The War Within: Dungeon and Affix Updates
Originally Posted by Blizzard (Blue Tracker / Official Forums)
Greetings!

With The War Within beta now underway, we are excited to share additional updates regarding dungeons and the affix system.

Heroic & Mythic Dungeons

In Dragonflight Season 4, we experimented with our existing dungeon difficulty progression to offer additional endgame options for players who enjoy more methodical dungeon gameplay. This updated dungeon difficulty progression is also an opportunity for players that do enjoy Mythic Keystones to have a place to build mastery over dungeons before the pressures of a timer kick in. You can read more about those changes in depth here. We plan to continue this model of progression into The War Within with some exciting updates!

  • Normal
    • This difficulty is unchanged.
    • This difficulty always includes our 8 War Within dungeons.
  • Heroic
    • The tuning and rewards of this difficulty are increasing to be equivalent to a baseline Mythic (Mythic 0) dungeon in the previous system.
    • New mechanics and other adjustments from Mythic will not be present in this difficulty.
    • This remains a queueable experience.
    • Starting with Season 1 of The War Within, Heroic dungeon difficulty will feature our roster of seasonal dungeons.
  • Mythic
    • The tuning and rewards of this difficulty are increasing to the equivalent of a +10 dungeon with affixes in the previous system.
    • There are no timers, affixes, or limitations on changing specializations or talents while in the dungeon.
    • The goal is to create a mega-dungeon like difficulty for this experience. This difficulty should present a meaningful challenge and provide commensurate rewards without the pressure of the Mythic+ system.
    • Starting with Season 1 of The War Within, Mythic difficulty will feature our roster of seasonal dungeons.
    • Mythic difficulty will be unavailable until with the War Within Season 1 begins.
    • Mythic difficulty will now have a daily lockout, changed from weekly in the previous system.

The seasonal dungeon roster for Heroic, Mythic, and Mythic+ difficulties in Season 1 of The War Within includes the following dungeons:

  • The Stonevault
  • The Dawnbreaker
  • Ara-Kara, City of Echoes
  • City of Threads
  • Grim Batol
  • The Necrotic Wake
  • Mists of Tirna Scithe
  • Siege of Boralus

Mythic+

The Mythic Keystone system will carry forward changes from Dragonflight Season 4 with updates to the position of affixes in the system and updated affix buckets.

  • The Mythic+ system will have rewards up to level 10, with +2 starting from what would have been a +11 in the previous Mythic+ system.
  • A +5 should be as hard as a +15 and +10 should be as hard as a +20 in the previous Mythic+ system etc.
  • We intend to better align reward and difficulty increases in the Mythic+ system by updating the introduction points of affixes in Season 1 of The War Within.
    • +2 - Fortified/Tyrannical
    • +4 - A new set of passive affixes
    • +7 - Bursting / Bolstering etc.
  • Dungeon ratings should be equivalent to what they represent in the current system.
  • There should be a smaller range of Keystone levels to find groups for, and more meaningful progression between each level.

Affixes

Before we dive into the specifics of the new affixes, we would like to outline our goals and the purpose these affixes serve. Our overarching goal is to minimize the mechanical overlap between affixes and dungeon trash design in the current +4 affix bucket. We aim to achieve this through a more passive approach, focusing on the following objectives:

  • Shift the source of challenge to the dungeon itself by simplifying affix design and emphasizing creature abilities.
  • Reduce visual noise, nameplate clutter, and the cognitive load on players during trash combat.
  • Allow for varied and context-specific gameplay decisions depending on the dungeon they are applied to.

Additionally, these affixes will include a positive effect. The aim of these positive effects is to highlight different damage types each week, allowing each specialization additional opportunities to excel during the season.

  • These effects should feel like a bonus, offering an advantage for different damage profiles each week without being essential to complete a dungeon.
  • Players will have an opportunity to flex towards different talents, gearing options, and consumables to capitalize on these effects.

New Affixes

  • Reckless
    • Non-boss enemies without mana ignore 20% armor with their attacks, but their armor is reduced by 30% and they take 10% increased Arcane damage.
  • Thorned
    • Non-boss enemies without mana inflict Physical damage to their attackers when attacked, but take 10% increased Holy and Shadow damage.
  • Attuned
    • Non-boss enemies with mana inflict 20% increased magic damage, but take 10% increased Nature damage and 30% increased damage from Bleed effects.
  • Focused
    • Non-boss enemies with mana have 30% increased Haste, but take 10% increased Frost and Fire damage.

Note that these tooltips indicate whether the affixes apply to creatures with or without mana. These affixes will not affect every creature.

