoW token legitimized the practice of RMT, providing a safe and easy method to do so... while allowing Blizz to get a cut of the profits, of course. Before the WoW token, it was always a risk doing RMT for gold, as you could risk your account and/or your financial information. Making a formerly bannable offensive safe and easy will just make it more rampant. In essence, they gave up trying to solve a problem while simulatenously trying monetize the problem for themselves, consequences of doing so be damned.

The thing is, there is no solving it. By figuring out a waterproof solution you could become the next most famous person on mmo market.

With the token they can cut into the shady market of hacked accounts botting for gold by providing a "clean" source of gold for cash.

Originally Posted by Kyanion

All I know is I've saved like ~15 bucks a month for 6+ years, the cost of every expansion, any blizzard game/service I want which is a nice chunk of change over the years. So the token needs to stick around.

They could still have the WoW token do that, you'd just have to make it one-way: convert gold into B.net balance or game time. Heck, I don't think anyone would complain about that, as it would reward people for their investment in the game The main issue with the WoW token is the reverse process of spending real money for gold. No one would (or should) complain if you use your gold to get carries or buy gear or whatever; it's an in-game currency, that's what it's there for. However, being able to buy it is a completely different story. While I could get into all the rammifications of such a system, that'd be an insanely long post... but rather I should say that people's increasing need and desire to buy their way through content and gear is just a symptom of a much larger problem with the game. In the grand scheme of things, the WoW token is a problem in its current state, but it's indirect RMT isn't the largest problem with the game as is. The larger problem is that more and more people don't want to actually play the game and would rather pay someone else to do it for them; again, can't remove this problem, but you could reverse the trend.

Tied with my previous statements, Blizz would rather profit off of problems or treating symptoms rather than fixing the core problems of the game.

Originally Posted by exochaft

They could still have the WoW token do that, you'd just have to make it one-way: convert gold into B.net balance or game time. Heck, I don't think anyone would complain about that, as it would reward people for their investment in the game The main issue with the WoW token is the reverse process of spending real money for gold. No one would (or should) complain if you use your gold to get carries or buy gear or whatever; it's an in-game currency, that's what it's there for. However, being able to buy it is a completely different story. While I could get into all the rammifications of such a system, that'd be an insanely long post... but rather I should say that people's increasing need and desire to buy their way through content and gear is just a symptom of a much larger problem with the game. In the grand scheme of things, the WoW token is a problem in its current state, but it's indirect RMT isn't the largest problem with the game as is. The larger problem is that more and more people don't want to actually play the game and would rather pay someone else to do it for them; again, can't remove this problem, but you could reverse the trend.

Tied with my previous statements, Blizz would rather profit off of problems or treating symptoms rather than fixing the core problems of the game.

So you think RMT and boosting, something that have always existed, will always exist, in every game is something that can be fixed?

Like I said earlier, figuring that out would make you a superstar in the industry.

Originally Posted by Ghostile

The thing is, there is no solving it. By figuring out a waterproof solution you could become the next most famous person on mmo market.

With the token they can cut into the shady market of hacked accounts botting for gold by providing a "clean" source of gold for cash.

You're missing the point: of course there's no waterproof solution, but there's a difference between discouraging the core activity versus encouraging AND profiting off of it. Removing risk of an activity will increase the number of participants, as risk is what keeps people from engaging in risky activity. Now, if this activity had no negative effects on the game, we wouldn't be having this discussion... but unfortunately it does. Heck, this is coming from someone who never paid for anything Blizz related after the WoW token was introduced, but I never used real money to buy a token. The thing is that the game would've been fine if the WoW token was just a gold dump to get people more gametime for B.net balance, but it's not.

Originally Posted by Ghostile

So you think RMT and boosting, something that have always existed, will always exist, in every game is something that can be fixed?

Like I said earlier, figuring that out would make you a superstar in the industry.

Again, please read my responses properly: I never said you can't fix it completely. If you aren't going to be honest in your responses, please be respectful and don't bother replying and wasting people's time.

Originally Posted by exochaft

You're missing the point: of course there's no waterproof solution, but there's a difference between discouraging the core activity versus encouraging AND profiting off of it. Removing risk of an activity will increase the number of participants, as risk is what keeps people from engaging in risky activity. Now, if this activity had no negative effects on the game, we wouldn't be having this discussion... but unfortunately it does. Heck, this is coming from someone who never paid for anything Blizz related after the WoW token was introduced, but I never used real money to buy a token. The thing is that the game would've been fine if the WoW token was just a gold dump to get people more gametime for B.net balance, but it's not.

Whats the negative effect tho?
Everything can be easily afforded without buying a token, even boosts.


There was always a risk to it and people still bought gold, that doesn't work and there is no known solution for it besides offering an alternative, safe way to buy clean gold.

Without a token those who can burn a few accounts to launder the gold are free to buy as much as they want while the guys without are left without an option.

Originally Posted by exochaft

Now, if this activity had no negative effects on the game, we wouldn't be having this discussion... but unfortunately it does.

To be honest, I've seen exactly zero negative effects on the game since the token was introduced, only positive. I no longer get spammed with gold selling mails/whispers/guild invites like I did back in Cata and MoP, that alone is worth whatever impacts you consider to be negative to the game.

Originally Posted by Kathranis

That's gotta be a pretty limited number of players at this point, right? I know WoD got a few people to the gold cap, but how many people have accumulated enough gold to keep rocking with WoW Tokens for six years straight? I'm assuming that means they probably bought Legion and all of the subsequent expansion upgrades with Tokens too.

