Actions Taken to Curb Griefing by Repeatedly Leaving Groups

I read this as:

We slapped these people on the wrists because we can't come up with a proper punishment or system for this kind of thing"

Originally Posted by deathsreaper

People will just now ninja log when key is going to fail.

If they can track people who intentionally leave, I'd imagine it's just as easy to track people who disconnect then never come back. If anything, I'd be surprised if this wasn't already an actionable offense.

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Originally Posted by SinR

I read this as:

We slapped these people on the wrists because we can't come up with a proper punishment or system for this kind of thing"

Any "system" created to curb this type of abuse can and will be abused by players. As an example, if Blizzard were to make it impossible to leave a key until a majority of players agree to deplete then it will inadvertently encourage bad-intentioned people to "soft quit" keys by playing poorly to ensure that the key is depleted. Imo, that's a much worse position to be in then now where every once and awhile you get an asshat who bricks a key and leaves.

Originally Posted by Relapses

If they can track people who intentionally leave, I'd imagine it's just as easy to track people who disconnect then never come back. If anything, I'd be surprised if this wasn't already an actionable offense.

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Any "system" created to curb this type of abuse can and will be abused by players. As an example, if Blizzard were to make it impossible to leave a key until a majority of players agree to deplete then it will inadvertently encourage bad-intentioned people to "soft quit" keys by playing poorly to ensure that the key is depleted. Imo, that's a much worse position to be in then now where every once and awhile you get an asshat who bricks a key and leaves.

I'm convinced this is a made up problem outside of a small number of people who probably do just grief or maybe this just happens in super low keys or something. I pugged my way to season title twice last expansion had weeks to start every season getting something like 90-100 keys done for gearing and the vast vast majority of groups go well and nobody leaves from start of season to end. Blizzard probably just realized they could score some easy points by announcing the banning of a few toxic individuals. I've never seen this happen often enough though to justify an entire system being built for it

Although I will say that people are more likely to leave if the person making the group doesn't use a bit of common sense geared towards making a successful group. If you just really suck or the people you invite do it will obviously lead to more people quitting mid key so maybe the massive complaints about this are rooted somewhere with players who just aren't very good and maybe don't realize that they're part of the problem

Originally Posted by SinR

I read this as:

We slapped these people on the wrists because we can't come up with a proper punishment or system for this kind of thing"

If anyone had they would probably use that one.

Well, they do bad things. Deserter in LFD is also worsened. Prior to that we had 15min deserter for leaving immediately. You weren't getting it, if party killed at least 1 boss. But now it's 30min deserter for leaving at any moment. Even before last boss. This is insane. Overall idea was - "If player doesn't want to waste time - he would do it anyway". I.e. if average dungeon takes 5 minutes - then leaving early would cause 15min deserter. And now it's pure penalty. Because 30min is much longer, than average dungeon time. If tank or healer leaves - it means no tank or healer in queue for next 30 minutes. And it makes queues longer. Much longer. 15 minutes. 20 minutes.

And problem is - devs should be blamed for it too. If they make game, that has MMO genre, where players have to rely on others to complete content - then it's devs' responsibility to provide players to play with. If party is terribly bad, why should I carry it? Timewalking is trivial enough. Not being able to complete it - is insane. Yesterday I had exactly such party. 75lvl tank with bad scaling. 45lvl healer without heirlooms, suffering from lack of upgrades. Shaman pulling what we shouldn't pull. Tank dying everywhere. Even on ordinal packs, like satyr pack after water elemental boss, accidentally (or not) pulled by shaman. Shaman pulling pack on satyr boss. May be accidentally. May be he suffered from tab target being broken in several recent xpacks. May be not. And then we couldn't kill last boss for 3 times. Because first tank couldn't catch all trash. Then shaman pulled that trash via jumping way too far or even pulling it intentionally. I left after 3 attempts to kill last boss. Because in this situation it would have been difficult to pick any player to blame him for our faults. Whole party was terrible. And got 30min deserter anyway.

Yeah, long queues in LFD are induced by 2 categories of players: 1) Noobs, who try to complete quests, like if it would be ordinal leveling dungeon 2) Bad players, who wipe several times. May be Blizzard should at least do something with first category? Remove quests and unnecessary bosses from Timewalking for example?

The funniest thing - deserter means nothing for altoholic. Especially when you just farm badges, so it doesn't really matter, on what character you do it.

Finally..wanted that for years now. But the main issue for me personally how can you tell if that player is indeed toxic leaver? Or had some real life issues or simply didnt want to waste his time because of the group being super duper bad and underperforming? Hard to tell tbh

Good games have progressive "non participation" penalties. 10 seconds penalty for first time. 1 minute for second. Etc. Things happen. Bad RNG assembles terrible party. Players can't be blamed for it. Devs should be, cuz they don't have any "matchmaking", that would make sure, that bad tank should always get good healer or DPS. If they leave for first time within 5 weeks - nothing bad should happen. I don't know, why it's so difficult for Blizzard. 30min deserter - is what kills all desire to play this game. And removes healers and tanks from queue, while players already struggling. This only makes things worse.