With our new passive affix bucket set to replace the current +4 affix bucket, the following affixes will be retired for Season 1 of The War Within:

  • Afflicted
  • Incorporeal
  • Entangling
  • Storming
  • Volcanic

To match the number of affixes in our level 4 affix bucket and align with our affix goals in The War Within we will be retiring the Spiteful affix for Season 1 of The War Within. The +7 affix bucket includes the following:

  • Raging
  • Bolstering
  • Bursting
  • Sanguine

Tyrannical and Fortified Affixes

We are still experimenting with how these affixes fit in with our updates.

We believe these changes will offer a refreshing experience for players at all levels each season and redefine how the Mythic+ affix system influences dungeon gameplay. We look forward to your feedback and discussions on these topics and we’ll see you in dungeons!
This article was originally published in forum thread: The War Within: Dungeon and Affix Updates started by Lumy View original post
Comments 80 Comments
  1. Nereidaa's Avatar
    Sounds good on paper, will have to try it to really gauge it. I like that M+ difficulty now won't be a joke for the first dozen levels.
  1. Elbob's Avatar
    uhhh i like that the new ones are kiss/curse but im concerned about things like fortified casters doing 20% extra damage or having 30% haste. Worried that like 1 missed kick is sudden doom. Especially with raging still around meaning they can't be stunned at some low hp. Obviously it can be fixed with decent group coordination but its just a bit more than average compared to current dungeons.

    edit a friend mentioned the thorns potentially might be giga toxic for DW melee or rapid/multihitting abilities but i would assume if thats overtuned it will get fixed quick.
  1. Foolicious's Avatar
    As long as incorporeal and afflicted are gone im happy.

    Anyone want to place bets when the first spec is nerfed after "their" week in m+?
  1. Malrune's Avatar
    Well, now I have an excuse to need roll on elemental damage trinkets that aren't an upgrade.
  1. Trifande's Avatar
    Are these new affixes just a general ban on DPS warriors?
  1. Fitsu's Avatar
    Blizzard remind me of the guy on a bike meme, pulling a pole through the wheel. Talking about how they want to move difficulty to the dungeon itself but are finding it hard while having to balance around affixes or how it's hard to balance around Tyranical/Fortified.

    Like what are we talking about here? You make the game. You can just remove affixes if you think there causing more problems than there solving. Most people don't even like affixes, the most enjoyable M+ weeks are when you get affixes you can all but ignore.

    All affixes do is cause FOMO around needing to push during good weeks, and all these new affixes will do is double down on that FOMO as you'll need to push during the times that the most meta classes will have their damage buffed.
  1. Polgara's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Elbob View Post
    uhhh i like that the new ones are kiss/curse but im concerned about things like fortified casters doing 20% extra damage or having 30% haste. Worried that like 1 missed kick is sudden doom. Especially with raging still around meaning they can't be stunned at some low hp. Obviously it can be fixed with decent group coordination but its just a bit more than average compared to current dungeons.

    edit a friend mentioned the thorns potentially might be giga toxic for DW melee or rapid/multihitting abilities but i would assume if thats overtuned it will get fixed quick.
    Give it an ICD so it only procs once every 1s and it'll balance itself, it won't favour energy classes since they'll average it going off every second but otherwise speedy boi rogues are going to melt themselves. . .

    I think the kiss and curse feature needs to be more robust; if the target has thorns, they should take more melee damage (if everything has elemental now that might make it hard, but that's a self-inflicted problem), essentially if something makes X harder for Y, Y should also benefit. Thorned will hurt feral druids, but they take more holy and shadow damage? Kiss and curse is missing the point if it hurts a certain group and that group also gets no benefit. Thorned could take 30% increased bleed damage and holy damage, instead of attuned having that, give attuned a magic vulnerability. Focused+raging looks toxic on fortified weeks if it occurs.

    I like the idea, but it seems it needs a bit of a rethink in some parts, but the foundation seems okay. Fortified weeks will probably be ass though.
  1. Relapses's Avatar
    This seems to be Blizzard's angle for dealing with a regimented meta by making certain specs better on certain weeks. Interesting in concept but I think all this will really do is create multiple meta comps which shift weekly and greatly favor multiclassing. This will (probably) continue to favor organized group play while making PuGing even worse. (It's already bad.) The fact that they're keeping Bolstering also just... yeah. I get the idea from a top down developer standpoint but this will probably suck big time for the average WoW player.
  1. Aurrora's Avatar
    These affixes are horrible, stop making ones that promote stacking certain classes.
  1. Gatsu's Avatar
    What's the point in damage bonuses for certain classes based on the week? It's not a mechanic, it's not a skill, it's just awful game design... Do those devs even play their own game?
  1. Elbob's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Polgara View Post
    Give it an ICD so it only procs once every 1s and it'll balance itself, it won't favour energy classes since they'll average it going off every second but otherwise speedy boi rogues are going to melt themselves. . .