It's not as limited as you think it is. I've often ran into M+ / Raiders (Dedicated players, essentially) who've still been playing off the massive gold grind from WoD to this day. It's probably in the tens of thousands easily, which I'm going to guess a major amount aren't actually bots. This is probably to hard-cut bots off from being able to use the gold for tokens. But TBH if the account has a shit ton of gold I don't think the hackers who have access to the account are going to not pay $15 to get access to what is probably worth hundreds if not thousands of $ translated from the gold being held on that account. It seems like another Token measure of making botters give Blizzard money for doing dirty deeds lmao.

And then there are those who haven't paid anything in years to play the game. Blizzard probably wanted a bit of moolah in compensation for basically playing the game for free all these years.

Originally Posted by Ermelloth

It's a huge slap in the face for players from Russia who can't pay for WoW sub cause of sanctions. These kept playing only by farming gold and buying tokens

this can ONLY be a good thing for the community as a whole imo

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Originally Posted by Djuntas

Now lower the token price as well...We know you adjust it Blizzard, its not a free marked.

which ehd? the price we pay blizzard for it or the amount of gold we get form selling it? i want to assume the former but i want to check we are on same page here

Originally Posted by aceperson

you answered you're own question. a veteran player most likely will not be affected. there are those people that have been able to afford wow just with gold since it's inception so now those people are forced into spending money for no reason when blizz is already making extra bank from their gold sub. i call things for what they are. the wow token is a stupid system that allows people to buy gear, achievements, and everything else which devalues everything in the game and even if this was to try and make the token not as used, this is only a drop in a bucket of what would need to be done and ultimately affects nothing.

dragonflight is a much better game than shadowlands but that doesn't mean i won't call out BS like this for what it is.

Except it's not for "no reason". They literally stated the reason. You not accepting it does not mean there's no reason. On top of that, having to pay fifteen bucks once every seven years is basically immaterial. If you're complaining that you have to pay the subscription fee with real money once every half a decade, you might have more pressing problems than having to pay for WoW.

Originally Posted by Jaggler

Yeah, tough luck I'd say.
They could help get trid of Putin to get rid of the sanctions

Why would they?
Why would you wish ruin upon Russia over some petty sanctions which don't even work?

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Originally Posted by Ermelloth

Our guild has players from both Ukraine and Russia, politics is strictly forbidden to discuss in guild chat and, as far as I know (from few conversations I've had with some people) those of Russian part absolutely despise the regime and are against the war. Also, big part of them live in EU countries since. However, I know that there are some that are still inside Russia and indeed struggle with payments to Blizzard.

You should also know that a large part of younger people from big Russian cities (Moscow and especially St. Petersburg) oppose the government.

Why oppose Russian government and why bring politics into gaming?
That is not to say that those who oppose Russian government are usually traitorous people.

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Originally Posted by AudibleEscalation

Of course they are. Are you seriously trying to argue that Russian WoW players should somehow be exempt from being ... Russians?

I'd rather argue if True™ Western Democracies™ should sanction video game players.

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Originally Posted by Julmara

no it isnt many russians dont give a shit and deserve to be kicked out
should just straight up cut all internet lines leading to russia they only spew out garbage onto the rest of the world anyway
russians that complain outside of russia and sopread propaganda and stuff get send back to the hell they came from

Sounds like conentration camps.
Y'know who else suggested concentration camps, right?

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Originally Posted by Likagan

Quick questions: how does giving money to blizzard (which is American company) helps Russian economy and can you see a difference between 2022 (year when sanctions were applied) and 2017?
I am genuinely surprised how many people instantly turned to throwing political comments without critically thinking first. And the overall attitude "people of X country should suffer" reminds me of a certain person who became famous due to his actions back in 1940s. Yet you guys call Russians brainwashed by propaganda, huh.

I delight in the irony.

Originally Posted by PgStckr

Why would they?
Why would you wish ruin upon Russia over some petty sanctions which don't even work?

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Why oppose Russian government and why bring politics into gaming?
That is not to say that those who oppose Russian government are usually traitorous people.

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I'd rather argue if True™ Western Democracies™ should sanction video game players.

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Sounds like conentration camps.
Y'know who else suggested concentration camps, right?

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I delight in the irony.

There's something funny about everytime the sanctions being mentioned, a new russian account arrives to let us know they definitely don't work.

Originally Posted by Ghostile

There's something funny about everytime the sanctions being mentioned, a new russian account arrives to let us know they definitely don't work.

I can only speak for myself. I'm not feeling them, much. Nor do I care, at all. Netflix doesnt want my money? Raise the flag. Apple doesnt want my money? Ill just use yandexmusic/vkmusic
Steam doesnt want my money? Ill just have some quality Atomic Heart time.
Still, it's funny how the theme of sanctions rips masks off off those hostile to Russia, on that we can agree.

Originally Posted by PgStckr

I can only speak for myself. I'm not feeling them, much. Nor do I care, at all. Netflix doesnt want my money? Raise the flag. Apple doesnt want my money? Ill just use yandexmusic/vkmusic
Steam doesnt want my money? Ill just have some quality Atomic Heart time.
Still, it's funny how the theme of sanctions rips masks off off those hostile to Russia, on that we can agree.

Gee I wonder why people are hostile towards the country that broadcasted genocidal suggestions on their national tv, lol.

Originally Posted by Ghostile

Gee I wonder why people are hostile towards the country that broadcasted genocidal suggestions on their national tv, lol.

Oh, I agree that people should be more openly hostile towards israel and it's active genocide of Palestine.

I like this bit especially:

In the 2023 conflict, the call by Israeli Defense Minister Yoav Gallant for a "complete siege" and the sentiment that: "We are fighting human animals and we will act accordingly", has been called out as expressing genocidal intent