Lot of accidental pulls and aoes hitting the wrong packs so other people leave first about to happen

"Shit my bad didn't think that aoe would keep hitting that"

"My brother made this aoe macro for me idk why it keeps acting up"

"Ahh dog sorry my (insert xyz spell) was at mousover not on focus and my mouse was in Africa"

Chat logs gonna look so innocent and if others leave first puts frustration, squeaky clean

Originally Posted by prwraith

Lot of accidental pulls and aoes hitting the wrong packs so other people leave first about to happen

That's literally called griefing and already punishable so go right ahead lol

Originally Posted by Biomega

Interesting.

I've always wondered if Blizzard could realistically police this kind of behavior in any kind of meaningful way - maybe they can? It'd be the right way to go about it, the only problem with it is feasibility, really. We'll have to wait and see if this actually makes a dent or if it's just a marketing stunt where they reassure everyone the Bad Man has been sufficiently chastised while nothing really changes in the broad average.

They have full info and control on their game. They can really do just about anything. It's just a matter of "are they willing to spend the resources to do it".

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Originally Posted by Relapses

If they can track people who intentionally leave, I'd imagine it's just as easy to track people who disconnect then never come back. If anything, I'd be surprised if this wasn't already an actionable offense.

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Any "system" created to curb this type of abuse can and will be abused by players. As an example, if Blizzard were to make it impossible to leave a key until a majority of players agree to deplete then it will inadvertently encourage bad-intentioned people to "soft quit" keys by playing poorly to ensure that the key is depleted. Imo, that's a much worse position to be in then now where every once and awhile you get an asshat who bricks a key and leaves.

Yes, but it's also a matter of habit. I don't imagine this was taken against people who left a couple of runs but against the frustrated bunch who leave all the time because stars aren't aligned or leave just because.

Originally Posted by kranur

They have full info and control on their game. They can really do just about anything. It's just a matter of "are they willing to spend the resources to do it".

That's what I mean by "realistically" and "feasibility". It's not about whether it's possible - only about whether it's doable.

Nice....a new system for players to abuse... we all know the in game report system is automated ( Please, countless videos show it is ) i was banned until the 10th from the new classic realms for having a civil discussion in trade chat. Opened a ticket, got some bullshit auto reply, opened another ticket, got threated by Blizz saying if i do it again its actionable... lol, players can and will report others for not having the same views and ideas. i can see it now, not going to time a key, someone simply says "lets call it" others disagree. the others report him after. meanwhile its 15mins past timer.

Bottomline, people WILL abuse this. like everything else,

The important note here is 'intentionally left Mythic+ groups a great many times'.
This is most likely not aimed to people who leave a run a couple of times a week, but for people spam-leaving runs on purpose for grieving reasons.

I'd guess that means X number of times per day / per hour or whatever. This is not banning that random dude who is fed up by the 2nd wipe on the first boss.
So for all those who start /w leavers "Ha I HoPe YoU GeT BanNeD", this is not a banwave for those people.

Nonetheless, it's a good move by blizzard to punish grievers.

Originally Posted by Aggressive

Don't get me wrong, I know WoW is full of dickheads now. But are people really joining M+ keys just to leave and grief players. Like damn who has free time like that. I log on to have fun...but not that type of fun where I am griefing players.

probably not that, but there would be a lot of players in the "one wipe and I'm out" category, which is who this is targeting.

Originally Posted by Neotart

Nice....a new system for players to abuse... we all know the in game report system is automated ( Please, countless videos show it is ) i was banned until the 10th from the new classic realms for having a civil discussion in trade chat. Opened a ticket, got some bullshit auto reply, opened another ticket, got threated by Blizz saying if i do it again its actionable... lol, players can and will report others for not having the same views and ideas. i can see it now, not going to time a key, someone simply says "lets call it" others disagree. the others report him after. meanwhile its 15mins past timer.

Bottomline, people WILL abuse this. like everything else,

It's not from reports though- it's from excessively leaving M+ groups.

People worried about this likely are the ones that deserve suspensions for it, because clearly the only data they are going off is players excessively leaving runs, which yes they can easily track and it's a good thing they're finally willing to do so.

So please tell us how other players are going to "abuse" blizzard tracking you excessively leaving groups lol. Some of you guys just love to write fantasy novels.

i think if you leave a +14 the expectation is your only doing it for IO but if you leave a 10 when its clearly finishable and people want vault thats very griefy hopefully they can differentiate between the two

Originally Posted by Tech614

It's not from reports though- it's from excessively leaving M+ groups.

People worried about this likely are the ones that deserve suspensions for it, because clearly the only data they are going off is players excessively leaving runs, which yes they can easily track and it's a good thing they're finally willing to do so.

So please tell us how other players are going to "abuse" blizzard tracking you excessively leaving groups lol. Some of you guys just love to write fantasy novels.

Where does it say any of that? are you just assuming? "Some of you guys just love to write fantasy novels." speaking from experience ? lol


Blizzard didnt list its source for collecting this info, if you we're to assume anything, its from player reports.

Originally Posted by MrLachyG

so I guess they can tell the difference between players who leave and players who got kicked?

Blizzard knows everything, literaly

So were thry temporarily banned, or just blocked from playing M+?

Originally Posted by Ereb

That's literally called griefing and already punishable so go right ahead lol

You have a strangely high level of faith in blizzard