    I think the kiss and curse feature needs to be more robust; if the target has thorns, they should take more melee damage (if everything has elemental now that might make it hard, but that's a self-inflicted problem), essentially if something makes X harder for Y, Y should also benefit. Thorned will hurt feral druids, but they take more holy and shadow damage? Kiss and curse is missing the point if it hurts a certain group and that group also gets no benefit. Thorned could take 30% increased bleed damage and holy damage, instead of attuned having that, give attuned a magic vulnerability. Focused+raging looks toxic on fortified weeks if it occurs.

    I like the idea, but it seems it needs a bit of a rethink in some parts, but the foundation seems okay. Fortified weeks will probably be ass though.
    the kiss is trying to also make grps bring varying comps to shake the meta around during the season. Most grps will benefit from atleast a little of the damage amp. The extra phys week is obviously easy to cover and the hardest probably extra holy/shadow(didnt do the math so feel free to correct if you did)
  1. Plehnard's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Foolicious View Post
    As long as incorporeal and afflicted are gone im happy.
    Yeah, this is the best news we had. As a warrior I hated both with absolute passion.
  1. Mysterymask's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Trifande View Post
    Are these new affixes just a general ban on DPS warriors?
    Mountain Thane deals nature damage, Reckless reduces armor by 30%, and there is the one that increases bleed damage.
  1. leothar's Avatar
    We wanted less affixes, not this cringe at +7. Just delete all the +7 affixes.
  1. Relapses's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by leothar View Post
    We wanted less affixes, not this cringe at +7. Just delete all the +7 affixes.
    Players: We hate Sanguine, Bolstering, Bursting and Raging

    Blizzard: We hear your feedback loud and clear and have added more weeks with these Affixes!
  1. justwatching's Avatar
    Really glad they are keeping the changes. The PvE side needed a meaningful 5 Man experience that isnt Speedrunning.
  1. Eapoe's Avatar
    So Reckless weeks will be stack warriors and hunters, Thorned will be priests and pallys, Attuned stack your Druids and Arms warriors, and Focused whichever mage spec is best at that time?
    Meanwhile, we have caster mobs getting their own personal lust (could be very bad if there are mobs like in BRH and RLP that already get stacking cast speed effects), extra magic damage (sounds great on bolstering/non Tyr weeks), with Thorned and Reckless sounding like non issues (depending on how much damage attackers take).
  1. LordVargK's Avatar
    Wtf.
    Why these spell school requirements? Granted, for me as a casual player that part will probably be ignored, but still I must ask what is the point?
    Here are multiple problems:
    1. You piss of semi-high level players who push keys for high scores, since each week another class will be Meta, which in Theory would be good if you had the time to play multiple classes to rotate each week. Which many players don't.
    2. If players don't play multiple chars, they don't interact with this system at all.
    3. Worst case (unlikely): Some classes only get invites every 4 weeks.

    So, in general this provides no upside. If Blizzard wants a kiss/curse system, why not use the ones tested in SL or BfA? Make dungeon harder, but give buffs to players. Doesn't have to be as much like in SL, but, idk, have an effect that reads:
    "After killing a non-elite mob without mana gain 5%mana/10% runspeed/5% primary/crit/etc for 15 seconds. Doesn't stack but buff extends when killing multiple enemies"

    I get why this system is implemented: To require healers to concentrate on healing. It's just not a good kiss/curse system. It would even be better without a kiss, since in this form the kiss is actually a curse in the group finder.
  1. Holdodlig's Avatar
    These changes are bad in my opinion. Those affixes will only make group building more complicated for nothing. I mean, they should know how their community work. If those 10% damages have a true impact and shift the meta each week, it's going to be a nightmare to play during these weeks. Also the +20% increased magic damage isn't going to scale well with affixes, believe me.

    Also, how will it work with classes who have different type of damage such as shaman with fire / nature or paladin with phys / fire / holy ?

    Plus thorn on mobs ? Come on Blizzard. It's one of the worst experience on Diablo and you bring it here ? How delightful it's going to be for tanks and healer if the thorn damages makes a difference.

    And why the hell are we going backward with affixes impacting the dungeon experience ? Can't they just stop doing affixes that just add aoe and have meaningful stuff like we had with seasonnal affixes ?

    It seems like dungeons will really have to carry this S1. If they're average, it's going to be a shitshow. So far, I really dislike their direction on affixes.
  1. FelPlague's Avatar
    These changes are just all awful lol
    M+ is my go to thing and has been "eh" but fine, this is just so bad though.

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